Teras Kasi Archive
Thread: Razor Knuckler/alternate knuckler discussion thread.
Sovi-FFO
Tue Jul 27, 2004 12:27 pm
#40
Swordsman do infact do more damage per hit, but without speed tapes (i think they have around +75 speed but i would have to check) You arent going to be hitting the speed cap with a 5.0-6.0 hammer any time soon
Sovi-FFO
Tue Jul 27, 2004 12:34 pm
#41
Oh, and as for the stun and mitigation thing.. in order for a stun baton to be really viable in PVP it has to have a rather high min damage to counter mitigation... since the unarmed damage mod damage range is so close (around240-250)WITHOUT a weapon on. Your making someone who worked very hard on that acklay stun baton cry nerf. Now add on the damage of the weapon itself (say around normal unsliced VK stats 50-153 and your just making it worse.
Now, back when they introduced mitigation one of the cries of nerf was to make mitigation work properly on TKAs
Since other professions got the full or close to 60% max damage reduction.. but since TKAs had that damage mod.. We had only 6-10% of the total mitigation to worry about
Sovi-FFO
Tue Jul 27, 2004 12:37 pm
#42
Spuzzed wrote:
Turrets and other structures are vunerable toblast damage and thedamage output of a swordsman is greaterthana TKA.
EXACTLY... the structures are VULNERABLE meaning AP does NOT come into effect So.. would you rather have a TKM doing upwards of 3k damage per second. or 5k damage every 3 seconds?
Message Edited by Sovi-FFO on 07-27-2004 12:44 AM
Utess
Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:49 pm
#43
A few comments:
First, we really shouldn't push for a damage type that another melee profession already has. Unless they plan on adding other damage types to the other melee professions, it is part of what makes us unique as meleers.
Second, while we can certainly complain and ask to not have a motor dropped by Min be a requirement for a weapon, we really don't have any right to think that simply because of our needs it should change. Pike users have been in the same boat for months to get their special weapon. They can't damage Min either and their weapon requires not only a schematic dropped from her, but 2 identical motors instead of our single one. I am certain pike users would be happy if we got our component from elsewhere though, as it is going to make things even worse for them. Just keep in perspective that Pike users have had it worse than we will have, and nothing has changed for them =/
Third, when thinking about how hard it will be to obtain these motors, now add this into the mix: On TC, NPCs are now, once again, using their specials and changing weapons. That means all those nightsisters will now be using their force powers and will be that much tougher to defeat.
Fourth, for those who never have seen what the RKs can do, I can tell you they were pulled because on TC we were able to do insane amounts of damage with them. I agree that the main arguements *against* the RKs are that many mobs are still 100% resistant to heat, and that heat is well protected against by armor. When arguing your point, I would focus solely on the fact that many mobs are 100% heat resistant. Keep in mind that when we do get this weapon again, it will be when the balance happens. That means armor is getting nerfed and the ham/buff systems are being changed, so the PvP arguement will probably be fairly moot.
All that said, I think we really have 3 options with a new VK in order to keep it fair to other professions but still enhance ours:
- Heat damage
- Cold damage
- Acid damage
- An AP2 Kinetic, Heat, Cold, or Acid damage weapon.
My personal preference?
I would ask that the RKs be changed to an AP1 Acid or Cold damage weapon with the same damage range as our regular VKs and simply require a dropped schematic and a dropped motor from something other than Night Sisters. For those that might argue that Acid damage from a melee weapon is silly, remember this is star wars and fiction, I'm sure they could make up something as an excuse(like an acid tank built into the handle that drips acid from the blade 
)
)My second choice would be an "enhanced" VK that is identical to the one we already have only AP2. Sure we would still be forced to use kinetic, but that makes us unique and AP2 would certainly help.
