Squad Leader Archive
Thread: I think Squad Leader is fine the way it is
It's not hard to get Master SL if you lead groups of 20...the xp is incredible. If I got 3k on a kill of Carbine XP, I would get 8-9k of SL experience.
I chose squad leader early on and I loved it at first... the ability to give system messages was fun. well, that slowly wore off as I started just using groupchat since it is easier to type "retreat" than it is to type "/sys retreat"... My main interest in squad leader is being able to offer the melee and ranged bonuses to my group but I have no clue if they even work, there is no indication that they do.
ohyeah, and to the guy that said squad leader xp is hard to get, are you crazy? I could master squad leader in on sitting, with absolutely no problem. Just go out with a group of people, like 8-10 and fight on dathomir.
Iagree wholeheartedly with Psquire's view which i equate to mean that the Squad leader title is there as a marker to say that this person is someone who likes to group, a player who helps others out and who is someone who can help u find a group and expand ur friends list. While the skills and abilities should be undoubtably helpful they should go hand in hand with the idea that a squad leader is a sort of upgraded helper. I can see how others would prefer the attributes of the sl to be better but not being a sl myself i cant really talk on such things- maybe later 
I dont understand what the problem with a medic/doctor character as sl is just cos ur doing the least amount of damage or even just healing people full time it shouldnt stop or even hinder u being a good sl
(Helper) is there as a marker, Squad Leader is a profession! Stop pretending it is some **edit** flag that says "Hey, I've got this title, I am good at leading groups". It's not, nor will it ever be. You think by getting the title it magically makes you a good group leader, or that only good group leaders will beable to get Master. As it is right now,nobody actually goes out seeking a Squad Leader for the group... NOBODY! If that's the way you want it to stay, then I honestly don't get it.
"I can see how others would prefer the attributes of the sl to be better but not being a sl myself i cant really talk on such things- maybe later " --You should wait till later
ESD,
From my experience, I would say well over half the people that I have dealt with, been lead by, or asked for help that had the (HELPER) have been completely clueless or worse. One (HELPER) just two nights ago asked me, "so why would anyone ever wanna spend money to clone anyway?" his health bar was completely black. I didn't ask him for much help. There is no prereq for HELPER, just flip a flag. (Note I have met plenty of very helpful helpers, but they really, to me, seem to be the exception to the rule). The vast majority of SLs I've met (over a dozen now and none of them idiots, most in fact very very sharp) have been very helpful to me and new their stuff better than most Master CH and Exp BH I'd seen. In my mind I formed the perception that the SL prof was drawing good people and good leaders. this lead to my conclusions above. Again this is just my perseption and by no means proves that people playing SLs are the shizz as leaders across the board, or even that their trying to become good leaders. My hope is that reputation will work more in the opositedirection and eventually it'll shake out that the majority of SLs, as a group, will be respected leaders, with a few numbnuts with a SL title but with a terrible and wildy known reputation. Pip dream I know.
My experience being invited to groups on Ahazi appears to not be the norm as well. Aside from the groups I've started I've joined at least 10 large groups (10 or more peeps that weren't SL lead already) in about two weeks of playing SL.Literally nine out of ten times the person forming the group has gladly given up the reigns when I asked (politely of course) or done /makeleader on mewithout my even having to ask. Just last night I was runningby a cantina inMos Eisleywherea total random person was shouting, hunting party forming, need Squad Leader(andDoc and CHs of course, point being, this total random valued SLs on the same level as CH and docs)they had about6 or 7peeps at the time. Another time at the fort, somebody else was shouting "My group needs a Squad Leader", I got a 14 person group basically for free. I know it doesn't always work that way. And, from reading the posts here, I believe I've just been getting very lucky and a time will probably come when "nobody wants to play with me". So maybe it's just ahazi, or maybe I'm just plain lucky, but from my perspective I was seeing plenty of demand, and a sort of blind trust, for Squad Leaders in general (with little regardfor skill level or group bonuses it seemed). Anyway, that's where I was coming from, your millage may vary.
-Psq
What a well thought out post. I think you've made a really good point. Squad Leaders should be respected because they should be putting their men ahead of themselves.
Having Squad Leaders skills geared towards assisting their comrades and not themselves would go a long way to keeping the idiot doodz and 133+ kiddies from getting this profession just so he can post "Who can do this much damage?! I'm awesome!".
