Smuggler Archive
Thread: When (IF) smuggler bounties are introduced how will you change your template and why?
yimaz wrote:
Scoooter wrote:Well one thing they have not even done is define what is even a good reason for BH's to even hunt smugglers - what!?! read anyone of the 40,000,000 post on the best way to add us to the terminals, mainly threw smuggling related content as it should be.Jedi's are on the boards to gate their progress and Jedi's do have the ability to get to a point where they can handle themselves against a BH. Also the profession itself is outlawed. - true but as smugglers our profession is also outlawed.
The only reason for smugglers to get on the boards is if they fail to satisfy their customer (Jabba for example) or by slicing (the empire). - yep that what we are talking about come re-vamp time.
The empire despises BH's and only used them when they had no other recourse. - crime lords love BH's and use them to keep thugs and smugglers in check.
The CU is not adding much us except spices. - ummm we do have a combat line.
The problem is we spend a lot of skill points to be a hybrid service/combat/crafting class so we really cannot compete against BH's solo. - I have no problem PWNing BH's There is also no reason to gate a class that has a dwindelling population. Smugglers are rarer that Jedi already lol - as they should be it is a dangerous business we are in and its not about gating (its a game not a job) its about content, a challage and fun.
I will end up just being another method to grieve from everything I have read and will just make smugglers more non existant than they already are. - come on people really need to stop with the "greifing" thing. Many BH's and Jedi do have fun in the system and Im sorry but the galaxy is a dagerous place. If you can handle it pick a nice safe profession like ID (dont mean any disrespect but it makes me nuts when i see smugglers afraid to pay for breaking the law or burning a crime lord) What we do or would like to do (i.e. smuggle) is a crime and the people we work for are (for the most part) crime lords its dangerous and with out a lvl of danger the game is just weak.
You need to remember the empire only used BH's under extreme circumstances where they would admit they could not do the job themselves. And crime lords are ul;timately businessmen that would rather have you make it up to them and only place a bounty if it was absolutely necessary. - Not true a crime lord has no problem killing anyone who crosses them and the Empire, well they kill for fun and while they do use BH's as a last resort the galaxy is a big, big place so I find it very hard to believe that some Imperial Captin out there does not want a smuggler who embarrassed him infront of his commander dead. Nothing we do has any risk which is rediculous, nothing anyone does (not counting jedi) has any risk and that is not star wars, its not even an on-line game.
Message Edited by yimaz on 01-06-2005 03:18 PM
Are you a master smuggler or a dabbler.
And YAY we have one combat line and from what we have read nothing will be changed in it for the CU
We have 3 lines of non combat
Crime lords may or may not use a BH to settle business problems, they are under the law too so saying they would use a BH for someone who crosses the empire
And I am sorry you dont think there is pvp grieving out there. There is a small percentage of players that do that for kicks. Look what happened to Kessel. the little kiddie grievers decided to have a little of their fun.
Your normal imperial captain could not afford a BH, you need to separate what would be done in the name of a crime lord and what would be done in the cause of the state
Right now there is not a good case for implimenting the mechanic.
Like I said it sounds cool from a RP perspective but when you look at it from the game mechanics there is too many variables for grieving
When you go Jedi you sign up for that and all you can gain is combat. Smuggler is not that case. People have templates that dont necessary have a lot of combat and you will now go down teh road of forcing template changes on people which goes against the profession system
I have yet to see a reason the game needs smugglers to be on BH terminals other than a few that think it will be fun.
I have read all the posts on it.
And I gain I am sorry you dont see the grieving aspect. Many of do and have seen it first hand.
One constant in this gamem is pvp is not forced on all the standard classes (non Jedi) so taking one of the standard classes and making that non consentual pvp is fundametally wrong and will cause a lot of smugglers that have been patiently waiting for the revamp not want to do it anymore. Your effect will be gating the profession whether you see it that way or not. There are just too many people sick of the little kiddie grievers that inhabit the pvp comminity
Scoooter wrote:
Well one thing they have not even done is define what is even a good reason for BH's to even hunt smugglers - what!?! read anyone of the 40,000,000 post on the best way to add us to the terminals, mainly threw smuggling related content as it should be.
