Smuggler Archive
Thread: HoC SWG Chat log
Erynder
Tue Aug 30, 2005 2:15 am
#313
Tiggs, you areforced to lie to us by the dev team. We, as customers, are the most unlucky group of paying customers. But we are so big fans of Star Wars universe, we are suckers. We will accept and go on logging, just to see the Stormtroopers marching around.
I am not scared to be banned, so I will honestly tell you what I think about SOE. SOE has decided to make Jedi rare, strong and very dangerous. Which was the right thing to do. Saber TEF, 4444 Guardians, permadeath...being a Jedi was the ultimate goal of 80% players. But, it was scary, too.
Then, SOE has realized WOW and EQ2 were too strong contentwise. Which is true. So, they turned their route from keeping Jedi rare to making Jedi the money-cow. Because neither wow nor eq2 can compete with the Jedi love inside me. I am playing all of the games above, swg, wow and eq2. But nothing feels like igniting my saber.
So you opened the gates of hell, village. It was not enough. You released ROTW, a BH free planet. You removed xp loss. You removed group visibility. You ( Not personally you, but SOE as a company ) wanted EVERYONE to be a Jedi. But came on the boards saying '' Jedi population is high, we don't like it ''. This is a lie. Because even when someone gets bored of their Jedi, they sell it on eBay, and you still get your 15 bucks. Jedi = Continous subscription.
You wanna know your current game ? One million Jedi running around aimlessly ( because there is no FRS ), a pointless GCW ( Because the base I destroyed can be placed 2 miliseconds later ), disgusted professions hating Jedi and blaming them for everything happened. ( Altough as a Jedi I have been downgraded to a regular profession from a 4444 Jedi Guardian ).
Currently, some profesisons can use skills that they have dropped. Jedi can have Lightsabers with 2346 pearls in them. They can bug their Forcerun and run faster without the damage mitigation of FR2 and FR3. A pistoleer can use stopping shot 2 every 2 seconds. So many exploits...
Your game is so buggy and exploitable, I quit playing, because I don't want to exploit. I am tired of seeing exploiters. I PMed you a few of them, you answered me, I told you the steps and ASKED you to punish the exploiters. You did nothing.
What could have been done ? You could have kept Jedi rare, and you could have given regular profesisons elite upgrades. Like another 250 points. So they can be advanced Fencers, TKMs, Riflemen. The grind should take as long as a Jedi. So, everyone shouldn't be Jedi, but still you could have Advanced professions who could fight Jedi toe to toe.
You could have made cities Strongholds. You could have let bases only be built inside cities. So current lag and pointless GCW wouldn't be here.
You could have improved NPC AI. I want SBDs to use concussion shot on healers, stasis on me. Your thought of MOB POWER is a SBD shooting for 1500 damage. Is that all SOE learnt from all their gaming past ? MOB POWER is not the ability to one hit kill players. MOB POWER is the ability to disable players so they take the advantage of having high HAMs.
But you chose to make Jedi money-cow. I wish I could have given you the market values of making Jedi money-cow, and making the changes I have suggested. What I know is, many friends who have left this game would still be here, because they agree with me.
And to all people mourning about Mustafar. They chose Mustafar because it was in the movies. Simple as that. SOE is so focused on direct '' Gaining new subscriptions '', they completely and utterly ignore their current customers. Maybe every marketing book I have read is wrong and SOE is right. because every marketing book tells us Loyal Customers are about 4-5X more valuable and cheaper to keep than gaining new ones.
The above ''You'' phrases is not you, Tiggs. It is SOE. Maybe you agree with me. Maybe Devs agree with me. But I know who doesn't. SOE's Executive Director who makes the desicions in his Armani suit, probably someone who never played an online game in his life. This is why wow has 3.5 million subscribers and swg has ( probably ) less than 300k. And please let me tell you, wow's graphics SUCK, and wow does not have player cities. But there is a guy up there in Blizzard, who has played online games, and knows what his customers need.
I wonder how hard can it be to pay money to someone intelligent, and likes to play games.
