Smuggler Archive
Thread: Last Ditch question from a Jedi
dubiousmastax wrote:
I've never been hit with this bad boy, but I have a quick question.
For smugglers, is this considered a heavy offensive attack that is your big climax, i.e. icing on the cake...or is it truly a last ditch effort to survive and escape?
If it is a last ditch effort (as the name suggests) would it be appropriate to have a long cooldown on all moves after using it (like not being able to attack for 10 seconds)
Do you guys hate to use it, or ache to use it?
Why do you ask?
Before I answer that question, I want to know why. What kind of answer are you looking for or are you merely trolling.
lurdanta wrote:
Why do you ask?
Before I answer that question, I want to know why. What kind of answer are you looking for or are you merely trolling.
Oukio Ovtiqui
Popdroid wrote:
Just leave the bloody smugglers alone till the revamp
I can now truly say that I hope its as glorious as the Jedi revamp!
Anaalin wrote:
SmugglinZane wrote:
Go watch Jango Fett in episode 2 again.Yeah, he shot one in the back. But BHs can already kill Jedi one on one, especially when hitting in the back. I usually mention that particular scene when saying can't kill one on one, but forgot this time.-Actually, there was a point where a Jedi ran towards Jango. Jango drew his pistol, fired one shot, which was deflected; a second, which struck the Jedi in the torso; and a third, which knocked the Jedi over the railing. Sounds like a one-on-one scenario where the Jedi attacked first.Also, I've watched a full group of 8 CL80 players get killed by an ancient krayt while 2 Jedi were able to take another one down. Granted, not all the regular template players were that good at what they were doing, but I also know that the Jedi weren't exactly using too many tactics either. It was more of a brute force attack.2 Jedi Knights, maybe. Haven't been one, so can't comment on that one. But I have also seen screen shots of a cl80 character soling a krayt, and he was not jedi. Don't know what his class was, but this was post-cu, and the party that was out there was a full group of Jedi, who were not doing quite as well, but were holding their own.
dubiousmastax wrote:
dlc3007 wrote:
Hey, can you tell me about all those cool, animated saber specials you have? Since they're so nifty, I was thinking they should have a 10 second cool-down timer on each of them.
Now.... how well do you think that would go over in the j3di forum?
Rude? Hell yes. j3di punks crying that armor break only increases their damage by 25% while half our profession is broken. Go back home to mama and suck on a saber, baby-boy.
lol actually we dont have animated saber specials. theyre trying to fix that.
Anaalin wrote:
Graxul wrote:
Ok I'll bite. I've never fought a jedi before. I've heard stories of jedi healing is better than a master doctor's healing ability.
Ok, I will bite back.
No, the max a jedi can heal is 1500 pts. There are stims that anyone can use that can heal that much.
How much does it heal? If it heals a lot would it be appropriate to have a long cooldown on all moves after using it (like not being able to attack for 10 seconds)
There already is a cooldown timer on it. It may not be much, but there is one.
Do you guys have to use it, or would you rather use something else?
Both. We have to use it, as most BHs now have weapons that will deal 1000-1200 pts of damage a shot, while the best sabers are around 700-800 pts of dmg per hit, and about the same speed.
We would much rather be able to survive without it.
Oh, to add to this. BHs generally don't hunt the higher level Jedi. They hunt those of us that have little or no chance at survival. So the healing doesn't let us compete even in a one-on-one, but basically allows us to try and flee.
Message Edited by Anaalin on 06-10-2005 12:44 PM
This is an illustration of my point before. if you come in asking about a special that you don't know about or never had used on you, then still say their should be a10 second cooldown timer on all moves....he's askin for one heck of a nerf right there and he doesn't even know much about the special.
dubiousmastax wrote:
I've never been hit with this bad boy, but I have a quick question.
For smugglers, is this considered a heavy offensive attack that is your big climax, i.e. icing on the cake...or is it truly a last ditch effort to survive and escape? This to me is a question. I have no problem answering it. Its info to make him more aware.
If it is a last ditch effort (as the name suggests) would it be appropriate to have a long cooldown on all moves after using it (like not being able to attack for 10 seconds) This however is a blatant nerf to a special he knows nothing about
Do you guys hate to use it, or ache to use it?
Graxul wrote:
Ok I'll bite. I've never fought a jedi before. I've heard stories of jedi healing is better than a master doctor's healing ability.
Ok, I will bite back.
No, the max a jedi can heal is 1500 pts. There are stims that anyone can use that can heal that much.
How much does it heal? If it heals a lot would it be appropriate to have a long cooldown on all moves after using it (like not being able to attack for 10 seconds)
There already is a cooldown timer on it. It may not be much, but there is one.
Do you guys have to use it, or would you rather use something else?
Both. We have to use it, as most BHs now have weapons that will deal 1000-1200 pts of damage a shot, while the best sabers are around 700-800 pts of dmg per hit, and about the same speed.