Jedi's are on the boards to gate their progress and Jedi's do have the ability to get to a point where they can handle themselves against a BH. Also the profession itself is outlawed. - true but as smugglers our profession is also outlawed.
The only reason for smugglers to get on the boards is if they fail to satisfy their customer (Jabba for example) or by slicing (the empire). - yep that what we are talking about come re-vamp time.
The empire despises BH's and only used them when they had no other recourse. - crime lords love BH's and use them to keep thugs and smugglers in check.
The CU is not adding much us except spices. - ummm we do have a combat line.
The problem is we spend a lot of skill points to be a hybrid service/combat/crafting class so we really cannot compete against BH's solo. - I have no problem PWNing BH's There is also no reason to gate a class that has a dwindelling population. Smugglers are rarer that Jedi already lol - as they should be it is a dangerous business we are in and its not about gating (its a game not a job) its about content, a challage and fun.
I will end up just being another method to grieve from everything I have read and will just make smugglers more non existant than they already are. - come on people really need to stop with the "greifing" thing. Many BH's and Jedi do have fun in the system and Im sorry but the galaxy is a dagerous place. If you can handle it pick a nice safe profession like ID (dont mean any disrespect but it makes me nuts when i see smugglers afraid to pay for breaking the law or burning a crime lord) What we do or would like to do (i.e. smuggle) is a crime and the people we work for are (for the most part) crime lords its dangerous and with out a lvl of danger the game is just weak.
You need to remember the empire only used BH's under extreme circumstances where they would admit they could not do the jobthemselves. And crime lords are ul;timately businessmen that would rather have you make it up to them and only place a bounty if it was absolutely necessary. - Not true a crime lord has no problem killing anyone who crosses them and the Empire, well they kill for fun and while they do use BH's as a last resort the galaxy is a big, big place so I find it very hard to believe that some Imperial Captin out there does not want a smuggler who embarrassed him infront of his commander dead. Nothing we do has any risk which is rediculous, nothing anyone does (not counting jedi) has any risk and that is not star wars, its not even an on-line game.
Message Edited by yimaz on 01-06-2005 03:18 PM
Message Edited by BeigeKnight on 01-08-2005 07:28 PM
Scoooter wrote:
Are you a master smuggler or a dabbler. - try looking at my sig Im a master smuggler and been one since launch.
And YAY we have one combat line and from what we have read nothing will be changed in it for the CU - and your point?
We have 3 lines of non combat - correct we are not a combat profession again what is your point.
Crime lords may or may not use a BH to settle business problems, they are under the law too - lol go tell jabba thatso saying they would use a BH for someone who crosses the empire - huh??
And I am sorry you dont think there is pvp grieving out there. There is a small percentage of players that do that for kicks. - i never said that and again Im not going to let a few kids ruin my fun. I few punks should not dictate how you play a game. Look what happened to Kessel. the little kiddie grievers decided to have a little of their fun. - who cares it comes with this type of game get use to it.
Your normal imperial captain could not afford a BH, - says who? you.you need to separate what would be done in the name of a crime lord and what would be done in the cause of the state - ok fine then crime lords only put bountys on smugglers, i was only countering your points.
Right now there is not a good case for implimenting the mechanic. - OMG right now we are waiting on a re-vamp and if it goes the way we would like it then there is no reason not to add us to the terminals. How many times do people who want smugglers on the terms have to say AFTER/DURING THE RE-VAMP is when this should be looked at.
Like I said it sounds cool from a RP perspective but when you look at it from the game mechanics there is too many variables for grieving - again why are you so afraid of PVP, griefing is not a common as you think it is. Too many people cry grief when they loose a fight and that is not griefing. Is there griefing in this game, sure. But its in every aspect of the game and usually a low %. Again why ruin a chance for player conternt over a small % of arses.