Here, a simple idea :Make Emperor's retreat an ImperialSTRONGHOLD which can be raided by at least 100 rebels. Place NPCs, AT-STs, AT-ATs everywhere. Add a system message when attacked so that every Imperial knows when it's attacked.As soon as you do this, people will stop complaining about GCW, and Rebels will raid and Imperials will defend there. Then spread this all over the Galaxy.
Wanna bet ?
All you need to do is to hire an intelligent player who has vision, dedication and creativity. Then all your problems can be solved. You really didn't have to sell Jedi. You have Star Wars to sell.
Jaguarrr
Tue Aug 30, 2005 2:28 am
#314
"Regarding the Smuggler upgrade it will come."
Tiggs wrote:
Landlubber wrote:
Tiggs wrote:
Regarding the Smuggler upgrade it will come.
Whoa... am I the only one who's had a serious deja vu feeling right now?
The point is, we heard it all before, but when are you (meaning SOE, not you personally Tiggs) going to deliver? That's the problem, you see: we've had so many broken promises that there's hardly anyone around that will take the above statement seriously. At least I know that I'll believe in it when I see it, not one second sooner.
And anyway, what happened to JFreeman's "We're going to stop promising a Smuggler Revamp we never seem to get around to deliver"?? Maybe you should heed that advice, Tiggs. Because making promises like this only opens you up to flames, when yet again your Dev team won't come through.
I try not to make promises I can't keep =)
or
"Monster waffle devours subway in Berlin."
What do you think I believe more?
Yes, I am going to write my condolences to the subway company of Berlin.
Mythor
Tue Aug 30, 2005 2:30 am
#315
(Rogue_5) Mustafar is now actually an infamous planet as part of the Star Wars universe. It is the key turning point in Episode III where Obi-Wan and Anakin fought their famous final battle. But questions remain, what was going on there and why were they there... Find out in Trials of Obi-Wan!
Things like this are what gets the community (or at least me) so enraged.
Has Rogue_5 even seen the movie? I'd've thought that would be a prerequisite to being on the Dev Team for this new expansion.
Anakin was there to assassinate the leaders of the Seperatist movement.
Obi Wan tagged along with Padme, who went there to find Anakin. Obi Wan was hoping to talk Anakin away from the dark side.
PERIOD.
There was nothing "going on there", in relation to those two characters. Those are the reasons both were there. The end!
Don't try and feed us a pack of lies with that as the preface. It's wrong.
The simple truth is, any "storyline" attached to Obi Wan's spirit being on Mustafar, talking to all and sundry, is a complete fabrication invented solely to cash in on those gullible enough to buy the latest bundled boxed copy when the Episode III DVD comes out. Every piece of information that has been released only serves to confirm this.
Mustafar does not appear and is never mentioned in any movie, other than Episode III.
"Blue Glowies" have never once appeared to anyone that is not at least Force Sensitive, in any of the movies. Even Leia, herself an "FS", could not see her own father at the end of "Jedi".
Now this talk of there being some hidden reason behind Anakin and Obi Wan being on Mustafar? Give me a break. You know "That Cool Lava World At The End Of The Movie" will sell lots of boxes. And hey, if you can talk to Obi Wan? Wow! Sold!
The whole premise of this game was supposed to be that it is set in the "Classic" movie time frame, with the "Galactic Civil War" being fought all over the galaxy.
And you give us a planet that is only mentioned in one single movie? One that isn't even part of the original 3?
The game still has a lot of potential to be fun, but continuing to give us "content" that is not at all what most of us bought the game for - and subscribed to for years - is downright rude.
You know the number one planet the player base wants - Hoth.
You know Hoth would draw in a lot of folk who still prefer the original trilogy.
You know the playerbase is not fussed as to whether Hoth is an open world or is an instanced area.
You know the playerbase would love to fight the GCW on Hoth
And you know they would even likely overlook the GCW's other shortcomings in exchange.
You've had three chances to actually add something the existing playerbase really wants (Hoth or other appropriate settings) and you've wasted two of those times on adding things from outside the 'current' timeline.
The other time you 'added' something (Space) that should have been in the game at launch.
