Teras Kasi Archive
Thread: My goodbye to TKM
Sorry to see you go High...I've read your posts and have had some great discussions with you on these boards...Good luck with Rifleman...and if ya ever see me running toward you in a PvP battle, do me a favor...at least let me ALMOST get there before you MindShot the heck out of me...Makes me think I accomplished something...
A couple of people in my guild are given up Smuggler to get Rifleman, after seeing one rip apart a Bantha...so I completely understand. 
Stop saying idiotic bs like "ummm rocket launcher do more dmg in real life" well no **edit**, but this is a game and the devs have a responsibilite to balance all combat classes.
Now elite elite combat clases liek commando and bh can be allowed to surpass the standard combat classes fencer pikeman tka, swordsman, pistoleer, carbineer, and riflesman, by maybe 20% max effectivness.
But the point is if a tka target runs we cant hit them, lunge is nerfed be can't stop them, if we catch them we can't hold them kd is nerfed.
So despite our speed and power we land a hit every 25 sec while burining stim b's chasing a pistoleer or as i found out a rifle man runing away with a t21 shooting over his shoulder on the run at 20 m realitivly close range and hiting 9 out of 10 shots, with some mind shots thrown in so there goes my stim pack ability.
Finaly scor i land three hits for 600, he land 14 hits for 2400 dmg, bascialy a rifleman on the run at close range was faster and stronge sounds wrong to me???
And Malibu returns with yet another poorly thought out andmis-aimed reply:
The fact of the matter is, most players aren't bothered that we don't have a ranged attack or that we don't get 5000% movement speed, that's not why we chose the profession. Most players are irked by the fact that IN range we have no real advantages, due strongly to latency issues. Obviously, latency goes alot deeper than the devs will ever bother with, so the next best thing is provide us with abilities that take into account latency.(Formerly known as lunge)
Yay! Unlike the rest of the internet junkies, you are gifted with the ability to insult someone. That must mean your opinion is better! I'd like to thank you for illustrating my vain attempts at communication to everyone else so that we can all share in my misfortunes. Surely they would not have come to that conclusion without your assistance.
I have stated that my only problem with the game mechanics is the very issue you mentioned: client/server lag. You don't need to preach it to me like it is something I am overlooking.
What I see however, and what my previous post was challenging, is people suggesting work-arounds that game them near-invincible status. People don't want to run faster to catch up to someone to make up for the lag because that doesn't change the fact that the client/server lag still exists. Once people close the distance, they need to be able to maintain melee range, I agree with that. But making it easier to close that distance, for example, it trying to give them the upper hand in every situation, rather than using smarter tactics.
Perhaps if you wanted to be taken more seriously, and not as a whiner, you should change your signature, which reinforces your negative attitude with every post. Just a suggestion.
"A good example of this is the argument that, because we have no ranged attacks inherent in the class, we should be able to run faster than them, get in range to hit them before they can kill us, and then have 100% success rate of killing them once in range. This translates to: We should win every fight, no exceptions."
Actually to be fair and honest, which I am sure is what you meant to be, the main argument has been to give a speed modification or something against someone wearing full armor while firing a weapon with near perfect accuracy over their shoulder and running at equal speed to an unarmored, unarmed opponent. And once catching them have a chance of actually hitting them. This translates to: We would like a little balance, no exceptions.
Hey Bread!
Sorry to hear that you are ditching the TK class, but i do understand everything you have posted because im (and others) are in the same boat...obviously when you look at the TK forums you are not alone. I right now am a TK Expert - 1/2/4/2, and i am having some real issues with PvP and PvE as well.Youre right in every post you have put here. Just the other day i chased a Rebel that came into Bestineout into the desert, I threw a lunge at him (hekneeled and got right backup before i coulddo anything else tohim) then icaught up to him again andtossed a nice KD at him (again just got back up and started running). If it wasn't for another overt imp that was behind me i would have died becausehe would have just kept running andshooting me over his shoulder.I did notice a post that says the programmer was going to give us again another boost to our damage, but im not sure how that is going to help us if we can't stand toe to toe with these ranged characters? Again i saw another post from i think Holo that said "If we catch up to them then we should be able to take them out" or something like that? Well i don't know about that if they just keep running? I don't want to quit being a TK but there doesn't seem to be much else we can do at the moment? Mabye in a few weeks things will get better (I hope). Anyway don't let these posters bother you, they obivously don't understand what is happening with our class.I especially can't understand some posts by TKM that say we things are good and yadda yadda yadda because they are not! Mabye when you become a TKM things will get better but i doubt that seeing as you are quitting.
