Teras Kasi Archive
Thread: tka versus real martial arts
JWlaxplyr7
Fri Jun 11, 2004 10:24 pm
#27
SLapjack i feel really bad for you, youve tricked yourself into believing that by devoting your life to martial art you somehow can become a fighting god, that could take on 10 people all armed with weapons and not get a scratch, this is VERY far from the truth, if you dont believe me aska general or military man "excuse me sir, but why do we use M-4's and M-16's instead of just teaching all military personnel a martial art?" he will laugh at you. If you dont believe me ask a retired navy seal what hes killed more people with, an M-4 or his fists i wonder what hell say? Also about those points that can kill you in one hit, most of them dont work, yet again if you dont believe me watch UFC those are the best fighters in the world, the people who use Karate and martial arts get DESTROYED by grapplers. What im trying to say is that SWG is a game, unarmed against an armed opponent in real life is suicide, i dont care how good in your art you are if someone has a pistol, you do what they say no amount of martial art will save you. TKM is a class, in a videogame, they are based on fiction, just like the entire galaxy.
Paraone
Sat Jun 12, 2004 9:02 am
#29
slapjack you make valid points in your post, but one thing you should know is that 'martial arts' are about teaching you the means to use what you have.
ie
a martial artist can break bricks due to conditioning and form.
when you repeat the same task time and time again (as your probably notice in your art) it becomes second nature. Hence if I practice a parry time and time again then most likely when someone comes to strike me I can parry without thinking. What does that mean?
It means that each form of martial art has strengths and weakness's,we haveself-defense, physical art, spiritual and even sport/tournamentstyle martial arts.If a 'master' of northern shaolin takes on a 'master' of taekwondo, soft vs hard, which will win...? Neither because they are both master? No one will win for sure, northern shaolin may win and cause less pain to themself and even their opponent. Taekwondo may win, and cause more pain to himself and most definetly his oppenent. So take the winner and put him against another master and see what happens, he may lose now.
Also master's are NOT unbeatable...take a master of lets say judo or whatever you choose, and now make a bruce lee movie with 30 bad guys and have them attack. Unfortunately it won't be like the movies with attacker A coming first, then attacker B, then C. It will be abcdefg at once. You can't defend that. The master will have a better chance and may come out somewhat unarmed, but he won't jet li or bruce lee them. (to bad cuz those are great movies)
One thing my sensai taught me was that you won't be a movie star, you will still be beat and you can never truly be a 'master'.
Now why have i wasted my finger strength typing all this?
Well the game has done a decent job with TKA in my opinion. It seems more like a blend of styles all in one (as i would suspect a tkm would really be, a 'master' of many disciplines). They mediate (ok so Tai Chi Chuan, Hsing-i, etc), they have power techniques (Taekwondo, Karate, Krav Maga, Musti Yudha, etc.), they havekd/dizzy/stuff ( judo's, aikido etc)...hell they even through in some fun looking kung-fu stuff.
If these TKM's could challenge a jedi and keep them in check then I would suspect they would be experienced in many forms and be able to draw on the strengths of each.
So long un-educated story made short. I disagree with you to a point, but not completely. You say things like they are unhittable, ok which style? They don't use weapons becuase they are unarmed, again what style(many styles use a variety of weapons). The ones that can handle being attacked with sword/knife/gun whatever, that will disarm and destroy you, again which style. No one style will accomplish all these things, i don't care what you say. and i should have left the 'gun' part off because that's just silly, a pellet gun is a glorified pee shooter, and like you said distance + rifle = dead master. In SWG and with what I suspect TKM's are is very well roundedMasters of discipline. They control their chi flow and their bodies, they are powerful, and can use a weapon as well as go unarmed, and they die and have trouble fighting armored opponents. That's realistic to me.
i think an improvement to make it more realistic, would be animations of blocking and dodging, and better stances. But overall i dont think someone wearing composite would die due to my unarmed attacks every time, especially if he is running around kiting me with a rifle. Again no master can put his hand through a 2 1/2 inch armored plate of a tank (though i have seen some that can get pretty close), but again they couldn't slay a kimo either with their bare hands...
though i am interested what ' I know a guy who can put 250 pounds of force into a 2 inch square box, consistently' means? Are you talking about a finger strike or what?