We would much rather be able to survive without it.
Message Edited by Anaalin on 06-10-2005 12:44 PM
see the similarity in phrasing there. It was a question to the original poster asking that if i went into the jedi forum and asked that I'd be flamed probably just as harshly as he was getting flamed here. I don't hate all jedi. its just the jedi that I don't know that I hate. I later stated a way to fix one ofPadawan's current problems trying to level with low damage lightsabers and getting visibility because you feel forced to group to get xp at a decent rate. I understand this as most professions do right now...we have to group to get xp and to level. In that regard Jedi and "mundanes" (whatarrogant jedi call non jedi) are the same.
Problem is your quick healing ability plus master defense is the only thing that keeps you alive against multiple opponents and to be honest a jedi without these abilities would probably be weaker than 1.5x a level 80 profession template. You have to have healing plus master defense or you'd get slaughtered like we do. Lightsaber damage probably is too weak, so are powers for that matter from what I have read of the Jedi forum. But as long as Master Defense and healing are as overpowered as they are now the other stuff can't be fixed till something else gets nerfed to counterbalance it. Lightsaber speed and accuracy stats need to be spread out a bit in other trees than just lightsaber mastery. Forgive me if I get the names of the skill trees wrong but I hope you're seeing the point here. A jedi should begreat with either a single hilt or a double hilt lightsaberpick up some defense maybe dabble in some powers spice it up a bit ya know. Not tied down to one template that they have to take. I hope you're seeing my point here. I know Jedi have problems like everyone else...but right now your profession the jedi are creating a lot of animosity by trying their best to get every profession out there that has a chance of killing them....nerfed....whenjedi are overbalanced to begin with.
Padawans are hunted by bounty hunters not to grief them...at least not originally anyway. It was to keepjedi numbers down. All the servers are overpopulated by jedi. Non Jedi can't even go special forces, unless they have several groups going special forces with them, to fight in the GCW againsttheir opposite factionnon jediplayers without getting slaughtered by one or two jedi who don't care about visibility or being hunted by bounty hunters. The only ones that truly suffer are the padawans that get forced into hiding in their homes or safe houses simply because they want toslow thepadawandown from grinding to be a jedi like all the others that show off their abilities in public and cuts non jedi out of the GCW. A lot of us would like to try to PvP against players that we at least have a chance with...rather than a pack of jedi that want to kill us because they can. Its getting to the point where you have to become a jedi in order to PvP or to participate in more of the "high end" game content in the game. All I ever wanted was to be a smuggler and smuggle stuff across the galaxy in my Yt. Is that so wrong? Thats where a lot of my animosity comes from against jedi. I actually am a Master Bounty Hunter/Smuggler but I've only taken one mission for a jedi. I chased him down on Rori where he was hunting. He discovered i was onto him so he made it to a safe house of one of his friends. I waited out there for an hour until one of his friends decided to pay me off...my price was just what the bounty was for 100k. I just wanted to test myself against a padawan to see what made him so special that it has caused so many nerfs to so many professions because of nerfherders. If a jedi can't or doesn't use it themselves and its used against them...they cry for a nerf on it. It has frustrated oh so many of us here.
Feign death actually works like we always thought it should...except it now has amuch higher failure rate at master smuggler than it used to. Our main attack pre cu was turned into a true last ditch attack. Most of our attacks can generally hurt us as much or more than they hurt others. But once they all work each will be risky attacks that could as easily help us win or just as easily make us lose. Being a smuggler is about making gambles...not just with cards but our very lives. We'd like our chances of winning to be fair...and not stacked against us. Which is exactly what the original poster was doing trying to stack the deck in his favor. He comes in asking a simple question we wouold have answered it...ask it with a proposed fix/nerf and we get hostile. And just as i said in the paragraph below what you quoted...If I posted something similar to what he said in the jedi forums then I would be flamed. Meanwhile he's trying to act like he did nothing wrong and he's now justified into thinking last ditch is uber when its balanced and working...one of the few specials we have that do work well. Just as healing is one of the few jedi abilities that jedi like well. That was my point.(my point toward the original poster of this thread). Anaalin I bear no ill will on you and was a pleasurechatting with you.
Message Edited by Graxul on 06-10-2005 07:46 PM
Graxul wrote:Which is exactly what the original poster was doing trying to stack the deck in his favor. He comes in asking a simple question we wouold have answered it...ask it with a proposed fix/nerf and we get hostile. And just as i said in the paragraph below what you quoted...If I posted something similar to what he said in the jedi forums then I would be flamed. Meanwhile he's trying to act like he did nothing wrong and he's now justified into thinking last ditch is uber when its balanced and working...one of the few specials we have that do work well. Just as healing is one of the few jedi abilities that jedi like well. That was my point.(my point toward the original poster of this thread). Anaalin I bear no ill will on you and was a pleasure chatting with you.Message Edited by Graxul on 06-10-200507:46 PM
Actually I was not trying to stack the deck in my favor at all. I am a finished template (therefore nothing to lose per se) and I havent been hunted in over 3 weeks. Also, I just posted last week in the jedi forum about my desire for tougher bounty hunter challenges. I welcome a good fight.
