Teras Kasi Archive

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Hey Holocron.

I think I made a double post or something by accident but anyways. You can include a brief response to this in your next post to something more pressing but all I wanted to know is that I've observed a lot of 'activity' tonight from the devs with us and regardless of what news it is, its still news, I wanted to know if this is just you with a day off and you've decided to spend a lil while responding to our issues or will this be a regular thing? Frankly, im pleased, even though I disagree with a few of the changes to be proposed and such. I feel the communication is the key thing here and there will be much less bitterness going around with a more active role in the community as a poster. I think you can probably get my point as for what im trying to say, so, I'm done, I'd appreciate a response, even if its as brief as possible.

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I think that maybe the thousands and thousands that have quit have finally gotten their attention.

I am sure you will ask how I know this? I have 2 eyes. I spend have the day reading the forums and did spend 1/2 the day playing. I think Isreal is 1/2 way through the Red sea now, and egypt is starting to go in the water after them.

I hope I am wrong though. O well. I am going diving in the grand caman's soon, and maybe in 6 moths to a year this game will be worth paying 15 a month.

Also Raph, are we going to be reinbursed with a free month maybe for our class being broken?

I guess the whole paying to hate theory is working now huh?

O well good luck to you Raph. Hope you can fix this

Please gentelmen stop with this "you must be a master to reply here". The whole point of this game is to get to master, there are things to do after, you can still run circles around your city screaming I am a master I am a master. But the main part is getting there. After I hit master I guess I can run circles around my probot or something too.

But I just definately want this to be understood, KD is usable by lower ranks of TKA's and the problem of ham costs is there too.

If we are overpowered then what the hell are bh and pistoleer? If we are suppose to do lots of dmg at the cost of our range then why do GUNS STILL OUT DMG US. I got a feeling we are going to be bending over yet again

I don't get it...

You say KD can kill everything in the game, thus TKA KD costs 600 ham.

People will hate me after this post, but why do some classes get ranged KD's, which cost alot less ham. Heck the BH ones do a heck of a lot more damage to boot. Hell, master pistoleer get an AE ranged knockdown (disarming shot2) that costs 200 ham, which you can negate down using buffs, plus healthe ham as well since little mind cost. You can even knock dark master jedi down with it.And if something gets close, you just bust out pistol melee defense and knock them down and do massive damage, more than a TKA master, and longer rangetoo! Check out the damage withpistol melee defense2 too. So why does that cost 3x less? Only knockdown that does low damage is the smuggler one. Rest do tons of damage + at range.

Once upon a time in beta, people would use melee lunges to solo stuff with impunity. These were lunges you did at 10-15m. You consequently upped the ham cost and made them do 1 damage. But using a pistol or carbine to knockdown at RANGE plus doing alot of DAMAGE is fine? How is this not allowing these classes to solo anything. Wise up, they solo anything but aremore efficient AND with alot less risk since it's done at range, where most things cannot even hit you. I'd love to see a TKA master solo a dark jedi master. But HELLO I've soloed plenty using a pistol. Heck any ranged user can solo aDJM. You're definately focusing your nerfs on the wrong classes.

But, if TKA knockdown is what is intended then fine, but you need to nerf all the other knockdowns to match. Why not just make them all do 1 damage like did with lunge, and check all the ham costs. Problem solved.

And this was suggested in beta, but why not make it so when you lunge, you fly toward your target like 10-15m or so. Kinda like zangiefs backhand spin attack in street fighter alpha2. He was slow and that move let him close the gap vs ryu fireballers. Plus various slow melee only chars had moves to 'lunge' or slide and close the gap quickly.

Thats like saying (analogy coming).

Instead of hitting my character in the head when I perform a KD, I instead am going to hit myself in the balls and break my arm while at it. Thats no fix, thats another problem.

To Holo's credit he did clear up that he is talking about a global reduction in HAM cost then making those changes to VK's. It definitely wasn't clear at first, but it sounds like there will be an overall reduction with some minor tweaks to VK's.

Holocron, let me start off by saying this: please dont think that everyone feels the way most of these people in this thread do. I read about 60% of the posts on this thread before i ended up just skipping to the posts made by you. What triggered me into jumping to your posts is that i realized that most of the people responding here are incredibly ungrateful who think that they need their class to be unstoppable. I, and probably many more, feel that these proposed ideas are definetely a step in the right direction and am grateful for your attention.