The reason people get so furious and express it so loudly is because there's still so much potential in the game, but at every turn it seems the developers are finding new and exciting ways to screw things up.
"Two steps forward, fourteen steps back" seems to be the motto.
But eh, there's no point. Unless a thread reaches 300 pages, or affects the Jedi/BH 'communities', the devs don't care. That has become painfully apparent of late. :-/
Things like this are what gets the community (or at least me) so enraged.
Has Rogue_5 even seen the movie? I'd've thought that would be a prerequisite to being on the Dev Team for this new expansion.
Anakin was there to assassinate the leaders of the Seperatist movement.
Obi Wan tagged along with Padme, who went there to find Anakin. Obi Wan was hoping to talk Anakin away from the dark side.
PERIOD.
There was nothing "going on there", in relation to those two characters. Those are the reasons both were there. The end!
Don't try and feed us a pack of lies with that as the preface. It's wrong.
The simple truth is, any "storyline" attached to Obi Wan's spirit being on Mustafar, talking to all and sundry, is a complete fabrication invented solely to cash in on those gullible enough to buy the latest bundled boxed copy when the Episode III DVD comes out. Every piece of information that has been released only serves to confirm this.
Mustafar does not appear and is never mentioned in any movie, other than Episode III.
"Blue Glowies" have never once appeared to anyone that is not at least Force Sensitive, in any of the movies. Even Leia, herself an "FS", could not see her own father at the end of "Jedi".
Now this talk of there being some hidden reason behind Anakin and Obi Wan being on Mustafar? Give me a break. You know "That Cool Lava World At The End Of The Movie" will sell lots of boxes. And hey, if you can talk to Obi Wan? Wow! Sold!
The whole premise of this game was supposed to be that it is set in the "Classic" movie time frame, with the "Galactic Civil War" being fought all over the galaxy.
And you give us a planet that is only mentioned in one single movie? One that isn't even part of the original 3?
The game still has a lot of potential to be fun, but continuing to give us "content" that is not at all what most of us bought the game for - and subscribed to for years - is downright rude.
You know the number one planet the player base wants - Hoth.
You know Hoth would draw in a lot of folk who still prefer the original trilogy.
You know the playerbase is not fussed as to whether Hoth is an open world or is an instanced area.
You know the playerbase would love to fight the GCW on Hoth
And you know they would even likely overlook the GCW's other shortcomings in exchange.
You've had three chances to actually add something the existing playerbase really wants (Hoth or other appropriate settings) and you've wasted two of those times on adding things from outside the 'current' timeline.
The other time you 'added' something (Space) that should have been in the game at launch.
The reason people get so furious and express it so loudly is because there's still so much potential in the game, but at every turn it seems the developers are finding new and exciting ways to screw things up.
"Two steps forward, fourteen steps back" seems to be the motto.
But eh, there's no point. Unless a thread reaches 300 pages, or affects the Jedi/BH 'communities', the devs don't care. That has become painfully apparent of late. :-/
Message Edited by Mythor on 08-30-2005 09:33 PM
TsothaLanti
Tue Aug 30, 2005 2:33 am
#316
Tiggs wrote:
I will pass on your ideas for future expansions however this is decided upon by people higher on the food chain them me. Regarding the Smuggler upgrade it will come.
snorpy wrote:
SO once again SOE decides to jump on the Epsiode 3 badn wagon and ignore the time line. Aren't we in between Episodes 4 and 5 supposedly? I guess not. Wouldn't it make sense to listen to 2 planets that the comunity has asked for since day one? Hoth and Bespin are the nest planets in the time line. Each would grant great opurtunities for game play. But hell no... let's just biggy back on the episode 3 DVD launch...
and I ask WHY THE HELL IS OBI WAN's BLUE GLOWY GHOST HANGING OUT ON MUSTAFAR, when he is talking in Lukes head? I mean seriousy, doesn't he have more important things to think about? Such has becomign more powerful than Darth Vader can imagine by training luke from beyond the grave? I mean if he's on Mustafar, how does Luke find Yoda? Or get enough training to not get his ass handed to him on a porcelain platter by vader @ Bespin. Oh wait that's right. SOE rewrites the entire Star Wars story to fill their pockets.