When you go Jedi you sign up for that and all you can gain is combat. Smuggler is not that case. People have templates that dont necessary have a lot of combat and you will now go down teh road of forcing template changes on people which goes against the profession system - or they will stay off the boards like jedi hwho dont want to be hunted and to say smugglers did not sign up for being put on the terms is just silly, come on what we do is illegal.
I have yet to see a reason the game needs smugglers to be on BH terminals other than a few that think it will be fun. - reason?? Its a game with no really content and it needs a little fun added.
I have read all the posts on it.
And I gain I am sorry you dont see the grieving aspect. Many of do and have seen it first hand. - OMG ive seen it first hand as well again its a freakin game who cares. Griefing is a small issue not a hugh one.
One constant in this gamem is pvp is not forced on all the standard classes (non Jedi) so taking one of the standard classes and making that non consentual pvp is fundametally wrong and will cause a lot of smugglers that have been patiently waiting for the revamp not want to do it anymore. Your effect will be gating the profession whether you see it that way or not. There are just too many people sick of the little kiddie grievers that inhabit the pvp comminity - again your not looking at smuggler after the CU, after the GSW re-vamp and after our re-vamp. That bottom line is this. Smugglers do illegal work for people and if there is not risk involved with it then its not really living in the underworld. Smugglers should have a combat class that they wantin addition to the smuggler profession because we are not a combat class but need to survive in a dangerous galaxy doing a dangerous job.Again if your so afraid of possible grief then pick a nice safe profession.
Stena wrote:
Urmm..did this ever cross your mind, dont get on the terms...
Scoooter wrote:
yimaz wrote:
Scoooter wrote:
Well one thing they have not even done is define what is even a good reason for BH's to even hunt smugglers - what!?! read anyone of the 40,000,000 post on the best way to add us to the terminals, mainly threw smuggling related content as it should be.
Jedi's are on the boards to gate their progress and Jedi's do have the ability to get to a point where they can handle themselves against a BH. Also the profession itself is outlawed. - true but as smugglers our profession is also outlawed.
The only reason for smugglers to get on the boards is if they fail to satisfy their customer (Jabba for example) or by slicing (the empire). - yep that what we are talking about come re-vamp time.
The empire despises BH's and only used them when they had no other recourse. - crime lords love BH's and use them to keep thugs and smugglers in check.
The CU is not adding much us except spices. - ummm we do have a combat line.
The problem is we spend a lot of skill points to be a hybrid service/combat/crafting class so we really cannot compete against BH's solo. - I have no problem PWNing BH's There is also no reason to gate a class that has a dwindelling population. Smugglers are rarer that Jedi already lol - as they should be it is a dangerous business we are in and its not about gating (its a game not a job) its about content, a challage and fun.
I will end up just being another method to grieve from everything I have read and will just make smugglers more non existant than they already are. - come on people really need to stop with the "greifing" thing. Many BH's and Jedi do have fun in the system and Im sorry but the galaxy is a dagerous place. If you can handle it pick a nice safe profession like ID (dont mean any disrespect but it makes me nuts when i see smugglers afraid to pay for breaking the law or burning a crime lord) What we do or would like to do (i.e. smuggle) is a crime and the people we work for are (for the most part) crime lords its dangerous and with out a lvl of danger the game is just weak.
You need to remember the empire only used BH's under extreme circumstances where they would admit they could not do the job themselves. And crime lords are ul;timately businessmen that would rather have you make it up to them and only place a bounty if it was absolutely necessary. - Not true a crime lord has no problem killing anyone who crosses them and the Empire, well they kill for fun and while they do use BH's as a last resort the galaxy is a big, big place so I find it very hard to believe that some Imperial Captin out there does not want a smuggler who embarrassed him infront of his commander dead. Nothing we do has any risk which is rediculous, nothing anyone does (not counting jedi) has any risk and that is not star wars, its not even an on-line game.