Anyway take is easy,
Sneeze Dragoon - Tarq
Teras Kesi Expert
CH Novice
Master Baiter
hes not goin to fight for the vietnamese....I will say this: I agree with the following comments by Malibu, 100%:
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"Classes will never be accepted as 'balanced' by all players because most players players do not want balance. They want to win. They will come up with any excuse to modify the 'reality' of the game in order to achieve their goal of winning.
It just isn't a reasonable goal. If we all had stick figures who punched each other, people would spend money on better hardware and connection speeds so that they had an advantage. There is no end to it, and I am pretty sure the developers know this. That is why I say that players are the worst people to talk to when it comes to class balance."
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While player feedback is necessary, players are a very poor litmus test for a game's balance. Aside from the Test Center players, general public player input, while valuable as an indicator and direction to look, are most certainly a poor source of balance issues. Tactics, for starters, have a huge impact. The fights you choose make a big difference. Other times, you just get ganked by a better player, no matter how hard you tried, and no matter howsneaky you were -better players do win more often, you know, which is also hard for people to get a grip on.
Brawlers may indeed be at a disadvantage - balance issues or no - but that's kind of a given when everybody around you is carrying a blaster. You're right to say that the devs are obliged to make each class viable, but true balance is the last thing anybody wants. WhatEVERY combat classreally wants - NEEDS - is a unique way to win - and NOT the same way as anybody else. Every class should play differently, and certain matchups are and should be predictable. All things being equal, I should be at a serious disadvantage in a duel (using duel for this example, comparing 1 on 1 with no outside influences), if I'm playing a Master TKA against a Master BH. Assuming we're both extremely canny players, he should be able to drop me if I'm dumb enough to stand out in the open and challenge him. That's just the way it is.
However, I do agree with Bread and those that have said TKA need to be viable as exactly what they are - melee fighters. IF, in that same analogy above, I'm the Master TKA and I'm good enough to get in close (again, this is an inherently flawed analogy, because if that Master BH is a smart one, he'll never let me), I should be able to clean his clock before he can whip out a second clip. Thus, given *equal skill on both sides, by both players,*a Bounty Hunter should always beat a TKA in any duel. Period. The Teras Kasi has no way to close in, and that's pretty reasonable.
Of course, things aren't ever equal, and there's a great deal more gray than either black or white. So getting back to the actual game,a good TKA shouldbecapable ofbeating a BH if he's the better player. I don't know if this is currently the reality of the game or not. A good BH should always beat a dumb TKA, and should usually beat a good TKA. On the flip side, if the TKA can somehow manage to get in close, either through sneaky tactics or guild (NOT dueling), the TKA should be the clear victor, regardless of the BH's skill. By then, it's too late for him!
All that aside, I don't pvpmuch, but what I'm arguing is logical and reasonable for everybody. I'm not asking for a specific abused as hell tactic to be returned (KD spam), nor am I asking for a way to close the distance to attack ranged fighters - such an ability would put ranged characters at the opposite disadvantage, as the Melee fighter would get the upper hand in the ranged fighter's arena - distance. Oh, sure, the ranged guy could get a couple good hits off, but once you get close, he'd be toast. If a melee fighter gets close to a ranged fighter, the ranged guy should be packing in his bags - so giving melee guys a way to do that with regularity is not fair. Their is a medium in the middle, and I think it requires new abilities and additions, not nerfing one side to match another. I don't want BALANCE - I want strategy, and I want to be rewarded for my victory, not just spoon-fed a 50/50 chance in any 1 on 1 conflict. True balance would bore us all to tears. I think the devs are trying to do what I've suggested, but, of course, it's a work in progress - and likely will continue to be for a long, long time. Making a game completely balanced is easy - making each facet unique, without ganking or spamming or tactic abuse... now that's hard, and that's what I think the devs are trying to do. Do, or do not, my friends- because there isn't,and never will be, truebalance.
