Swordsman Archive
Thread: How would you make swordsman a better damage dealer?
velocity-x wrote:
as to your weapons issue.
Swordsman with an 1000 dmg PH
vs
Fencer with 1050 dmg Blade
Swordsman does more damage because of the multipliers.
Unless the fencer is also a swordsman, in which case he uses the same attacks with superior weaponry. In which case, Swordsman becomes a dabbler profession, which it basically is now.
You aren't arguing to improve swordsman at all. It sounds to me like you're happy to be a dabbler. And you're STILL missing one of the main points. SAC on powerhammers is rediculously high. So over a longer battle a swordsman falls even farther behind. If you find a powerhammer with 95 SAC on it, then there is no way it's going to match the damage on the Nyenthi'Oris unless it is a pre-CU hammer that converted nicely.
And I'm sorry, but if you think that because the CU docs have 'changed' since CU that swordsman isn't supposed to be the high damage dealer, you're going to be wrong. If swordsman is no longer supposed to be the high damage dealer, then SOE would have to rework our entire profession, which I seriously don't see happening. Pre-CU and Post-CU the swordsman profession was, and always will be, the heavy damage melee profession.
velocity-x wrote:
You think you're arguing for the Swordsman profession when really you're arguing against other professions. There's a big difference, and one will get results where the other is meaningless.
I happen to have a Blade of Nyenthi'oris and yes, great damage, low SAC. But once I PUP my Post-CU hammer and take my food/drink, there's no real difference, and the sword specials outdamage the fencer by far.
If you want to make an improvement to the swordsman profession, look at what's not working properly, not at what you want cause other professions get it.
It's a fact that as a fencer, using a fencer weapon and fencer skills you cannot outdamage a swordsman using a PH and swordsman skills.
I'm done. You guys will just have to figure out how to use the profession. The topic isn't "How would you make swordsman a better damage dealer compared to someone dabbling in swordsman."
KreyMerr wrote:
Title asks the question. I think its obvious that we arent doing the large amounts of damage that we should be. We are rated at a 5 offence, yet can be out damaged by several profs with less rating. So what are some of your ideas?
Mine include:
Make berserk an actual useful skill. Make this the offencive version of CoB. The damage output should be higher.
Adjust a move to become sort of a finishing move. Have the move do massive damage, but have some negative effect, like a defencive debuff. (for example, hit for 2250 instead of 1900 but decrease defences for 20 seconds)
Anyway, include your ideas so I can get some sent in for the devs to look at.
ok Velocity, let me try and get this through your skull.
there are two people who are both fencer/swordsman, one person is using action regen food + sac pup + blade of nytherwhatever, and the other person is using a pre-cu hammer + sac pup + action regen food.
the guy using the blade of whatever does more damage, HANDS DOWN. maybe not per hit, but per hit doesnt matter as much as what matters in the long run.
a profession IS NO LONGER DEFINED BY IT'S MOVES (arguable though when it comes to master moves, but only master). THE PRIMARY DEFINITION OF A PROFESSION IS NOW IT'S WEAPONS. swordsman weapons should be the most damaging weapons 1 on 1. they are not. maybe for a few hits (by a little), but once you have to stop and regen action while the guy with the blade of whatever still beats on you.
velocity-x wrote:
Ciao wrote:
Master the Fencer Profession and use the ROTW Fencer weapons which are superior to any Swordsman's weapon but use some of the swordsman's specials like improved crit and armor break.
FTW
I love Master Fencer + Master Sword, using the Blade of Nyenthi'oris with swordsman specials is kickass.
velocity-x wrote:
Use a typical PH with Advanced Armor Break and Advanced Critical then come back here and claim you can do that damage with another professions weapons + skills. You can't.
It's a fact that as a fencer, using a fencer weapon and fencer skills you cannot outdamage a swordsman using a PH and swordsman skills.
I'm done. You guys will just have to figure out how to use the profession. The topic isn't "How would you make swordsman a better damage dealer compared to someone dabbling in swordsman."