Message Edited by yimaz on 01-06-2005 03:18 PM
Are you a master smuggler or a dabbler.
And YAY we have one combat line and from what we have read nothing will be changed in it for the CU
We have 3 lines of non combat
Crime lords may or may not use a BH to settle business problems, they are under the law too so saying they would use a BH for someone who crosses the empire
And I am sorry you dont think there is pvp grieving out there. There is a small percentage of players that do that for kicks. Look what happened to Kessel. the little kiddie grievers decided to have a little of their fun.
Your normal imperial captain could not afford a BH, you need to separate what would be done in the name of a crime lord and what would be done in the cause of the state
Right now there is not a good case for implimenting the mechanic.
Like I said it sounds cool from a RP perspective but when you look at it from the game mechanics there is too many variables for grieving
When you go Jedi you sign up for that and all you can gain is combat. Smuggler is not that case. People have templates that dont necessary have a lot of combat and you will now go down teh road of forcing template changes on people which goes against the profession system
I have yet to see a reason the game needs smugglers to be on BH terminals other than a few that think it will be fun.
I have read all the posts on it.
And I gain I am sorry you dont see the grieving aspect. Many of do and have seen it first hand.
One constant in this gamem is pvp is not forced on all the standard classes (non Jedi) so taking one of the standard classes and making that non consentual pvp is fundametally wrong and will cause a lot of smugglers that have been patiently waiting for the revamp not want to do it anymore. Your effect will be gating the profession whether you see it that way or not. There are just too many people sick of the little kiddie grievers that inhabit the pvp comminity
Did it ever cross you mind that things need to be balanced correctly before this is even considered
From what I have been told the original beta included bounties on players and was removed becauseof the potential grieving.
Now if you lock the new smuggler revamp in with getting on the terms you will force particular tamplates on smugglers which goes aganst the profession systen and furthermore will be a slap in the face to most of the smugglers that have been waiting a long time for the revamp.
I have PVP'd a lot and I have seen enough grieving pvp'ers and most of those are BH's right now so they can hunt Jedi. If anyone things this will not lead to player grieving they are sadly mistaken or are in fact PVP grievers themselves.
Like I stated from a RP perspective it's cool. From a game mechanic perspective it is lame. SOE is not good in recognizing that there are little kiddies out there that get their rocks off grieving people. Looked what happened to Kessel in JTL
Scoooter wrote:
Did it ever cross you mind that things need to be balanced correctly before this is even considered - OMG how many times does it have to be posted WE ARE TALKING DURING/AFTER OUR RE-VAMP WHICH IS AFTER THE CU!!!!!!!
From what I have been told the original beta included bounties on players and was removed becauseof the potential grieving. - GRIEFING, GRIEFING, GRIEFING why do you play this game if your so worried about people messing with you?
Now if you lock the new smuggler revamp in with getting on the terms you will force particular tamplates on smugglers which goes aganst the profession systen and furthermore will be a slap in the face to most of the smugglers that have been waiting a long time for the revamp. - that makes no sence what so ever.
I have PVP'd a lot and I have seen enough grieving pvp'ers and most of those are BH's right now so they can hunt Jedi. If anyone things this will not lead to player grieving they are sadly mistaken or are in fact PVP grievers themselves. - /rolleyes
Like I stated from a RP perspective it's cool. From a game mechanic perspective it is lame. SOE is not good in recognizing that there are little kiddies out there that get their rocks off grieving people. Looked what happened to Kessel in JTL - OMG go play mario brothers.
Message Edited by yimaz on 01-10-2005 11:12 AM
yimaz wrote:
Scoooter wrote:
Did it ever cross you mind that things need to be balanced correctly before this is even considered - OMG how many times does it have to be posted WE ARE TALKING DURING/AFTER OUR RE-VAMP WHICH IS AFTER THE CU!!!!!!!