Now see with Hoth we could have gotten a GCW boost... could have even maybe been a GCW expansion. Many things could be added, espionage, crafting, and destroy missions, from Vader, Leia, and others. Rebels could try to craft better components for the shields around the power generator, or better capacitors for stronger weapons. The espionage, and destroy missions are kind of self explainatory, finding out where the enemy is located and then blowing it up.
With Bespin, you could get some cool adventure quests through cloud city. Crafters, would get the ability to mine gas from the gas mines for special new schematics and components. Player could get quests from Lando to help his cloud city prosper. Could even write in a sub story about a rival trying to sabotage his mine.
Also there could easily be included into both ideas a chance for smugglers, to oh I don't know, ACTUALLY SMUGGLE! Smuggle shipments from one mine to a seller, or smuggle weapons in and out of enemy camps.
it seems obvious to me, that SOE has no clue where they want this game to go, and that they only care about making a quick buck, and they don't care if they destroy parts of Star Wars in the process.
I am very disapointed, as I was actually starting to enjoy the game again. But right now, this expansion to me is well for lack of a better term... BANTHA POODOO!!! I really hope they offer more than running quests for a Main Character that is in a spot, that it makes no sense for him to be in. But this to me seems like it's going to make or break SWG, I for one hope the DEV's come up with somehting and let us know what it is soon, but I will not be getting this expansion until I know that there's something i am going to like, so far, from what I've seen... We can't tell you but you're going to love it... isn't cutting it, and it's a total BS answer... SO you know what SOE, i can't tell you I am going to buy this, but you may not like it!
just my 2 cents.
/end rant
Very well said, Snorpy. Tiggs, would you be so kind as to tell me whether the clever cheaps up there in the food chain have ideas like these in mind? There are excellent (I mean EXECELLENT) ideas posted in these forums (all professions), and the impression posters have is that they are not read or taken into consideration.
In my humble opinion, it would not hurt anyone if official posts were made once a week stating things like (for instance): "we've got Hoth in mind as a future expansion, but first we want to have atmospheric flight and vehicle combats ready" (from the Fan Fest in Leipzig). I mean, does it have to be in a Fan Fest, with a bunch T21 aiming at that dev's head, that he let us know something like that?
You know, people's been asking for Hoth and Bespin for two years, and also for the timeline to be followed, and I can perfectly understand that SOE wants to make profit from Episode III but, is it so hard to make official announcements like this? Information is not bad for anyone. Other announcements I can think of would be related to the smugglers revamp, things you're working on (vehicle combat, capital ships). You know, create a list with what you're working on, which are the preferences, etc. So, at least, people can see "his/her name" in that list and know what's going on. There is no need to make promises, no need to add timelines to that list, just communicate, just make the community feel they are more than customers that pay every month.
Quiet420
Tue Aug 30, 2005 2:42 am
#317
Jaguarrr wrote:
"Monster waffle devours subway in Berlin."
MMM....Waffle.
QuantumArtist
Tue Aug 30, 2005 3:32 am
#318
Tiggs wrote:
I will pass on your ideas for future expansions however this is decided upon by people higher on the food chain them me. Regarding the Smuggler upgrade it will come.
snorpy wrote:
SO once again SOE decides to jump on the Epsiode 3 badn wagon and ignore the time line. Aren't we in between Episodes 4 and 5 supposedly? I guess not. Wouldn't it make sense to listen to 2 planets that the comunity has asked for since day one? Hoth and Bespin are the nest planets in the time line. Each would grant great opurtunities for game play. But hell no... let's just biggy back on the episode 3 DVD launch...
and I ask WHY THE HELL IS OBI WAN's BLUE GLOWY GHOST HANGING OUT ON MUSTAFAR, when he is talking in Lukes head? I mean seriousy, doesn't he have more important things to think about? Such has becomign more powerful than Darth Vader can imagine by training luke from beyond the grave? I mean if he's on Mustafar, how does Luke find Yoda? Or get enough training to not get his ass handed to him on a porcelain platter by vader @ Bespin. Oh wait that's right. SOE rewrites the entire Star Wars story to fill their pockets.
