Teras Kasi Archive
Thread: So is TKM overpowered ( a comparison for the Nerf criers)
Jason629 wrote:
I think TKM is perfect as is, and i've tried other professions (my last master combat profession was rifle).
The great thing about TKM is that I really have to think about how I enter combat. Sure, we have great upsides, but we have to keep the following in mind:
- I can't take on ranged opponents, and if I've got someone on top of me and someone else farther out, I'm in trouble
- I can't fight Nightsisters, and will never touch a Peko Peko albatross
- I can heal my own wounds and states, but not during combat - sometimes need to get lucky during a fight
In general - we need a strategy to play this profession, and having to think about it is what makes TKM fun for me. Not having profession-specific tactics makes for dull gameplay. (rifleman was also good in this sense, with cover, conceal shot, etc).
I can't take on anything in the game - so I'm not sure where the overpowered beef comes from.
You can't fight Nightsisters? I solo them with my TKM. I've done 2 at a time. I couldn't even HOPE to do one with my MBH.
All I use is some decent Comp armor and can do Nightsisters WITHOUT VK's.
TKM takes NO strategy to play. At least not PVE grinding. I go into a squill cave, get 10 on me, spam spin. BAM! 50k Unarmed XP
Only reason I stop at 10 to get is my comp lags BAD and acts like it might crash if I do more.
Now I haven't done much PvP with my TKM yet. But I can tell you I've been bludgeoned BY a TKM as my MBH.
All I see TKM's do in PvP is, intimidate, knockdown 2, dizzy if needed, Unarmed attack 3 x 100 times
WOAH that taxed my strategy! Your finger bleeding yet?
Those that are saying your not overpowered, grind out MBH, or PLAY as a Carbineer.
Try those on for size, then cry and run back to your TKM. You'll see the cozy overpowered couch that it is.
Sorry guys. I'm a TKM too. But I've been on the other side of the fence, and can see that it IS as bad as other profs cry.
When you have TKM's saying they own Jedi, you don't think that's a bit much?
I understand your stance. You don't want to get hit by the nerf bat. Noone does. You don't think the devs have ways of tracking how much damage per second the average char of a given class does? Or how much xp on average a give char does in a given ammount of time. Or how many fanboys flock to a profesion suddenly? Everyone sees that 30% of the servers population are TKM.
They see these things folks. They know. Guess who they were referring to when they said that they'll put in a whole new "specials" bar so you can't just spam one attack repeatedly? I'm wearing out my F11 key because of UASpin2.
This game is going to change, quite drastically when the Combat Rebirth or whatever we're calling it this week comes about.
It'll be fun for those who enjoy the challenge of learning a new system, and who don't mind not being able to solo Nightsisters and Enraged Rancor LAIRS. But for the rest, the l33t, the UB3R ones, they'll cry.
Luse
Sunrunner
TKM, FS
That's the danger of profession envy. If your profession sucks you get bitter and start wanting to drag other professions down with you. Get over that, get involved in the community for your profession, and give your input to try to make your profession better.
Atama wrote:
If TKM is so strong against Jedi (which I think is overexaggerated), then you need to wonder what is wrong with Jedi since other professions don't have as much trouble fighting a TKM.
ok...as for tkm vs jedi...
tkm or fencer have it easiest...
jedi is a melee class that given the bases skills need to fight (something saber trees) you get no melee def...so you get hit all the time. saber block *ONLY* blocks ranged...not melee. now you also have super high acc mods...now whatever pitiful melee def the jedi has is next to worthless. not to mention jedi dont get any state def mods in saber. so ALL melees stand a chance at hitting and doing damage to jedis.
what sets TKM apart from the rest is what some1 else said...our high toughness...which btw there is debate as to whether saber toughness effects melee damage or not (from personal xp...it doesnt seem too) so tkm naturally take off over HALF jedi damage. throw in synth and you drop the damage further. same with LS Psg's. oh and cant forget intim...blind...stun...
and for once our lack of different damage types dont hurt us...since jedi dont wear 80-90% kin resist armor. so when a tkm hits you...you notice...just like that fencer when they swing their dam ackley gaffis...or swords and their ackley ph's...