i am not even going to bother re-reading what i wrote because when i do it never makes sense to me hahaha
JWlaxplyr7
Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:29 am
#30
Hey slapjack, sorry i offended you. I guess you really do want to believe martial arts are used in today's society of pistols and rifles, if you want to believe that, that's ok. My father does things in his job that allows him to teach and learn from america's best, and ive been priviledged enough to talk to some of these people (seals, Delta Force etc...). Out of talking to them about what they've done i've learned one thing, martial arts have only one use in the military: restraining enemies. Otherwise you shoot whoever else, as for saying someone can smash someones skull, i have a very hard time believing that, as a skull can stop a .22 bullet (if you dont shoot at the temples). now i dont know about you, but i dont think there is someone alive that can hit harder than a .22. Also as for the green beret taking on some guys unarmed when they had sticks, i dont doubt that, these are untrained cops taking onone ofamerica's more highly trained professionals. And when you said something about an enemy standing in front of you and the navy seals learning martial arts, thats not true, the navy seals only learn one martial arts move, and that is Osotogari, which is a judo move, and is a hip throw designed to put the enemy on his back, where you can shoot/stab/punch him, yes a punch to the throat could kill someone, but anyone with any sense would put their guard up like a boxer's, which covers the throat. And what you said about UFC people not being trained in one art is a load of crap, actually research something before making statements about it, the reigning UFC champion is from brazil, where his family practices a fighting art that dates back to the time of karate, this art is a grappling art that teaches the practicer to choke the enemy and to breaklimbs, without the enemy ever landing a strike on him, and he can to some conference in DC and took on two masters of taekwondo, and another master of karate, and broke the karate master's arm when he triedto throw punch at him, then choked out (made him pass out by choking him)another taekwondo master before being subdued by the other taekwondo master,o and they all attacked at the same time. I know you'd like to believe that martial arts has a place in themilitaryand the rest of the world just as guns do, butit doest, its merely something that is an art, not a way of taking on soemone with a gun, if i remember correctly the last people who thought that martial arts could take on a gun were the samurai, and they gotdestroyed.
NJyankee4
Sat Jun 12, 2004 12:33 pm
#32
slapjack man, as a martial artist in real life, I agree with you 100%, I also agree that even though it is a game, they should try to make it more realistic but to an extent, I mean it is fun to beat the **Edit** out of something that is about 100 times your size, but it would never happen, that's the good part about games. On the other hand, TKM, being the martial artists in SWG, should be somewhat geared towards being realistic, in the sense ofhaving higher defenses against melee fighters wielding weapons, being the fastest melee profession in the game, therefore being able to dodge/block attacks.
ThunderSaber
Sat Jun 12, 2004 8:47 pm
#33
hmmm who really cares because its a game and doesnt really need to be 100% realistic. please stop posting senseless posts. And i dont think your a real martial artist because the way you talk. I dont think any experience martial artist would show their skills off and kill someone 1 hit. Ive taken martial arts and my intructor said to never show off your skills to anyone. plz stop hammering the game....if you dont like it quit....please
Mal Havoc ~ Gorath
Master Fencer
Master Swordsman
Master Brawler
TKA 4/0/0/0
biwan: ~ obiwan says stop posting
PathOfVader
Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:37 pm
#35
mesome wrote:
Since you are trying to be realistic here, we need the VK. It's our way of penetrating armor, I think some form ofgloveswould be a little cooler and slightly more realistic but.......
Said extremely well. im an avid player on tect center and there are quite a few beautiful weapons for TKA coming soon. including an oh so awesome Katar. *insert holy music*
omgtheynerfedthenitch
Sat Jun 12, 2004 10:52 pm
#36
lol finally the tka board has a thread with some fire in it. but i have a question
i finding unarmed xp really hard to get. im working on novice tk and i was wonder whats the best thing to hunt to get xp? and what do i need to have to kill it with?
i finding unarmed xp really hard to get. im working on novice tk and i was wonder whats the best thing to hunt to get xp? and what do i need to have to kill it with?
Message Edited by omgtheynerfedthenitch on 06-12-2004 10:53 PM
JWlaxplyr7
Sat Jun 12, 2004 11:37 pm
#37
Saying those work is as good as saying youve seen them performed, because who would say "OK use the 1-hit kill move on me" just to tell you they dont work otherwise everyone would know them. As to saying all thateveryone is doing is reading two lines into your post and responding with a 'your a dmubass' flame, well no one has called you a dumbass but yourself, ironically it is what most people are thinking and i know this because of your ignorance of how combat actually works, and that no one is reading your post, simply because people dont want to read garbage, they justfind out its garbage and stop reading. Sorry, but you just not right on this one.