From what I have been told the original beta included bounties on players and was removed becauseof the potential grieving. - GRIEFING, GRIEFING, GRIEFING why do you play this game if your so worried about people messing with you?
Now if you lock the new smuggler revamp in with getting on the terms you will force particular tamplates on smugglers which goes aganst the profession systen and furthermore will be a slap in the face to most of the smugglers that have been waiting a long time for the revamp. - that makes no sence what so ever.
I have PVP'd a lot and I have seen enough grieving pvp'ers and most of those are BH's right now so they can hunt Jedi. If anyone things this will not lead to player grieving they are sadly mistaken or are in fact PVP grievers themselves. - /rolleyes
Like I stated from a RP perspective it's cool. From a game mechanic perspective it is lame. SOE is not good in recognizing that there are little kiddies out there that get their rocks off grieving people. Looked what happened to Kessel in JTL - OMG go play mario brothers.
Your only defense is griefing and thats just a weak defense. Ive seen true Griefing, Ive PVP'd and Ive seen people cry Griefing when they were not griefed they just lost. We are Smugglers, what we do is illegal if you cant stand the heat get off the sun.
Message Edited by yimaz on 01-10-2005 11:12 AM
It is already know the CU will not bring us much other than spice changes.
I have seen true grieving also, one of the problems is SOE is not good at forseeing it and placing in the proper mechanics to stop it. My lack of confidence is in SOE itself to add this for the RP aspect and not screw things up. You need to trust I know the difference between grieving and losing.
And I am sorry you do not see that this will force smugglers to change templates. They will have to change to a pvp template in a class that has very few combat advantages. 3 lines do not provide combat abilities.
If you want to be constructive stop the smart remarks and try to brainstorm some mechanics to help the issues brought forth
Scoooter wrote:
It is already know the CU will not bring us much other than spice changes. - really so it wont affect the dirty fighting line?
I have seen true grieving also, one of the problems is SOE is not good at forseeing it and placing in the proper mechanics to stop it. My lack of confidence is in SOE itself to add this for the RP aspect and not screw things up. You need to trust I know the difference between grieving and losing.- if that were true you would know that griefing is not such amajor issue that it would stop a strong smuggler/BH system.
And I am sorry you do not see that this will force smugglers to change templates. - what are you talking about smugglers need a combat profession for any pvp or pve combat now. I dont know many smugglers who PVE or PVP with nothing more then Smuggler today so tell me againhow this would change? They will have to change to a pvp template in a class that has very few combat advantages. 3 lines do not provide combat abilities. - see above
If you want to be constructive stop the smart remarks and try to brainstorm some mechanics to help the issues brought forth - Ive posted on that topic more times then I care to comment on so rather then just saying Smugglers cant be on the BH terms cause of griefing maybe you should look threw the 1,000,000's of strong ideas many smugglers including myself have come up with. Spare me the constructive crap if you paid attention at all in the last 11months you would have seen all the times Ive posted my ideas on Smugglers vs BH'sand being a smart arse is who I am, sorry if Ive hurt your feelings.
I will say it yet again, Smuggler IS an illegal profession and with no RISK it is pointless to try and say we are anything other then spice/slice monkeys. We need to be able tosmuggle and we need to have risk involvedwith it. It is just that simple.....
Message Edited by yimaz on 01-10-2005 01:41 PM
yimaz wrote:
Scoooter wrote:
I will say it yet again, Smuggler IS an illegal profession and with no RISK it is pointless to try and say we are anything other then spice/slice monkeys. We need to be able tosmuggle and we need to have risk involvedwith it. It is just that simple.....
Message Edited by yimaz on 01-10-2005 01:41 PM
So don't get caught.
MavriK512 wrote:
Man, scoooter, stop being such a wimp. If you don't want on the terminals, you don't fail the missions! If you want to make sure you don't fail missions, you don't [i]do[/i] the missions. Things that are illegal come with risks. You won't feel the punishment if you don't get caught.
So don't get caught.