If you pvp exclusively, you need to find the class that works for you. Some people suck as melee fighters. Some of the guys here kick ass, which means something may be wrong with your tactics - I know, nobody wants to say so, and some of you are frustrated as hell - probably with good reason, because the TKA dynamic in the game isn't hammered down yet - but, for that matter, none of the others are, either. Some of you kick ass at range, others can't kill aplayer at 50m with Master Pistoleer before getting shot in the back with a Flamethrower. Point is, if something's not working for you now, come back to it later - maybe it will be different. This game is a 100% dynamic environment, and will never be the same from one day to the next. Abused strategies should be axed - as soon as they catch on, everybody uses them, and poof - adios former working dynamic, hello all new problems.
I guess I'm trying to say... I agree with both sides, in different ways. A dynamic game will never be balanced - but all classes should be able to do what they're supposed to... which does NOT necessarily translate into perfect balance. It's an equilibrium that's still being felt out.
Butto thosepeople saying that TKA isn't working well in pve - you've got to be kidding me? Are you trying to fight the most mammoth things you can? I'm a measly 0-1-2-1 TKA, and I'm an extremely potent pve member of any party. If you're sucking at pve... you need to seriously think about what you're fighting and what you're doing to win. ~J
One more thing - brawler classes will inevitably be harder to play. We'll take more than our fair share of licks, because our professions are much harder to play. That's just the way it is, and that's the way it should be - brawlers using sound tactics andstealth will win a lot - more than their fair share - but we're professions that can't just run around popping off shots. We're harder toplay, and we'll never play like the marksmen. Play smarter, not harder. That's what the devs need to work for - thesmart brawler's viability. Dumb brawlers are gonna get owned, regardless. We need the smart brawlers to be able torock the house - some of us here claim to do so,others say they can't. This debate won't end. Just experiment, and if it doesn't work for you, move on. It's just that simple. ~J
Now that was an objective and coherent post, and I find no fault in any of it.
Malibu)
First off, my signature is obviously a joke, you can't even break the HAM cap to incap yourself. Get over it, and think of a valid argument against me.
All you've done thus far is repeat your bias against me, and shown an obvious inability to respond to basic logical concepts, andinstead revert to reiterating over and over that my points are invalid because they are negative. So? Negativity doesn't, and never will change the validity of a post. You are coming off as more of a pseudo-intellect than anything else, as you've shown no true signs of maturity or intelligence.
Secondly, fact of the matter is we *CAN* compensate for latency issues, to an extent, by leading our opponent. Unfortunately leading is almost impossible since we match speeds with our opponent, as such a speed advantage WOULD allow us to, somewhat, compensate for latency issues.
Additionally, currently there is *no* chance that we can clear a distance of even 30m without being slain. Objects don't work, due to pets being able to shoot/warp through them. Even through a full suit of composite+MK3 a rifleman can two shot a fully buffed/spiced/food-buffed TKA before he moves even 5m. 30m's is, in all fairness, a large distance, but not even half of the full range. Asking for the ability to traverse even short-ranges before being downed is not whining.
If you can't add anything to the conversation, then keep your mouth shut. You can call me a whiner until the sky falls if you'd like, but until you can prove yourself more than an immature kid who flames every negative post, it won't hold water.
Omegaplex)
Test center players are just players who hit the button labeled "test center" on the launchpad, they aren't some elite, high-tier group of players.
Admittedly, every PvP profession should have their own "niche" in which they have an advantage. The problem is that ours doesn't exist, we are at just as much of an 'out of range' disadvantage in melee as we are when we are actually out of range.
Because you're a lower tier TKA, I'm assuming you haven't truly delved into PvE. For example, krayte dragons. Kraytes auto-target melee characters because we're closest, and kill/slay us in a single hit. Additionally, pets tank MUCH better than we do in a PvE atmosphere.
On your last PvP post, as of now there are enough workarounds to make it literally impossible to lose to a TKA. For every smart TKA there is a smart marksman, and the marksman always comes out on top. I enjoy a challenge, I don't want to go around capping low-strength players in bestine forever, and I enjoy playing with the big boys, except I'm not really viable in that situation.