im sry but a Swordsman with a 700-800max PH will drop a jedi faster than tkm will...same with fencers and ackley gaffi's (had one hit me for 800damage in pvp)
so unless the jedi has picked up some defender trees (which none of the pub9 FotM crowd did) fencers are a melee class with no defenses
so what do you suppose happens when you match up something with no def that has to get in range to do damge with something that has any kind of defenses and will always be in range to hit you????
and that rant beside....
ranged can still take us...since the only def we have naturally is saber block...and if you can get your acc upto 200 or so...that blocking gets cut in half (ie real BH templates ...BH/carb...BH/pistol) and the last thing a jedi needs is a fire dot on him.
and unlike ANY other class...jedi have a very finite pool to draw ALL their active skills/specials from...its not like we can buff up and not have to worry about specials costs....
it all comes down to the players...yes things will be lopsided...but even with all that...you can still win...who ever knows their strenghts/weaknesses better...and their opponents will win.
ive fought tkms as jedi...ive fought fencers as jedi...ive fought defense stacker tanks tagging along on gank squads as jedi...every single time ive won or lost...but ive had the best fights ingame ever...i fought the last tkm for over 20mins before one of us screwed up and lost...
/endrant
**sry atama...not a rant at you...just a rant at the whole melee(tkm) vs jedi bs thats still floating around...ppl need to learn not just their prof but the rest better before they b!tch...**
Message Edited by ShadowoftheVoid on 11-29-2004 05:50 AM
Message Edited by ShadowoftheVoid on 11-29-2004 05:50 AM
Lusiphur69 wrote:
Jason629 wrote:
I think TKM is perfect as is, and i've tried other professions (my last master combat profession was rifle).
The great thing about TKM is that I really have to think about how I enter combat. Sure, we have great upsides, but we have to keep the following in mind:
- I can't take on ranged opponents, and if I've got someone on top of me and someone else farther out, I'm in trouble
- I can't fight Nightsisters, and will never touch a Peko Peko albatross
- I can heal my own wounds and states, but not during combat - sometimes need to get lucky during a fight
In general - we need a strategy to play this profession, and having to think about it is what makes TKM fun for me. Not having profession-specific tactics makes for dull gameplay. (rifleman was also good in this sense, with cover, conceal shot, etc).
I can't take on anything in the game - so I'm not sure where the overpowered beef comes from.
You can't fight Nightsisters? I solo them with my TKM. I've done 2 at a time. I couldn't even HOPE to do one with my MBH. (?? my MBH friend was killing them faster than it took me to get close enough to attack...in fact my MBH friend was killling stuff faster than me in all cases)
All I use is some decent Comp armor and can do Nightsisters WITHOUT VK's. (good for you...any elite prof can do that in comp armor and using their weapons...just means you know how to use some specials)
TKM takes NO strategy to play. At least not PVE grinding. (whats this grinding you speak of? thought you were master? oh must mean FS...of course not...if you were grinding on soemthing that need tacticals it wouldnt be time economical to grind on...now would it?)I go into a squill cave, get 10 on me, spam spin. BAM! 50k Unarmed XP (oh good...i can do that too)
Only reason I stop at 10 to get is my comp lags BAD and acts like it might crash if I do more.
Now I haven't done much PvP with my TKM yet. But I can tell you I've been bludgeoned BY a TKM as my MBH.
All I see TKM's do in PvP is, intimidate, knockdown 2, dizzy if needed, Unarmed attack 3 x 100 times
WOAH that taxed my strategy! Your finger bleeding yet? (so...if you're a MBH why didnt you use some of those nifty carbine specials to knock them down? then stood off and blasted them? a cpl torso shots to get them burning..then shoot them up? wow strategy...also if they're not using lunge1 in there...they're obviously new to pvp...since some nice kd food and they cant kd you...so kd2 does them no good...same goes for not using blind and stun...you have a carbine that will fullauto drops multiple states from range...the tkm shouldnt make it too you.)