As it stands now, I do very well in PvP. I do have some problems soloing PvE sometimes, but that is easily solved with grouping. I think that right now the TKA is actually very close to being balanced with the rest of the game. I agree with all of the proposed ideas you have come up with except one. The one part i disagree with you on is the HAM Costs for VibroKnucklers. I believe that we should keep the Health costs the same while lowering the Action a little and the Mind alot. The main problem with this game is the unhealable bar, mind. I understand that it is a balance issue, to keep the riflemans in line with the other classes. What I dont understand is the need to have ANY moves by ANY class use mind. All this does is slow down everything. It adds more downtime and more dying to both PvP and PvE.

Another point I would like to bring up is the defense of the TKA. You said you propose to increase the chance of a defensive move firing. Does this mean dodge, ect? Or does it include Defenses vs Knockdown, Dizzy, Stun, ect. As it stands right now, i just reached Expert Balance Conditioning. This skill is supposed to grant +20 Defense vs Knockdown among other things. Since getting this skill I really havent noticed any change in my rate of being knocked down. I have a feeling the defenses are broken. They need to be fixed. The +20 should mean 20% chance to resist it. As someone gets even more defenses from other classes that number could be increased to 40%, 50%, 70%, ect ect depending on their skills. If this is too powerful, which it very well may be, you could make it so for defenses +100 is the cap and at +100 you have an 80% chance to resist or something to that nature. Just keep in mind that it is very hard for anyone to get +100 in any defense and just the work to do that should grant them immunity from that effect

While on the topic of Knockdown, I would like to suggest this: I agree with the large costs for knockdown, as it is a very powerful move. However, I think you should implement a timer on it to reduce the chance of being perma-knockeddown. This is what Mythic had to do in DAoC to combat the uprising of perma-stun and mez. People could just keep casting mez or stun and you would be rendered helpless throughout an entire fight. There should be a 1 minute (or even 30 seconds) timer implemented on knockdown. This timer would be put into effect after you are finally standing up (if you try to stand up from a knockdown and dizzy sits you back down, the timer doesnt start until dizzy wears off). This timer feature should not be added to PvE, however.

Thank god, i'm so happy the DEV's made this topic. I actually believe they remember they're here... *tear*

Alright, i just have a couple things i thought would be alright to fix/change

1. Of course, the knockdown. Remove the 600+ ham cost tomake it pre-nerf state, and add a short timer instead. add the same timer to ranged KD's.

2. Fix the equilibrium thing. Never have i been able to get right back up after a posture change. Also, i hope that when it's fixed and comes into effect, it doesnt have us change posture, then get right back up. Rather, we wouldn't be paused or stopped, just continue running when, by luck, it works.

3. Boost defense just a tad, and for all melee classes. Bit too much damage being taken for us that have to be so close up...

and finally, this one is just more of a hopeful thing than anything else.

4. When melee lunging (unarmed lunge, polearm lung, etc.) have a 2 second delay before they can get up.

Thanks for the support, dev's.

Why don't we just take out every elite skill in the game, and all special attacks, and give every character the ability to do the /schoolgirlslap that actually heals monsters and takes out hit points down to 1.

That would make the game really hard and PvP would just be a great catfight!!!

We can all just click on gnorts all day!!!

While we are at it with the nerfs. We can make missions actually cost the players money!!! When you do kill that gnort lair with /schoolgirlslap, instead of getting paid 300 credits, we could pay the mission maker 600 credits!!!! That way only dupers and hackers, and explioters would have cash!!!!!

Then we can find any area in the game that people like to play and hunt and surround it with agro 50kham NPCs!!!!!! O people will just love it.

If anyone plays any class but pistoleer, we can have them incapacitated when they log in and have a system message that says "pistoleers own j00 n00b5"

And then if anyone comes on another proffesion forum to post how that class needs to be fixed we can automatically make them Luke Skywalker!!!

I survived melon nerf 2003, but not the big patch!!!!!!

OK, let me start by saying that we are positive that these changes will need iteration, but that's also why we are posting them as proposals so you can sanity check them:

This proposal appears very vague. It feels like it took about 5 mins. during the meeting to come up with. What about a BUG list? Thanks for running it by us first.

Jetti, TKM

Intrepid

How bout we just fix knockdown back to where it was... It was fine before, don't know why ya hate us so much. Nneways.. MOst of us are just training up pistol or anything else that gives us a reasonable knockdown since you're telling us to quit our TKA. I"m personally doing pikemen cause I like the idea of an area KD for only 100 some ham, from what i've heard.