Now see with Hoth we could have gotten a GCW boost... could have even maybe been a GCW expansion. Many things could be added, espionage, crafting, and destroy missions, from Vader, Leia, and others. Rebels could try to craft better components for the shields around the power generator, or better capacitors for stronger weapons. The espionage, and destroy missions are kind of self explainatory, finding out where the enemy is located and then blowing it up.
With Bespin, you could get some cool adventure quests through cloud city. Crafters, would get the ability to mine gas from the gas mines for special new schematics and components. Player could get quests from Lando to help his cloud city prosper. Could even write in a sub story about a rival trying to sabotage his mine.
Also there could easily be included into both ideas a chance for smugglers, to oh I don't know, ACTUALLY SMUGGLE! Smuggle shipments from one mine to a seller, or smuggle weapons in and out of enemy camps.
it seems obvious to me, that SOE has no clue where they want this game to go, and that they only care about making a quick buck, and they don't care if they destroy parts of Star Wars in the process.
I am very disapointed, as I was actually starting to enjoy the game again. But right now, this expansion to me is well for lack of a better term... BANTHA POODOO!!! I really hope they offer more than running quests for a Main Character that is in a spot, that it makes no sense for him to be in. But this to me seems like it's going to make or break SWG, I for one hope the DEV's come up with somehting and let us know what it is soon, but I will not be getting this expansion until I know that there's something i am going to like, so far, from what I've seen... We can't tell you but you're going to love it... isn't cutting it, and it's a total BS answer... SO you know what SOE, i can't tell you I am going to buy this, but you may not like it!
just my 2 cents.
/end rant
Regarding this comment, I know you're in a tough position Tiggs. I know you are stuck between the customer and the self important production staff. Please remind them that no matter how far up the "food chain" they are, NOBODY is more important then the paying customer.
If you have any fear of saying it to them... tell them I said it. What they going to do? Fire me?
Behold the power of the customer!
Ihareo
Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:12 am
#319
Mythor wrote:
(Rogue_5) Mustafar is now actually an infamous planet as part of the Star Wars universe. It is the key turning point in Episode III where Obi-Wan and Anakin fought their famous final battle. But questions remain, what was going on there and why were they there... Find out in Trials of Obi-Wan!
Things like this are what gets the community (or at least me) so enraged.
Has Rogue_5 even seen the movie? I'd've thought that would be a prerequisite to being on the Dev Team for this new expansion.
Anakin was there to assassinate the leaders of the Seperatist movement.
Obi Wan tagged along with Padme, who went there to find Anakin. Obi Wan was hoping to talk Anakin away from the dark side.
PERIOD.
There was nothing "going on there", in relation to those two characters. Those are the reasons both were there. The end!
Really? I'm glad you're here to tell us these things. But um. WHY were the seperatists there? Because Sideous told them to be there of course. Now, here's a little question that I have been wondering, and was hoping ToOw would answer.
Why'd Sideous choose Mustafar? The fact that he had all the medical droids, potions and Sith arcanery to install Vaders armor all ready and waiting before he even went to fetch Anakin's charred body tells me he had it all planned out.
So again, why Mustafar. There's somthing going on there that we don't know.
Don't try and feed us a pack of lies with that as the preface. It's wrong.
The simple truth is, any "storyline" attached to Obi Wan's spirit being on Mustafar, talking to all and sundry, is a complete fabrication invented solely to cash in on those gullible enough to buy the latest bundled boxed copy when the Episode III DVD comes out. Every piece of information that has been released only serves to confirm this.
Yes, but LA approved of it, so don't get that ritieous indignation burning too hot.
DeadlyTedly
Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:15 am
#320
Just a quick question and suggestion Tiggs...
Something that keeps seeming to happen is that every time a fix or plan or expansion or change or whatever is announced, 90% of the community cries foul as they believe that time is being taken away from whatever their pet concern is.
From reading thousands of dev posts etc, I, and anyone else that has been following dev tracker, have gleaned the fact that their are separate teams for various different dev efforts.