Its not about being a wimp, its about yet another point added to the game that will allow grieving. SOE has a track record of not listenening to beta testers, and not seeing where grieving can and will happen. I have been around long enough and have no faith. Like I pointed out look what happened to Kessel.
Give that the CU will not give us any worthwhile combat upgrades andwe will have to move to pvp oriented templates. Forcing templates is not what SWG is about.
You are asking those that have been waiting for a long time for the revamp to have faith in SOE and change their templates if they want the extra content.
There are other ways one could get caught and feel punishment than having PLAYER BH's come after them. Lets face it thats where the problem lies in all cases of grieving. There are little kiddies out that that think that making a players life miserable is great fun. That mentality exists. Add to that the smuggler typically does not have the combat skill to handle a BH you will be forcing all those that do not have a 100% pvp template to do so.
I have doen a lot of pvp, I didnt stop because I lost, I can deal with losing in pvp. I stopped because of grieving, exploting and all that BS
yimaz wrote:
Scoooter wrote:
yimaz wrote:
Scoooter wrote:
MavriK512 wrote:
If all goes as it should, players will have the option of taking [i]low risk[/i] missions. That means missions that won't get you on the terminals if you mess up. In this way, the devs would be giving people the option of player bounties put on their heads. If you make the concious decision to have a BH hunt you, you better be well prepared, and not just for the fight, but for the possibility that the BH that gets you is going to be a real jerk and grief you.
But to reduce the accessable content because SOE cannot control an area of the community in a PVP by consent only game is flat out wrong. - consent to PVP is worthless people need to stop being afraid to fight its kinda the point of gaming over all.
You fail to see why fewer people PVP every day. SWG is a PVP by consent game. People are not locked out of content because they do not want PVP, and thats what you are asking for.OMG no, smuggler bounties is one small addition of content and people dont PVP these days because the combat system is out of wack that is the only reason why people dont pvp and the reason they are doing a CU.
Jedi by what thay can build in their template sign up for it. Jedi in itself is a stand alone PVP template.i pointed out in a post you dont seem to want to answer that we as smugglers now have to add some other combat to our temp, whats changing...nothing.It's made with the fact PVP will happen. Smuggler isn't. So again you are forcing template changes on people to get at content when the base profession does not support well with pvp. - again not true
Yes we do add combat but there is a major difference in what you need for a PVP template. So yes you are forcing a PVP template to get top all the content - not after the CU and not after or re-vamp.
There has to be a better way - so what we do being illegal and Han being hunted by a Bounty Hunter does not fit into any of this for you does it?
No what doesnt fit is the risk vs reward does not have to involve players policing us. - who better? not talking about the kiddies but really who better then other players its called player content and something that is sorely missing from this game
You may enjoy PVP, I used to. Not everyone does. Now address how you would solve the issues instead of just "too bad".- again read one of the 1,000,000'sof threads that have been posted on this topic, did you not see me state that in like 3 other posts. Or read some of the short answers that people have posted in the last 5 posts.Because it is all risk versus reward and you have not come up with a single argument on why that has to be aPLAYER bounty other than you obviosly not fed up with pvp yet. - I want a CU a great deal and this has nothing to do with pvp. Why is it so hard for you to get that players hunting players who break the law is content. Adds a bit of chaos and unpredictablity this in turn = FUN. In like 30 posts many people have said this is after a CU and after our re-vamp but you either ignore that or just dont seem to get it at all.
You have far too much faith in the CU and are making a blanket assumtion that it will make everything all better. SOE does not have a track record of having the common sense to impliment player added content correctly. JTL is a big example of that. Look at Kessel, they refused to listen to the beta testers to make what would have been fun RP content in mixed PVP/PVE content and ended up having to pull pvp out of it.
And no I am not ignoring that this is after the CU, but the CU and revamp do not focus on our combat abilities and I have zero faith in SOE's ability to add this.
Again address the issues.
Message Edited by yimaz on 01-10-2005 03:47 PM