Ok this I can't let slide. I do know how to use my profession, and I know how to use it very well thank you. I've been a swordsman practically since live, so don't try and make it look like we know nothing about our own profession. And you're argumentabout comparing 2 lvl 54 characters with ONLY Master Fencer or Master Swords is pointless,because it's dealing with mid-game content that someone would spend 2 days on. Everyone and their dog knows that a single elite combat profession is weak and always will be. And besides, if you were to use a 'typical' post-CU hammer compared to the Blade of Nyenthi'Oris, then yes, I will say the fencer outdamages swordsman. Considering the 'typical' post-CU hammer has 120 or higher SAC and lower damage, it wouldn't be a difficult feat.
Another thing is you come into a threadthat askshow to make swordsman do more damage, yet in this entire thread you've not made a single suggestion. Instead you've tried to convince us that there is nothing wrong with our profession. That's like trying to tell the blind man that he just has his eyes shut. Anybody who has looked at the stats of the powerhammer can tell you there is something wrong.
On a final note (and I do mean final this time as long as nobody tries to make me or any other swordsmen on this board look inept) I am NOT calling for a nerf of the Blade of Nyenthi'Oris. Far from it. Fencer has a 4 rating and should keep that sword as well as the Junti Mace. I'm just trying to make people realize that swordsman is not the 5 rating that it was stated it would be in the CU docs.
APEist_Revenge wrote:
KreyMerr wrote:
Title asks the question. I think its obvious that we arent doing the large amounts of damage that we should be. We are rated at a 5 offence, yet can be out damaged by several profs with less rating. So what are some of your ideas?
Mine include:
Make berserk an actual useful skill. Make this the offencive version of CoB. The damage output should be higher.
Adjust a move to become sort of a finishing move. Have the move do massive damage, but have some negative effect, like a defencive debuff. (for example, hit for 2250 instead of 1900 but decrease defences for 20 seconds)
Anyway, include your ideas so I can get some sent in for the devs to look at.
ok Velocity, let me try and get this through your skull.
there are two people who are both fencer/swordsman, one person is using action regen food + sac pup + blade of nytherwhatever, and the other person is using a pre-cu hammer + sac pup + action regen food.
the guy using the blade of whatever does more damage, HANDS DOWN. maybe not per hit, but per hit doesnt matter as much as what matters in the long run.
This is correct, because using higher damage skills with a higher damage weapon = OMG higher damage. I agree, this is why I'm Fencer/Swordsman. Dabbling is important and that's the point of doing Fencer Swordsman.
a profession IS NO LONGER DEFINED BY IT'S MOVES (arguable though when it comes to master moves, but only master). THE PRIMARY DEFINITION OF A PROFESSION IS NOW IT'S WEAPONS. swordsman weapons should be the most damaging weapons 1 on 1. they are not. maybe for a few hits (by a little), but once you have to stop and regen action while the guy with the blade of whatever still beats on you.
On the contrary, if you choose to dabble the profession is then based on your skill combinations. If I went Fencer / TK, I would be giving up the damage. If I want damage, I do swordsman. My weapon doesn't matter for that decision.
APEist_Revenge wrote:
velocity-x wrote:
Ciao wrote:
Master the Fencer Profession and use the ROTW Fencer weapons which are superior to any Swordsman's weapon but use some of the swordsman's specials like improved crit and armor break.
FTW
I love Master Fencer + Master Sword, using the Blade of Nyenthi'oris with swordsman specials is kickass.
LMAO. i just remembered this post.
NO WONDER GUYS. THIS DILUTES VELOCITY'S ENTIRE ARGUEMENT. lol what a JOKE.
I like people who read my posts and keep track. Thank you. Fencer weapon plus swordsman specials is kick ass, I said it again. I do just as well with my hammer though was what I was getting at. Sorry you misunderstand, and that your cap's lock button seems to be 'sticky', although i'm not willing to guess why.
Ryuukon wrote:
velocity-x wrote:
Use a typical PH with Advanced Armor Break and Advanced Critical then come back here and claim you can do that damage with another professions weapons + skills. You can't.
It's a fact that as a fencer, using a fencer weapon and fencer skills you cannot outdamage a swordsman using a PH and swordsman skills.