Message Edited by Utess on 07-27-2004 05:52 PM
Shinjo_Kanzaki
Tue Jul 27, 2004 10:38 pm
#44
Spuzzed wrote:
The devs have said that the Razor Knucklers will be back with the Combat Revamp, but that doesnt mean that they cannot be changed based on what we want them to be. My biggest beef with the new knuckler isnt the damage type, rather its the items that you need to make them. They require killing an NPC with 100% kinetic resistances which to me basically means that the TKA cant get the items they need to make their own weapon.
Heat damage is also comparable to kinetic damage in terms of how many people and mobs resist that damage type. Dont get me wrong. Im very excited for this new weapon to add to my arsenal. Id just like to see some minor changes dont to it.
That problem put aside I would like to hold a discussion on what youd like the new knuckler to be. If youve read about the Combat Revamp youll know that stun damage will not be the end all be all of damage types in PvP anymore. Also what kind of DoT, AP, wound %. Things like that, that youd like to see in a knuckler.
My ideal knuckler would deal electric damage. The basis for electric damage would be an item that charges the blade that on contact would deliver an electric shock to the target. It would be AP0 and have no DoT.
A clost second would be a poison tipped knuckler that did acid damage. This knuckler would deal an action pool DoT be AP0 and have a moderate wound percentage chance.
the nightsister energy lance was also near impossible to get as a pikeman. the mob spawns once a day and she's 100% resistant to any damage a pikeman can do, save energy and that requires an energy lance.the end result of camping a mob that spawns once a day is a weapon with light AP,subpar damage range, and2 mediocre dots.it does make a nice nightlight everytime you shuttle in though 
Feyne
Fri Jul 30, 2004 4:29 am
#45
I think that Vks with either heat, cold or acid damage woudl be funky.
If only to offer us an alternative to kinetic damage. I am not saying that they shoudl be amazinly powerful. They shoudl only have the same damage stats that we have now. IMO we need the option of dealin more than one damage type. One other would be fine.
Feyne
Fri Jul 30, 2004 4:32 am
#46
Can someone give em a link to the Combat Revamp post mentioned at the start of this thread?
Iawo
Fri Jul 30, 2004 5:30 am
#47
As a person fairly new to TKA (2 1 3 2 right now) I'd vote for Cold. Being the the Triple Master is a fairly common template, Heat and acid are redundant for anybody with pistoleer. Never see anybody using a cold damage weapon though. There is a cold damage pistol, but every single one I've seen has very low damage.
If they need an excuse for a cold damage with TKA, you could just say the the pure attack speed of the TKM creates a wind that does the cold damage. Or something to that effect...
Iawo
Fri Jul 30, 2004 5:31 am
#48
Also, maybe the red ribbons could be changed to blue when the cold damage knuckler is equipped.
Sovi-FFO
Fri Jul 30, 2004 2:22 pm
#49
Huh? Theres a cold damage pistol? Only cold damage weapon I remeber is a rifle
Iawo
Sat Jul 31, 2004 5:02 am
#50
Pretty sure I saw one on a loot vendor. Checked my certs, and it's a fairly low cert weapon ifI remember right... somewhere on the marksman tree. Maybe I was just a confused noob... but I swear I saw one. Damage was really pathetic though.
Co-valent
Sat Jul 31, 2004 6:28 am
#51
Iawo wrote:
Pretty sure I saw one on a loot vendor. Checked my certs, and it's a fairly low cert weapon ifI remember right... somewhere on the marksman tree. Maybe I was just a confused noob... but I swear I saw one. Damage was really pathetic though.
No, there definately isn't a cold damage pistol. The only Cold Damage weapons are the SG Rifle and Proton Grenades, atm.
Moricky
Sat Jul 31, 2004 10:08 am
#52
i think they should tone the weapon down a lil and introduce combat proffession quests. from the quest you get a schematic and WS can make you the new knuckler/gloves. like the swordsman has the quest for the scythe, i feel there should be different knucklers. and the schematics should be randomly handed out, and the uber nasty ones are the rarest. or somthing along those lines, with the new crafting quests i think combat guys should have equal quests.