Smuggler Archive
Thread: Revamp Discussion: Contraband & Smuggling Missions
Ternque01 wrote:
I like this. We have the basic framwork of an awesome contraband system
This can be both seen as a solution and a "spice" to the system as it now stands. No hard-to-code NPC BH's. People in factions get an ass-whuppin, while neutral players smuggle their hearts out.
The only problem is that with "narcostims" or whatever used to make glitterstim would have to be dropped from what I thought to be highly illegal to just banned to keep neutrals out of PvP.
Highly Illegal items could include factional base enhancements, DeadEye spice, or any list of military goods. Whatever man. (I'm tired of this arguing)
Exactly. Though I still want there to be good neutral punishments for being captured with contraband. There still needs to be risk for them, they just shouldn't have to worry about the NPC consequence.
THeir missions can entail less risk, or less neat items. While keeping the PVP willing smugglers, who accept the risk, the greater rewards that should be associated with it.
One of the Four Horsemen of the Smuggler Apocalypse! 
It is forced PVP is EXP progression requires us to take these missions. Thunderheart previously said as much and it is a requested feature of our revamp from time beyond remembering. That missions be required for the smuggler to progress.
However these missions are so laced with PVP consequences that a player has no choice but to participate in PVP if they wish to gain experience in Smuggling.
So they have every right to ask for an NPC consequence.
HOWEVER. I don't agree with them getting all the perks and benefits that a PVP active player gets for the extra risk they assume.
It's not forced. If you do the missions the way they are supposed to be done: i.e. deliver the goods and return the correct amount of cash- You do NOT gain any visibility.
Even if you DID skim the delivery one way or another- one infraction wouldn't be enough to put you on the BH terminals.
The bottom line is that YOUR actions dictate what happens to YOU.
Under this system as GM wrote it- no one can go back and say they were put on those boards for no reason or for leveling their profession.
I'm inclined to throw my hands up and go with AXOB on this. The fact that it DOES infringe on those who wish to be bounty hunters is the last straw. It's time that people own up to the fact that PvP is harder than PvE and therefore -YES those who are willing to risk it should have access to better stuff and PvE'ers should start taking responsibilities for their actions. They are costing us a chance at a VERY fun game because they don't want to own up.
Smuggler_Caylin wrote:
Ternque01 wrote:
Smugglers have the choice to not skim off their suppliers and bosses. GreenMarine has given adequate tools to monitor visibility, lower visibility, and to remove themselves from the terminals. I see no reason why a PvP-wary smuggler could not use the tools at thier disposal to not enter PvP effectively.
Smuggling isa dangerous job, but if a smuggler chooses to rush through missions quickly accumulating visibility, then they bear the responsibility of that visibility.
They would have to actively monitor this when any other player who does not care whether they are involved in PVP can continue to play as normal. You are penalising their gameplay and restricting their game time to use it as they wish.
A player who has no interest in participating in PVP and takes missions to skill up smuggler, should not have to actively check and take away from their enjoyment of the game to see if they are on terminals and act to prevent it. Don't punish them for having a different playstyle than your own and that is what you are wanting to do.
Why is it a punishment when it is totally from continuity that a smuggler would have to do this to avoid bounties anyway? That is part of being a smuggler. Correct me if I'm wrong, but both "making sure you're not in trouble with some authorities" and "hacking the BH mission terminals in a last attempt to save your life" seem very very much apart of a "wild" smugglers checklist of things to do.
It is not like doing either won't take a second anyways. Also, if a smuggler plays it cool and doesn't steal from his suppliers, you can't tell me a BH will fall right out of the sky the first time he/she does.
It's no surprise here. Play straight and you live. Be "wild" and you die. You have the tools, you have the time (5 seconds), there is no excuse.
HOTDOG wrote:
It's not forced. If you do the missions the way they are supposed to be done: i.e. deliver the goods and return the correct amount of cash- You do NOT gain any visibility.
Try reading it again. Missions will most likely be a required process for the smuggler progress in the skill tree. Failure in any mission equates to raised visiblity, as do many items that will be considered 'illegal'.
So PVP is forced.
Even if you DID skim the delivery one way or another- one infraction wouldn't be enough to put you on the BH terminals.
No skimming, just taking missions risks a PVP consequence for those who do not wish to participate in PVP.