I'm done. You guys will just have to figure out how to use the profession. The topic isn't "How would you make swordsman a better damage dealer compared to someone dabbling in swordsman."
Ok this I can't let slide. I do know how to use my profession, and I know how to use it very well thank you. I've been a swordsman practically since live, so don't try and make it look like we know nothing about our own profession. And you're argumentabout comparing 2 lvl 54 characters with ONLY Master Fencer or Master Swords is pointless,because it's dealing with mid-game content that someone would spend 2 days on. Everyone and their dog knows that a single elite combat profession is weak and always will be. And besides, if you were to use a 'typical' post-CU hammer compared to the Blade of Nyenthi'Oris, then yes, I will say the fencer outdamages swordsman. Considering the 'typical' post-CU hammer has 120 or higher SAC and lower damage, it wouldn't be a difficult feat.Another thing is you come into a threadthat askshow to make swordsman do more damage, yet in this entire thread you've not made a single suggestion. Instead you've tried to convince us that there is nothing wrong with our profession. That's like trying to tell the blind man that he just has his eyes shut. Anybody who has looked at the stats of the powerhammer can tell you there is something wrong.
On a final note (and I do mean final this time as long as nobody tries to make me or any other swordsmen on this board look inept) I am NOT calling for a nerf of the Blade of Nyenthi'Oris. Far from it. Fencer has a 4 rating and should keep that sword as well as the Junti Mace. I'm just trying to make people realize that swordsman is not the 5 rating that it was stated it would be in the CU docs.
/offers you a tissue
Like i said earlyer the fix is increasing the damage of the swordmans weapons to about 2500 min. Also increase the actiond cost to about 120 -175. for high end damage.
This would allow a swordman to hit 2 to 3 times tops and get about 3 -4k damage out of it before their action is gone.
This would bring back the vialbility of swordsman and provide them with a nich.
This way you could get 8 swordman and have them all hit necrisis 2 or 3 times. Lets say each hit was for an ave of 2500.
8 * 2500 = 20000 for every hit of the group.
Now necrosis is 47k ham which means that he would have killed probably half of the swordmen before he dropped. This is not even taking into account the machine and the driods.
So by just increasing the damage and action of the swordmans weapons the devs will not make them uuber just viable.
velocity-x wrote:
APEist_Revenge wrote:
velocity-x wrote:
Ciao wrote:
Master the Fencer Profession and use the ROTW Fencer weapons which are superior to any Swordsman's weapon but use some of the swordsman's specials like improved crit and armor break.
FTW
I love Master Fencer + Master Sword, using the Blade of Nyenthi'oris with swordsman specials is kickass.
LMAO. i just remembered this post.
NO WONDER GUYS. THIS DILUTES VELOCITY'S ENTIRE ARGUEMENT. lol what a JOKE.
I like people who read my posts and keep track. Thank you. Fencer weapon plus swordsman specials is kick ass, I said it again. I do just as well with my hammer though was what I was getting at. Sorry you misunderstand, and that your cap's lock button seems to be 'sticky', although i'm not willing to guess why.
reason why my caps button is sticky is because your skull is this |-----------------------------------------------------| thick, rtard.
im not gonna try and explain it any more to you. if you cant understand, your hopeless. all we are doing is reiterating our arguements over and over again. we are both stubborn i guess. still, im right! lol...
Ryuukon wrote:
velocity-x wrote:
/offers you a tissue
Poor arguments, derogatory comments, and snide remarks. You sir are a troll. Go pad your post count elsewhere and leave the serious discussions concerning a professions future to those who actually care.
/throws the gavel at your head
Go judge yourself and get off your high horse. If you don't like my opinions, stop replying and antagonizing me repeatedly.
Message Edited by velocity-x on 06-16-2005 04:29 PM
You know, I spent an hour writing up a response to you Velocity-x. Submitted it. Stared at it for a second. Realized that no matter what I say you're still going to continue to believe you're right and everyone else is wrong. Forget it. I'm done.
Message Edited by Ryuukon on 06-16-2005 04:44 PM
velocity-x wrote:
/offers you a tissue