I made no comments about last ditch being uber. Last Ditch suffers from a serious image problem, and if you reread my question you'll see it has more to do with the attitude behind using it, than it does with the actual skill itself. My question about a cooldown timer was more a suggestion on how the move could reflect the attitude behind it. To be more specific, making it so that it is an escape only move.
Also, I guess you dont head to the Jedi forum too much, because if you did you'd see that jedi healing *is* being nerfed. Not *maybe* being nerfed. Not being looked at. It *is* being changed for the worse. We've had tons of posts from people about why this is a good thing, and I challenge you to find me flaming one of them.
PIE ANYONE?
*sets pie launcher to automatic*
piepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepiepie
Anaalin wrote:
Ternque01 wrote:
Do not expect me to buy this. I was a MBH/M.Rifles/Pistoleer 0404 for the past month and I hunted Jedi as a job. In that time, I killed 18 Jedi. Three were knights, a few were almost knight, alot of 150-190k Jedi, and quite a few 60-150k Jedi.
I have a 1017 max damage T-21 with wicked speed and action cost, and I will tell you from experience that I hit these Jedi for 700-800 TOPS.
I have lived your example, and I'm not buying.
I really couldn't care less if you buy it or not. I've seen it with my own eyes.
Hell, I respeced to Master Rifles JUST so I could use the Krayt T-21 I have that I used before, when I was TKM/Master Rifles.
And btw, I came here respectfully, and without malice. Calling someone a liar, and saying something can't possiblky be true because you can't do it is kinda rude.
Message Edited by Anaalin on 06-10-2005 02:36 PM
Don't get bent out of shape. I'm just telling you that I have never shot anyone over 1k damage with a 1017 max damage T-21 with MBH/MR/Pistoleer 0404, and that includes critical hits from Advanced Critical Shot.
I could shoot a nuna for nearly 2k, but not people.
I don't believe you. If you want to feel like a liar, that is your business, and more power to you.
I can't help but feel a little responsible for the way this thread turned out.
Can't we all just smoke a bong... I mean get along?
dubiousmastax wrote:
Graxul wrote:Which is exactly what the original poster was doing trying to stack the deck in his favor. He comes in asking a simple question we wouold have answered it...ask it with a proposed fix/nerf and we get hostile. And just as i said in the paragraph below what you quoted...If I posted something similar to what he said in the jedi forums then I would be flamed. Meanwhile he's trying to act like he did nothing wrong and he's now justified into thinking last ditch is uber when its balanced and working...one of the few specials we have that do work well. Just as healing is one of the few jedi abilities that jedi like well. That was my point.(my point toward the original poster of this thread). Anaalin I bear no ill will on you and was a pleasure chatting with you.Message Edited by Graxul on 06-10-200507:46 PM
Actually I was not trying to stack the deck in my favor at all. I am a finished template (therefore nothing to lose per se) and I havent been hunted in over 3 weeks. Also, I just posted last week in the jedi forum about my desire for tougher bounty hunter challenges. I welcome a good fight.
I made no comments about last ditch being uber. Last Ditch suffers from a serious image problem, and if you reread my question you'll see it has more to do with the attitude behind using it, than it does with the actual skill itself. My question about a cooldown timer was more a suggestion on how the move could reflect the attitude behind it. To be more specific, making it so that it is an escape only move.
Also, I guess you dont head to the Jedi forum too much, because if you did you'd see that jedi healing *is* being nerfed. Not *maybe* being nerfed. Not being looked at. It *is* being changed for the worse. We've had tons of posts from people about why this is a good thing, and I challenge you to find me flaming one of them.
I'm not rapping on Jedi here, understand... But when you're healing for nearly twice what I Do at Master Combat Medic and managing to do it more often... something's rotten in the state of Denmark.
And it is, believe me, nearly twice MCM. I hit 800 on a good day with my 110 med droid following me around, and take a BIG mind hit when I do. Yes, i have 3 seperate heals... but after each heal, I do nothing for 4-5 seconds or so. I'm pretty sure based on observation that the Jedi heal cooldown's a lot shorter.
I still don't know if that means Healer needs a nerf. But CM/Doc definitely could use a boost. We tie up a lot of skillpoints for a lot less benefit, even if MHealer were to hit for the same numbers we do. I know you're not saying it doesn't need one... but someone out there is probably about to.
Message Edited by CapnKate on 06-10-2005 09:54 PM