The bottom line is that YOUR actions dictate what happens to YOU.
Under this system as GM wrote it- no one can go back and say they were put on those boards for no reason or for leveling their profession.
Yes they can, TH wrote earlier they were going to work in a mission XP system. I think that is still going in. Hell, we've asked for it for a year. Taking missions risks PVP consequences.
Smuggler_Caylin wrote:
Yes they can, TH wrote earlier they were going to work in a mission XP system. I think that is still going in. Hell, we've asked for it for a year. Taking missions risks PVP consequences.
Ternque01 wrote:
Why is it a punishment when it is totally from continuity that a smuggler would have to do this to avoid bounties anyway? That is part of being a smuggler. Correct me if I'm wrong, but both "making sure you're not in trouble with some authorities" and "hacking the BH mission terminals in a last attempt to save your life" seem very very much apart of a "wild" smugglers checklist of things to do.
....
If you have no wish to participate in PVP, you risk it regardless by taking any smuggler mission. As it stands given what developers have said, smuggler missions will generate XP. Thus these missions will be required for a smugglers progression and any smuggler who takes a mission is at risk of a PVP consequence the way GM has lined this out.
A player who is skilling up in their profession, but has not done any special actions such as failing a bh terminal slice (Which also puts them on the terminal) they find themselves having to actively take time out of their day to check on things.
I however, would not need to do this. I pity the BH'ers who come after me. I have a hair trigger, top of the line armor and a fortune in buffs at my command. Bring it.
None of my day is consumed checking on these terminals. I continue as I would any other day, where these people would have to keep checking and possibly failing.
That isn't right and it punishes them for their play style.
Smuggler_Caylin wrote:
Ternque01 wrote:
Why is it a punishment when it is totally from continuity that a smuggler would have to do this to avoid bounties anyway? That is part of being a smuggler. Correct me if I'm wrong, but both "making sure you're not in trouble with some authorities" and "hacking the BH mission terminals in a last attempt to save your life" seem very very much apart of a "wild" smugglers checklist of things to do.
....
If you have no wish to participate in PVP, you risk it regardless by taking any smuggler mission. As it stands given what developers have said, smuggler missions will generate XP. Thus these missions will be required for a smugglers progression and any smuggler who takes a mission is at risk of a PVP consequence the way GM has lined this out.
A player who is skilling up in their profession, but has not done any special actions such as failing a bh terminal slice (Which also puts them on the terminal) they find themselves having to actively take time out of their day to check on things.
I however, would not need to do this. I pity the BH'ers who come after me. I have a hair trigger, top of the line armor and a fortune in buffs at my command. Bring it.
None of my day is consumed checking on these terminals. I continue as I would any other day, where these people would have to keep checking and possibly failing.
That isn't right and it punishes them for their play style.
You make it sound like a BH will fall out of the sky everytime you sneak a dirty mag past your girlfriend/boyfriend. I have said this before: from a RP perspective, smugglers who gain to much visibility "check" to see if he is wanted by the authorities.
Making it sound like you check it every five minutes isn't very straight man.
When you choose to be a smuggler, you should accept a revamp that accurately puts you in the shoes of one. Part of this MMORPG is roleplaying a smuggler. Yes they do check if they are wanted if things get a little too hot. How do you think Han found out about his bounty with Jabba. He knew he messed up, and I can bet you 10 to 1 odds that he was asking his friends what the deal was before he decided that a blaster bolt would tell him first. Give me a break.
Smuggler_Caylin wrote:
That isn't right and it punishes them for their play style.
Ternque01 wrote:
You make it sound like a BH will fall out of the sky everytime you sneak a dirty mag past your girlfriend/boyfriend. I have said this before: from a RP perspective, smugglers who gain to much visibility "check" to see if he is wanted by the authorities.
The point is, they shouldn't have to when they had no interest in PVP in the first place.
Making it sound like you check it every five minutes isn't very straight man.
If they suck at smuggling, maybe thats what will need to happen.
When you choose to be a smuggler, you should accept a revamp that accurately puts you in the shoes of one. Part of this MMORPG is roleplaying a smuggler. Yes they do check if they are wanted if things get a little too hot. How do you think Han found out about his bounty with Jabba. He knew he messed up, and I can bet you 10 to 1 odds that he was asking his friends what the deal was before he decided that a blaster bolt would tell him first. Give me a break.