Those that are saying your not overpowered, grind out MBH, or PLAY as a Carbineer( i did...thought it was one of the best ones in the game...only prof in the game that can drop every state on you at 64m in 1 attack, kd an AREA at 64m...and keep you flopping at 64m from dizzy...not to mention it has the highest damage mods in the game at 7x on burstshot2...in fact i think the lowest is x3...so i think lack of defenses and high hams (that are negated by buffs anyways) is a small price to pay). EX: Mokk missions with Carbineer friend/ me tkm: mission was over by the time i got off my bike and ran to where the lair was...he hopped off bike and several burstshot2's later...i was left running back to my bike as he got back on and took off for the next mission
Try those on for size, then cry and run back to your TKM. You'll see the cozy overpowered couch that it is.
Sorry guys. I'm a TKM too. But I've been on the other side of the fence, and can see that it IS as bad as other profs cry.
When you have TKM's saying they own Jedi, you don't think that's a bit much? (yes i do...but its the jedi choice to pick no defenses...and to some extent SOE for how they divided the skills up with pub9...but its not worth crying about. a decent player can still go toe to toe with tkm and still win and vice versa)
I understand your stance. You don't want to get hit by the nerf bat. Noone does. You don't think the devs have ways of tracking how much damage per second the average char of a given class does? Or how much xp on average a give char does in a given ammount of time. Or how many fanboys flock to a profesion suddenly? Everyone sees that 30% of the servers population are TKM. (maybe cause tk is the most not broken? most balanced)
They see these things folks. They know. Guess who they were referring to when they said that they'll put in a whole new "specials" bar so you can't just spam one attack repeatedly? I'm wearing out my F11 key because of UASpin2. (actually i drop mobs faster by doing intim/kd2/stun/UH3...then goto the next one)
This game is going to change, quite drastically when the Combat Rebirth or whatever we're calling it this week comes about.
It'll be fun for those who enjoy the challenge of learning a new system, and who don't mind not being able to solo Nightsisters and Enraged Rancor LAIRS. But for the rest, the l33t, the UB3R ones, they'll cry. (ppl are already crying...tahts why were getting the combat <insert current surname>...and we should be able to do somethings solo...i shouldnt be forced to do everything in group...and at the same time i should have things that require groups and others that ARE doable solo (like kill the sith shadow groups last phase) but can use a group to make it easier.
Luse
Sunrunner
TKM, FS
Message Edited by SuiRyu on 11-29-2004 09:32 AM
"im sry but a Swordsman with a 700-800max PH will drop a jedi faster than tkm will...same with fencers and ackley gaffi's (had one hit me for 800damage in pvp)"
That's why I was saying it's not that a TKM is overpowered. I bet a Pikeman with a really powerful DOT pike can beat down a Jedi faster than a TKM as well.
Atama wrote:
"im sry but a Swordsman with a 700-800max PH will drop a jedi faster than tkm will...same with fencers and ackley gaffi's (had one hit me for 800damage in pvp)"
That's why I was saying it's not that a TKM is overpowered. I bet a Pikeman with a really powerful DOT pike can beat down a Jedi faster than a TKM as well.
jbuttrill wrote:
Atama wrote:
"im sry but a Swordsman with a 700-800max PH will drop a jedi faster than tkm will...same with fencers and ackley gaffi's (had one hit me for 800damage in pvp)"
That's why I was saying it's not that a TKM is overpowered. I bet a Pikeman with a really powerful DOT pike can beat down a Jedi faster than a TKM as well.
I will have to second this. Proffessions arent really over powered its the weapons, armor, and buffs. get hit with a pikemans INSANE poison, fire, and disease or a rifleman's mind shot 3 and then reevaluate if we are over powered. We are right where we should be.
Can we keep dots out of this? i know that they are prevalent but they do not gauge the abilities of a class. Except maybe master brawler. I have seen some pretty wicked dot vk btw. Riflemen are a different story 
But rifleman (and all ranged) recieved a huge nerf now that jedi are in every battle.
A tkm with a 350 (/w p up) vk has a dmg output towards jedi that is comaprable to your given examples. Granted it is very hard to come by but if your comparing high end like this you have to include the perfect NS vk in the equation. Hell, TKM's natural dmg with a good regular dmg slice is even with a fencers 500 max gaffi.
"Luke, a Jedit Knight at the time went up against ONE rancor, and only beat it by using a dirty trick."
Luke had no weapons and no unarmed combat training. The fact that he could even defeat one rancor was a testament to his cleverness and the power of the Force.