Smuggler Archive
Thread: My take on the whole BH/Jedi/Smuggler thing-- And my suggestion to the Devs
Tanks wrote:
This would force a lot of BHs to take on low level Padawans, so disagree.
Given that low level paddies are what the majority of bounty hunter hunt in the first place, I fail to see any real consequences to that "threat".
Spiderhammer wrote:
I'm not sure why we are pushing(well some of us anyway) for player bounties on smugglers... I only have to look at the utter disaster for much of the game that the jedi bh thing seems to be... just my take
I think anyone that wants to nerf FD or LD should be made to level a Smuggler by itself, aka no outside class support other than what it takes to become one.
Or try something like Master Smuggler/Master Dancer, then run your mouth, especially since everything is now based on pistol and combat xp for the trees in smuggler.
Message Edited by Xoreshear on 05-22-2005 08:49 AM
Tanks wrote:
This is NOT a class based game. You have 250 skill points to use, which is enough for 2.5 professions. Also, BH by themselves are not self reliant in skills like Jedi, we have to pick up other professions to complete our template. I don't see Smugglers stopping at just smuggler, you are Smuggler/Pistoleer or Smuggler/TKA or Smuggler/Whatever.
From my perspective, SWG became a class based game when jedi were made asover-powered as they are -- even the alleged 1.5x more powerful (and it is considerably more than this in reality). Now, if the BH want to hunt Jedi, then they should be made as powerful and then they can go play their part of the game and the rest of us can play ours.
The other option stated repeatedly is to have BH remain as they are and hunt smugglers. Then we'd just have jedi v jedi, light v dark -- and that'd be fine too. Anything that gets the jedi out of the game for "normal" characters, or at least out of the GCW.
I'm really not against the BHs. Your profession isn't the one that has thrown the balanceof the game out of whack. Unfortunately for you, you (BH) end up in these discussions because of your connection to the jedi. Guilt by association, as it were.
While I agree that player bounties on smugglers are important I FAR MORE think that player MISSIONS for smugglers are needed.
And I haven't heard ANYTHING on smuggler player missions.
But I have to agree with Kate, Jedi need to be RUNNING from BHs not expecting to own them. Smugglers also should one day expect to run from BHs and consider it a 'win' if they avoid the bounty. Both Jedi and Smugglers need the tools, and the bounty limits, so that the conflict can be resolved by AVOIDING the BH. I have said this before many times though. Do the devs understand it though?
mrbleepbleep wrote:
Spiderhammer wrote:
I'm not sure why we are pushing(well some of us anyway) for player bounties on smugglers... I only have to look at the utter disaster for much of the game that the jedi bh thing seems to be... just my take
In my opinion, much of it is due to the fact that Jedi, by design more powerful that regular professions, is a magnet for powergamers, who tend not to understand that the point of jedi is to play the most challenging part of the game, not to be "rewarded" for unlocking with an easy game. BH tends to be a magnet for players who are either very aggressive, or hate Jedi for various reasons, and want to make them suffer. That makes for a pretty explosive mixture.
QFE.
I'm with the idea that Jedi vs Jedi/Sith/Whatever should be their only allowed PvP. That would fix the GCW, remove the nerfcries and get them right out of everyone's game. I suppose it's fair that BHs shouldstill be permitted to hunt Jedi (of any and all sides) but the current lack of balance supports this. A Jedi being hunted by another Jedi suddenly finds a MBH on his trail as well and this might lead him to make additional mistakes and possibly die. Why only a Master? Because Jedi are more powerful than any BH or other character but Masters i can still see going for the ultimate big-game hunt.
The main thing though, seriously the main thing, is to remove Jedi from "normal" PvP altogether. They're killing the game.
Spiderhammer wrote:
I'm not sure why we are pushing(well some of us anyway) for player bounties on smugglers... I only have to look at the utter disaster for much of the game that the jedi bh thing seems to be... just my take
To be clear. A Smuggler Bounty system would differ GREATLY from a Jedi Bounty system.
The MAIN reason why is players that chase the Jedi prof are quite different from those that take the Smuggler prof.
Jedi are players that either see Jedi as an endgame, want the power or see themselves as Jedi. They don't expect to be hunted by something that they cannot handle.
Smugglers want to break laws and EXPECT to be chased down by powerful beings when caught. Our thrill is the chase.
Other reasons are:
Smugglers won't lose XP.
Smugglers are on par with BHs combatwise.
Smugglers are just straight up cooler than Jedi. It's always been that way, right Han?