It's also a game. PVP oriented players are a minority in this game, not a majority. No player should have to take time out of their day toprevent something they have no interest in taking part in. It's bad game design to have it that way.
If you have no wish to participate in PVP, you risk it regardless by taking any smuggler mission. As it stands given what developers have said, smuggler missions will generate XP. Thus these missions will be required for a smugglers progression and any smuggler who takes a mission is at risk of a PVP consequence the way GM has lined this out.
A player who is skilling up in their profession, but has not done any special actions such as failing a bh terminal slice (Which also puts them on the terminal) they find themselves having to actively take time out of their day to check on things.
I however, would not need to do this. I pity the BH'ers who come after me. I have a hair trigger, top of the line armor and a fortune in buffs at my command. Bring it.
None of my day is consumed checking on these terminals. I continue as I would any other day, where these people would have to keep checking and possibly failing.
That isn't right and it punishes them for their play style
So then a system where a person had the option to take a lower paying mission with no risk of visibility over a higher paying mission WITH a risk of visibility (PvP) would be acceptable, right?
Some would say "NO" but they are not owning up to the fact that PvP is harder than PvE- and if you shouldn't be "punished" for not doing it then they should be rewarded for being willing to face it.
Am I wrong here?
You are quite right, but their smuggling system should be just as interesting as one with higher consequences. We don't want to leave them out of too much.
HOTDOG wrote:
Caylin Wrote:
So then a system where a person had the option to take a lower paying mission with no risk of visibility over a higher paying mission WITH a risk of visibility (PvP) would be acceptable, right?
Some would say "NO" but they are not owning up to the fact that PvP is harder than PvE- and if you shouldn't be "punished" for not doing it then they should be rewarded for being willing to face it.
Am I wrong here?
Smuggler_Caylin wrote:
Ternque01 wrote:
You make it sound like a BH will fall out of the sky everytime you sneak a dirty mag past your girlfriend/boyfriend. I have said this before: from a RP perspective, smugglers who gain to much visibility "check" to see if he is wanted by the authorities.
The point is, they shouldn't have to when they had no interest in PVP in the first place.
Regardless, part of being a smuggler is being careful and watching your back. This is an excelent way to bring this concept to life in the game.
Making it sound like you check it every five minutes isn't very straight man.
If they suck at smuggling, maybe thats what will need to happen.
There is a huge difference at sucking at smuggling and checking the "I will skim 25% of this product from my supplier" box.
When you choose to be a smuggler, you should accept a revamp that accurately puts you in the shoes of one. Part of this MMORPG is roleplaying a smuggler. Yes they do check if they are wanted if things get a little too hot. How do you think Han found out about his bounty with Jabba. He knew he messed up, and I can bet you 10 to 1 odds that he was asking his friends what the deal was before he decided that a blaster bolt would tell him first. Give me a break.
It's also a game. PVP oriented players are a minority in this game, not a majority. No player should have to take time out of their day toprevent something they have no interest in taking part in. It's bad game design to have it that way.
PvP does not have to be a consequence, play your smuggler correctly - don't steal from your boss and make sure you have a clean reputation with the law enforcement. If that doesn't describe a smart smuggler, I don't know what does. "Dumb" smugglers who steal and are sloppy keeping thier asses clean of authorities will die by a bounty hunter.
The choice is their's. When you say, "No player should have to take time out of their day to pervent something they have no interest taking part in," that is destroying what being a smuggler is all about - keeping thier ass from being detected. Part of that is covering it whenever possible. How you fail to see that checking your visibility every few days to make sure you're okay is a normal part of a smugglers job is beyond me. I understand how you feel it is a punishment, but they don't have to check it all the time like you are suggesting. That's rediculous.
I don't know how else to say this: checking your visibility comes with the job. You know exactly what i'm talking about. From an RP perspective that is what a smuggler spends at least some of his time doing. I have yet to see an argument that refutes it, and a smuggler that wants to be careful and has to check his visibility and views it as a punishment is not my problem, it comes with the lifestyle. If a player wants to be a smuggler and has to live a smuggler lifestyle to preserve their playstyle, then I've done my job of making the smuggler revamp more accurate. That is what smugglers do in real life, it's what they do in the movies. Hell, it's just what they do!