I'm assuming that the following teams exist:
LIVE - BUG FIXING
LIVE - NEW FEATURES
EXPANSIONS
QA
Within those teams you will have designers, artists, coders, testers, sound engineers, etc etc. I don't know if these guys will be shared amongst the different teams or if they are totally separate. In my experience of working in a code environment, the artists, testers and sound engineers are usually shared between teams, while the coders and designers and stuck in a particular team.
Anyways, at one point a designer's blog was started and at another point we had a letter to the team. My suggestion is that the community are made aware of the various different subteams that are within SOE's SWG Devteam and then given a regular update as to what they are working on. Obviously you will want to not promise things you are not sure of releasing yet.
I just think that if you promote awareness within the community as to how you guys work and who does what, then maybe a large %age of the complaints on these forums won't happen.
Keep up the good work guys.
Something that keeps seeming to happen is that every time a fix or plan or expansion or change or whatever is announced, 90% of the community cries foul as they believe that time is being taken away from whatever their pet concern is.
From reading thousands of dev posts etc, I, and anyone else that has been following dev tracker, have gleaned the fact that their are separate teams for various different dev efforts.
I'm assuming that the following teams exist:
LIVE - BUG FIXING
LIVE - NEW FEATURES
EXPANSIONS
QA
Within those teams you will have designers, artists, coders, testers, sound engineers, etc etc. I don't know if these guys will be shared amongst the different teams or if they are totally separate. In my experience of working in a code environment, the artists, testers and sound engineers are usually shared between teams, while the coders and designers and stuck in a particular team.
Anyways, at one point a designer's blog was started and at another point we had a letter to the team. My suggestion is that the community are made aware of the various different subteams that are within SOE's SWG Devteam and then given a regular update as to what they are working on. Obviously you will want to not promise things you are not sure of releasing yet.
I just think that if you promote awareness within the community as to how you guys work and who does what, then maybe a large %age of the complaints on these forums won't happen.
Keep up the good work guys.
Tribones
Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:34 am
#321
Erynder wrote:Tiggs, you are forced to lie to us by the dev team. We, as customers...
A whole bunch of stuff i removed forthe sake of everyone reading this post. Original post here.
...You really didn't have to sell Jedi. You have Star Wars to sell.
Bravo.
This person just responded with one of the most heartfelt, honest, and well-thought-out responses i've EVER heard on these forums.
Tiggs, please take note of this post, I know there is nothing you can do in your position, but just know we dont hate you. We hate what you're forced to do in your position as 'Community Director'.
Most of us here feel for you and I want to personally apologize for the way you are treated far too often.
/wookieehug (even tho i'm no wookie)
Have a good day today mmk?
Message Edited by Tribones on 08-30-2005 04:36 AM
Aendracon
Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:39 am
#322
Why Mustafar? Probably because it is remote and there was only a slim chance that the Jedi would stumble over them by accident. As for the medical treatment of Vader - did it take place on Mustafar? Personally, I found it rather lame that Palpatine had the necessary equipment at hand to save Anakin in time. Yes, you could say it was foresight, but I was of the impression, that Palpatine was as surprised as was Vader. And Palpatine´s foresight has been known to fail at times...
Ihareo wrote:
Really? I'm glad you're here to tell us these things. But um. WHY were the seperatists there? Because Sideous told them to be there of course. Now, here's a little question that I have been wondering, and was hoping ToOw would answer.
Why'd Sideous choose Mustafar? The fact that he had all the medical droids, potions and Sith arcanery to install Vaders armor all ready and waiting before he even went to fetch Anakin's charred body tells me he had it all planned out.
So again, why Mustafar. There's somthing going on there that we don't know.
Ihareo
Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:52 am
#323
Aendracon wrote:
Why Mustafar? Probably because it is remote and there was only a slim chance that the Jedi would stumble over them by accident. As for the medical treatment of Vader - did it take place on Mustafar? Personally, I found it rather lame that Palpatine had the necessary equipment at hand to save Anakin in time. Yes, you could say it was foresight, but I was of the impression, that Palpatine was as surprised as was Vader. And Palpatine´s foresight has been known to fail at times...