Tanks wrote:
This is NOT a class based game. You have 250 skill points to use, which is enough for 2.5 professions. Also, BH by themselves are not self reliant in skills like Jedi, we have to pick up other professions to complete our template. I don't see Smugglers stopping at just smuggler, you are Smuggler/Pistoleer or Smuggler/TKA or Smuggler/Whatever.
dlc3007 wrote:
The best suggestion that I can come up with, and I make this as a perfectly serious suggestion, is to segregate the BH and jedi as much as possible. Once someone starts down either of these paths, they no longer can use other profession's skills.
You know, A LOT of people in these forums like to compare the game to the movies. Well, for those of you that do this, I suppose I will too. If none of you have noticed, all the charactors in movie seem to use skills from other classes. Yes, even the Jedi, and the BH(smugs not to be excluded :smileywink
. Dooku assumes a fencing stance while yoda assumes a swordsman stance;as anexample..... Did anyone tell them that they were breaking the rules??? If I am not mistaken, they used well more than their 250pts 
SpinningCloud wrote:While I agree that player bounties on smugglers are important I FAR MORE think that player MISSIONS for smugglers are needed.
And I haven't heard ANYTHING on smuggler player missions.
But I have to agree with Kate, Jedi need to be RUNNING from BHs not expecting to own them. Smugglers also should one day expect to run from BHs and consider it a 'win' if they avoid the bounty. Both Jedi and Smugglers need the tools, and the bounty limits, so that the conflict can be resolved by AVOIDING the BH. I have said this before many times though. Do the devs understand it though?
Just a short comment on one of the reasons why I don't really bother with hunting anymore: the "running" from Bounty Hunters - at least in the current BH/Jedi system, since some parts of the game are not very well thought out, mostly consists of totally OOC/metagaming/unrealistic actions, a lot of which are borderline or true exploits.
As much as defeating a bounty mark and delivering an actual IC line is fun, the hoops you have to jump through right now are way too silly/immersion breaking for me. Which is why I believe in non-PvP "debt collecting" BH/Smuggler missions, as I think they have much more RP potential and much less chance to end up as stupid as the BH/Jedi missions are in most cases.
Bounty Hunters were given the ability to hunt Jedi, and look at the state of both professions forums and gameplay. Trolling, flaming, griefing, harassment. That's what adding PvP brings.
Someone up further suggested Jedi should be interested in just getting away, as would Smugglers?
Well, it's clear you don't have the slightest clue about that little game mechanic.
Jedi FREQUENTLY run from Bounty Hunters. Particularly the lower level Padawan players who have no real hope against a good Bounty Hunter.
The PROBLEM is that Bounty Hunters then carp and moan incessantly about Jedi running away and hiding instead of fighting. They chase them all the way back to their hideout, and then they set up camp outside and shout or /tell things at the Jedi. They'll often refuse to leave for DAYS at a time. And they see NOTHING WRONG with this behaviour. They even DEMAND ways to be allowed to bypass any restrictions between them and the player they want to kill. Then they act like it is somehow their god/dev given right to grief others.
Is that truly what people want for Smuggler?
Let me know. I still have time to respec away and never come back if that's what this community is going to push for in the future, instead of the infinitely better PvE content that would be far more rewarding.
So many of the issues people complain about in this game have been brought about by their use in PvP play, and yet those same people then turn around and want to add even more ways to PvP/PK into the game.
When will people learn?
Mythor wrote:
We do not want bounties to be placed on Smugglers to allow other players to hunt Smugglers.
Is that the royal "we"? Are you speaking for everyone?
I most definitely do want bounties to be placed on Smugglers to allow other players to hunt them. Because i'm not a whiny Jedi coward.
IMHO there should be a Sith class to compliment the Jedi class.
This would create more choice in the game and they can get on with their secret war, while the rest of us get on with the main game.
BHs should hunt Smugglers, but it should be very risky for them, Smugglers and BH should be equal in combat prowess.
Yes, I meant "everyone", as in the majority. Not minorities that prefer to see the gameplay be destroyed for the majority.
Your last comment pretty clearly shows you know enough about the BH/Jedi system to know how much of an absolute crapstorm it is.
How can including Smuggler in the crapstorm be a good thing for us?
How is it better than actually being able to smuggle things?
It has nothing to do with whatever silly vision of "bravery" people hold most dear. It has everything to do with "Player vs Player" not cutting it as "content".
PvP "content" exists - Special Forces in the GCW.
I had thought that most Smugglers would prefer to push for actually being smugglers. I would not have thought most pine to have exploits used against their characters on a daily basis.
Which is precisely what will happen if player bounties on smugglers were implemented. Trying to flip that off as "whiny Jedi" is absurd.
It sounds like you'd be better served becoming a Bounty Hunter or a Jedi.