slapjack wrote:
hey jw, you're an idiot. My father was an air foce special forces, the most highly trained and coveted special forces in all branches of the military. So coveted in fact, they only use these guys for search and rescue because so much went into training them, that if just 1 died, it would cost the government alot. Second of all, my brother is a cop for the austin police department. I followed him around the academy for awhile and there was a green beret giving demonstrations to the police cadets. He gave the 7 stacked bricks, only breaking the bottom one demostration, he gave a demonstration where they gave the police cadets wooden poles and had them attack him when he was unarmed. yeah they all lost. As to ufc fighters are the best in the world, thats bull**edit**. those guys are good, but they'll never be the best because they have no focus. those guys do a year of karate, a year of jujitsu, a year of shotokan, they just keep going like that, without ever learneing one art fully. as to the fact that people who use karate get destroyed by grapplers, why dont you try to grab an aikido master, just once, i want you to try. Nobody can grab an aikido master, not even another aikido master. you'll end up with bones broken all over the place. As to, well the 1 hit kills on the body dont work, heres some information for you. There are 3 places on the top of the skull that are quite weak, should you bring your fist down hard on any one of those spots, that persons skull has been crushed, and you are bringing your hand back up with brain matter attached. yeah they'll live through that. or how about the fact that if you hit someone solar plexus hard enough the bone shatters and sends shards flying into your heart which is directly behind it? yeah i'm sure someone will live through that too, i mean you're heart still works with a bunch of holes in it right? oh or how about the one where you hit someone in the throat as hard as you can, your windpipe and easophagus get mashed together, along with your vocal cords and your adam's apple if you have one. now you cant breathe, eat, or talk. I'm sure someone will live through that too. yeah none of the above would work, i see your point. not. As to what a navy seal kills more with, an m-16 or his hands, obviously its his rifle, but they teach navy seals martial arts too, why is that i wonder? i mean all you need is a rifle, you'll never need to hurt someone with your hands right? just aim the rifle at them and fire, oh wait, what if they're right in front of you? oh well then by the time you pull the trigger they wont be there anymore and you'll be on the ground without your rifle. you'll probably also have a boot stomped on your throat, but thats okay, you dont need to breathe, crushed windpipes dont mean anything.
I realize this is a game, but games should be as realistic as possible while still making things fair. yes, if a riflemen has got you in his sights, and you're 30m away, you're a dead man, it doesnt matter what kind of martial arts you know, i'm not contesting that. but that doesnt make for a very game so they have to change that a little bit. but they dont need to make it so that tk's cant do anything to anyone. honestly, its like, okay i'll pvp, OWNED. okay, i'll pve, 100 kin resists OWNED. okay i'll sit here twiddling my thumbs. hey something i can actually do!
Elisar
Sat Jun 12, 2004 11:42 pm
#38
depeends on how you wanna go. High xp per creature taking forever to kill, or killing more creatures with lower xp. I suggest getting a good set of kinetic composite and tanking bols on dantooine til you get novice tk. i say Bols because the give same xp as pikets without all the head hits, also the dont DB. When your ready, Go to Blueleaf temple and beat the tar out of the dark kliknics there.. i was taking in 0ver 5k in xp perkill... just about anything on Yavin will give good stuff. Watch the anglers tho, they poison.
Elisar
Sun Jun 13, 2004 12:05 am
#39
Just last week I was trolling for trouble on Talus. I'm TKM and thats my only real combat skill. I was buffed with decent buffs high on brandy and ahrisa because i couldnt find entertainer buffs. I knew if i went to Tarkins Hold I would find an able bodied adversary. (Reb - case you couldnt tell). Wasnt trying to be rude like IMPs have a habit of being but was trying to gode someone into a duel. Overt is not an issue for me, cept when going overt would be pointless to my goals. Sure I wanted a fight, but i wanted a fight i had a chance of winning. Any veteran Rebel knows, you go ner Tarkins Hold overt, and there will be a welcoming commitee of 20 to greet you. So to make a short story long. I eventually worked out an agreement with one of their warriors, TREANA. I would go overt for a fight and she would keep it honest. And against Imperial doctrine, she did. There was a small amount of interference from a random Overt Reb that was coming from the REB NPC base near their city...but he didnt last 2 sec (sorry bout that bro). Soooo for over 45 min, we pounded the tar out of each other. I know she ws master TKM too with a full set of buffs and entertainer buffs. Not sure what else she was packing but it was a kung fu duel all the way. We went thru more than a couple muon downers and both capped the BF at 1000.. a first for me.
My vague point is... that was the best fight I'd ever been in. We ended up having to call a draw...neither could get a REAL advantage.
Though she did manage to incap me once, Force of Will negated that one. In all fairness, had we just stayed there forever, she would likely have beaten me. The entertainer buffs gave her a distinct advantage for self heals and specials, while i was steadily losing mind. I would can the specials to let it build again and so on, but i noticed something after we called the draw. I was out of muon... If we'd kept on til next downer, she woulda had me.
But it was fun. It was all about perseverance and patience and not about one hit kills. It goes against my constitution to compliment Imps in anything, cuz their usually pricks. (the 'bad guy' persona must be a character draw). But Treana gets Props from me for uncharacteristic moral Character and fortitude. Too bad she's on the wrong side. Would much rather fight with her than against her.
and to tie this post into the thread, thats all the REAL you need in this game. You know the profession traits when you choose it so live with it. Remeber that their are people on the other end of those toons, and treat them accordingly. Win or lose with dignity and honor and even your enemies will respect you.
Elisar - WOD
Bloodfin