Ihareo wrote:
Really? I'm glad you're here to tell us these things. But um. WHY were the seperatists there? Because Sideous told them to be there of course. Now, here's a little question that I have been wondering, and was hoping ToOw would answer.
Why'd Sideous choose Mustafar? The fact that he had all the medical droids, potions and Sith arcanery to install Vaders armor all ready and waiting before he even went to fetch Anakin's charred body tells me he had it all planned out.
So again, why Mustafar. There's somthing going on there that we don't know.
The operation itself took place on Courascant. but he did have everything ready. Maybe he didn't know what was going to happen, but he knew he'd need the armor and cybernetic parts.
True his foresight does fail him, but still, Sideous was carefully planning every single step of the way. He was as machiavellian as anyone ever was. That's why mustafar is so appealing. It's the mystery surrounding it. Not just anothjer ball o planet, but that specific place.
Yah, the mystery is definately it. the mystery and the lava surfing! 
Ihareo
Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:53 am
#324
Mythor wrote:
Ihareo wrote:
Why'd Sideous choose Mustafar? The fact that he had all the medical droids, potions and Sith arcanery to install Vaders armor all ready and waiting before he even went to fetch Anakin's charred body tells me he had it all planned out.
Hooray for Sidious then?
Sorry, were you going to get to a bit that actually refuted my point? Guess not.
Anakin was there to assassinate the leadership of the Seperatists. You did not dispute this. Obi Wan was there to turn him from the dark side. You did not dispute this.
That is why they were there.
If Sidious planned for his protege to be maimed beyond all recognition and significantly less powerful and his children hidden away from him... Come on, you don't really think that he planned for that?
Everything points to Palpatine always trying to change what he sees in the future, when he doesn't like it. Why would he deliberately send Vader to be mutilated? Would he not at least put a contingency in place to ensure Kenobi was defeated afterwards?
Sidious was not an idiot. If you assume he wanted Vader maimed, you have to assume he'd know Kenobi would escape - and there is absolutely nothing to suggest that that was a desirable outcome for him. He ordered Cody to kill Kenobi, after all.
They brought Vader back in a medical pod to give him a chance to survive long enough to undergo the extreme reconstructive surgery needed to keep him alive. Later, in the time period of Episode V, Vader struggles to defeat Luke. And despite having an age advantage, he mostly defeated Kenobi in Ep.IV because Kenobi conceded.
If Sidious had something big planned, it failed. He lost.
And it had absolutely nothing to do with the characters motivations for being there. If this is Palpatine's plot, then it should be labeled as such.
And it's still completely and utterly absurd to have Obi Wan giving out missions to non-FS people.
Ihareo wrote:
Yes, but LA approved of it, so don't get that ritieous indignation burning too hot.
Oh, I'm sorry, because LucasArts approves, that makes SOE's filthy money grubbing okay?
Pffft.
And don't be so sure LucasArts approves of everything that happens in this neck of the woods.
I wasn't trying to refute you. You have your opinions, I have mine.
I was merely trying to share with you, and the other posters, why I am very eagerly looking foreward to the expansion.
Angamarth
Tue Aug 30, 2005 4:58 am
#325
Fernas wrote:
Sometimes changes need to go in that the team feels will help the games long term goals even if the community doesn't agree.
you opened the gate, and i'm stepping through. do tell us about these longterm goals. we, the players, should really have an opportunity to approve or disapprove of them.
You want to know why they don't tell us long term goals anymore?
Landlubber wrote:
Whoa... am I the only one who's had a serious deja vu feeling right now?
The point is, we heard it all before, but when are you (meaning SOE, not you personally Tiggs) going to deliver? That's the problem, you see: we've had so many broken promises that there's hardly anyone around that will take the above statement seriously. At least I know that I'll believe in it when I see it, not one second sooner.
Perfect example. They say, "This is where we'd like to go," and someone wirtes it in stone and starts screaming, "Liar!" when things change. As often as that happened, it's no wonder they made the decision not to release any information until they were positive it was coming out.