Having skills in which the SL must make sacrifices (action pts or whatever) to benefit the survival of his/her men/women would see a trend of true leaders choosing SL.
While SL do need more game mechanic improvements, I think the developers will have to be very careful in what they choose to do. I have to admit that I want to add more to the topic, but I don't feel I have enough experience yet to suggest what changes should be made. I will say that forcing players to do what you want is NOT a good idea. The closest we should come to this is "SL wants you to attack this, press space to accept new target".
Teamwork should be a product of the players themselves, not the game mechanic.
Hope someone finds this useful 
Kaosodin wrote:
well, if you play a SL effectivly, then you will see we are also in need of some fixes, example, try Form-Up? nice command i say, ever try it when the SL is dizzy.... really... and what message did you get... thoguht so, nope, a SL can cure dizzy of ALL his group members, UNLESS he is dizzy, now how lame is that... sorry guys, cant use my inate class ability that cures dizzy, becasue i am dizzy, lame.
Oh man tell me about it. Just spent the last 5 days at fort tusken mastering SL, and let me tell you 95% of the time when there was someone in the group dizzy or stunned, guess what? It was from AE (area effect) attacks by tuskens, and me being a TKA. Guess who was also dizzy?
To be honest, I could care less if they ever fix the class. I became a Squad Leader because its what I end up doing anyways, and I literally would rather see a few minor fixes to whats in place or absolutely nothing at all than to see the proposed changes implemented.
So I guess, I too in a way think Squad Leader is fine the way it is, because frankly, I don't need a bunch of buttons to push to be able to lead my team - I can do it myself, and I would rather have a class that does nothing than a class that does mostly bad things.
Psquire,
I like what you wrote.I do however, believe thatthe profession's skills do need to be reevaluated becausemany of the abilities are worthless now. Fixing the passive defensive skills would be a big bonus (assuming they don't work like many have posted,I have no way of testing it). Volleyfire, boostmorale, SteadyAim and retreatwill always be worthless unless they make significant changes to them or replace them with other abilities. I would suggest simply replacing them.
I do agree that SL should be a respected class, however how do we get there? I have suggested very tough SL missions similar to BH. Then you would have to get a group together for a specific purpose that would hopefully be more challenging then most of the content available right now. You could not just be the person inviting people into the group atthe Tuskin Fortoreven inviting toons at a PA Dathomir/Endor raid to get your MSL title. Harder is better IMO.
Well, hopefully we will get a more personal response from the developers some time soon.
Shuyunh wrote:
I do agree that SL should be a respected class, however how do we get there? I have suggested very tough SL missions similar to BH. Then you would have to get a group together for a specific purpose that would hopefully be more challenging then most of the content available right now.
Respect should always be earned and never given. I guess the question of "How do we get there?" depends on what kind of respect you want. I think that the kind of respect the vast majority of Bounty Hunters get as a class is impersonal, as in Bounty Hunters get powerful weapons, cool special moves, etc. I'm not saying they all suck, I'm just saying that pretty much anyone can play the Bounty Hunter class and get those abilities without really doing anything special. Certainly, I know several Bounty Hunters, and a few of them have my respect - but it is by no means because of their weapons or abilities, it is because they are smart, resourceful guys who can think on their feet, people I would want by my side in battle.
If we as Squad Leaders truly want respect, it should be of the earned personal nature. My groups and teams depend on me for literal tactics and strategy; they depend on me for ability to plan an attack on a city or evaluate a situation and form a battle-plan quickly;the people I regularly group withreally feel that if they follow my lead, I can takethem into almost any situation and succeed.
You'll notice I haven't said "They depend on me for Rally." or "They really love the terrain negotiation." Sure these things are nice and latent buffs would be great, and I would gladly take them, but to be honest I don't really care about them, and my team certainly doesn't complain to me about my lack of usefulness. I make MYSELFuseful. I make MYSELF valuable to the group. Maybe its a roleplay thing, maybe I'm just wired differently than most people, but I came to the Squad Leader class excited about the prospect of people trusting my leadership and respecting my abilityto lead them into battle. I use /sysgroup for battle commands and I use that about 50 times more than anything else within the Squad Leader abilities, because it has a literal, actual application that helps me lead my people.
Perhaps as a class we should all be less concerned with what game-given abilities we have or will have, and should be far more concerned with the actual business and practice of leadership.
I don't care what anyone says - no amount of programming will make you a better leader.