Legend:

Cyan - Holocron

Yellow - Question

White - My Thoughts

Holocron,

Well, i'm a bit more calm now, I think I can make an intelligent post now that you'll consider answering. I'm glad you are all reducing HAM costs for our moves, that's a start.. we'll have to test them and see if they are enough to combo and help us enough to maybe consider forgetting about knockdown. I will agree with you about knockdown being way too powerful in the sense that enemies can't hit us, but I think that everyone has a good point.. a timer would be the best answer. Knockdown lasts roughly for about 10 seconds, to the effect where they cannot attack.. so making the timer to 10, wouldn't be fair yet, because then you can still make the enemy not attack you. So I believe that a 20 second timer would be fair, 30 would be a bit too long. So basically if you had the original costs of knockdown and a timer of 20, you'd have a balanced skill. Of course I hope this goes for all classes.

Quotes and Questions ~

Facing an opponent armed with ranged weapons, high-level abilities enable his or her to evade blaster fire and close in quickly, bringing his or her enemy swiftly to the ground.

Teras Kasi are lethal, nearly impossible to knock down or unbalance.

Thoughts, Koster?

• That this paragraph is strategy guide hyperbole. Read, literally it says "TKAs can't be killed." Uhh... I doubt that you or we want that.

You're right, we don't want that. However, you need to talk with these people that made the "Official" Strategy guide. They sound like they are stretching the truth by far. In fact, we know they are.

• We're not trying to be stubborn or arrogant. We're trying to offer these up for commentary. The fact that you see this proposal as stubborn or arrogant impliesthat one, and probably both, of the following are true:

Thank you for offering up some things for commentary, but understand we are all very angry at the moment. It would help if next time you say something along the lines of - "We are working on all the other issues that have been asked, but we have a few issues at the moment that we'd like to ask all of you". Just a thought so that we don't get angry next time, let's help each other here with less stress, no?

• we're wrong about the actual power of Teras Kasi Artists
  
• you're assuming a baseline of ability for TKAs that is way too high to be balanced with the rest of the game


• I am pretty sure that both will turn out to be true.
  

"as with knockdown....", makes it sound like you really really dislike that skill.. if I may ask, what was the initial idea behind this skill? who thoughtof it?.. and the best way to fix it is to put the timer on it. Seriously

• Look, all we're trying to do here is make you happy and make sure you have fun in the game. At the same time, if we say "we will give you anything you ask for," you will ask to be invulnerable (admit it. ). If we're proceeding from different assumptions, we're going to end up disagreeing. Hence my post in SWG discussion sowe can get back to first principles.

If you give anything we ask for, the more experienced of us will say no to invulnerability. Why not give us neverwinter nights if you're gonna do that?.. look seriously, the bigger population and mostly the majority of the forum does not want invulnerability or anything comparable. Only if we were jedis.. but forget jedis for now. On topic, I think that if you keep doing what you are doing now, you will get this game back up to what it was on release, or more. Just, trust us. Would be great if you ask us before you are about to apply a nerf.. or you will catch everyone off guard.

• I'll tell you that ourtake as far as TKAs go is that you have some balance issues, but overall you are overpowered, not under. Can you explain to me why that is incorrect? What are you measuring against, exactly. (Pistoleers in PvP? PvE when compared against a comparably advanced carbineer or pikeman? What, exactly, are you using as your baseline?)

Seriously, please trust us on this.. we are SO not overpowered at the moment.. TKA aren't the powerhouses. We're not supposed to be. The strongest of melee at the moment are swordmen, just as they are supposed to be. The most damage we deal to a single enemy is close to 300 every hit, varying of course with different Vibro Knucklers. With berserk we get up to 500. I hate to drag ranged characters into this, but they do more damage than us, efficiently at a faster rate, and while aiming at our un-healable mind pool.. besides the fact that it's unfair to be on the receiveing end of 800 mind damage, I think that we are seriously not overpowered. I have tested this as well, I told a newly created character to duel me. All I asked him was to run in a straight line, away from me - sure enough slowly in about 1000 meters, he did me in. I didn't hit him once, didn't have a chance. Holo.. i'm a Teras Kasi Master. Killed by a Novice Marksman (0/0/0/0). Please, if you're going to answer one question on my post.. answer me that. Why are we subject to die to a newly created character?

I wanna have fun and leave you alone in this forum, so you can do your other work... we all wanna leave the forums alone. Please help us out here, kay? we all need less headaches.. thanks for you time then. Hope to see a response soon in the morning.