Smuggler Archive
Thread: Poll: Contraband on Vendors
SpinningCloud
Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:57 am
#236
I don't have a problem with selling contraband on player vendors (NOT the bazaar though).
What I DO have a problem with is allowing such sales with NO potential risk. Vendors that sell contraband SHOULD be at risk of scans and serious consequences. To think there shouldn't be risks is simply absurd.
If the choice though is selling contraband with NO risk, or not selling contraband at all then I prefer not selling contraband at all.
cyst22
Tue Feb 22, 2005 11:59 am
#237
A I do quite a bit of slicing for loyal clients, most are some what of rpers. They pay me top $$$ to fly out to them meet in a cantina slice a few things then be on my way. after a little banter and such. Isn't that what this game is about social interaction (unless your a jedi). Wait maybe it's about afk healers, and soloing big bad mobs you should have no chance to solo kill. I forget which.
Darkov
Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:25 pm
#238
As a Master Smuggler, Master Merchant this really pains me. But I must go..
A
Though I would like to see a Master Smuggler skill that adds a Black Market tab to vendors, (pre-requisit Novice Merchant), to partially negate the harm of this for serious Smugglers/Merchants.
I will give up with slicing/spices if the only means of selling them is through hawking!
HOTDOG
Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:00 pm
#239
Hurlobacca wrote:
...A buncha crap above..
OOOOOOOOOOOH!
I see you now...
You're just here to 'cause trouble.
I should have noticed that when you trolled in...
If you would SERIOUSLY like to debate this issue let's go somewhere else-
Oh,... and bring some rational/constructive points to discuss and leave your insults at home.
Darkov
Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:15 pm
#240
He's got a point though.. maybe we're looking at smuggling from the wrong perspective.. we offer a service in slicing, but that doesn't mean we should smuggle sliced goods.
Smuggler_Caylin
Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:21 pm
#241
Darkov wrote:He's got a point though.. maybe we're looking at smuggling from the wrong perspective.. we offer a service in slicing, but that doesn't mean we should smuggle sliced goods.
So you want to slice instead of smuggle as a smuggler?
One of the Four Horsemen of the Smuggler Apocalypse! 
HOTDOG
Tue Feb 22, 2005 4:34 pm
#242
When it comes to smuggling I picture it being SPICE that we smuggle.
Still- not being able to sell contraband- ALL contraband on vendors would give it the illegal feel it's supposed to have.
This guy is telling me all these things he would do in order to still sell contraband- he even says "I could just become a smuggler..."
and I'm like: GREAT. DO that. That's the whole point.
But you wouldn't be a Merchant selling contraband on a vendor like it's brandy. You'd be sneaking around selling it hand to hand or using a showroom or whatever.
We're not trying to keep everyone from selling contraband period. We're just trying to keep them off vendors- especially the bazaar- if you are not a smuggler you shouldn't be running a sliced weapons ring. Get it?
Hurlobacca
Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:29 pm
#243
HOTDOG wrote:
When it comes to smuggling I picture it being SPICE that we smuggle.
Still- not being able to sell contraband- ALL contraband on vendors would give it the illegal feel it's supposed to have. That's your perspective. Lot's of other players would simply view this as an inconvenience and wouldnt' think to themselves "wow, this is really immersive, i have to go hunt for a slicer or an underground merchant, what a thrill."
This guy is telling me all these things he would do in order to still sell contraband- he even says "I could just become a smuggler..." Yeah, but I probably wouldn't actually do that, smuggler is such a nerfed profession.
and I'm like: GREAT. DO that. That's the whole point.
But you wouldn't be a Merchant selling contraband on a vendor like it's brandy. You'd be sneaking around selling it hand to hand or using a showroom or whatever.
We're not trying to keep everyone from selling contraband period. We're just trying to keep them off vendors- especially the bazaar- if you are not a smuggler you shouldn't be running a sliced weapons ring. Get it? No, I really don't get it and I don't see what this really accomplishes except to serve as a pacifier for smugglers who want this change. It doesn't eliminate bulk-slicing, it doesn't increase smugglers share of the slicing market since that's already 100%. All it really does is make people waste more time hunting for weapons when what they really want is to make better use of their game time. It unnecessarily infringes on an a merchant skill without providing any tangible benefit to the player base as a whole.
SpinningCloud
Tue Feb 22, 2005 10:37 pm
#244
Hurlo, look up the definition of 'smuggle' then tell us what YOU think should be done in order for our Smuggler profession to live up to it's name.
Or, are you suggesting we just change the profession name to 'Common Criminal'?
HOTDOG
Wed Feb 23, 2005 1:20 am
#245
I just want to say a couple of things:
1. We are not trying to steal from the Merchants.
Since when is it a merchants job to handle illegal goods?
YES. There are crooked merchants and you should be able
to play one but YOU should have to spend SP to do so.
to play one but YOU should have to spend SP to do so.
Contraband is OUR territory. Vendors are yours.
As it stands a Merchant HAS to sell contraband to be
competitive and that is not how it should be.
competitive and that is not how it should be.
2. As for this being a grasp at content... You're Fookin' Right, Boyo!
This is a grasp for OUR content. Just like Kmart doesn't sell silencers
and Bazookas. A merchant shouldn't sell sliced materials. EVEN IF IT'S
IN THE PRIVACY OF THEIR OWN HOMES!
and Bazookas. A merchant shouldn't sell sliced materials. EVEN IF IT'S
IN THE PRIVACY OF THEIR OWN HOMES!
3. We want to smuggle.
Hell, it's in our title. The first step to that IS not being able to go
to your friendly neighborhood vendorman to buy the stuff that I want to
smuggle.
to your friendly neighborhood vendorman to buy the stuff that I want to
smuggle.
The next step is for there to be serious consequences for HAVING that
very same stuff on your possession (in particular SPICE).
very same stuff on your possession (in particular SPICE).
This will lead to people asking us deliver it to them- and THAT is smuggling.
And it does not work as long as someone can buy the stuff off the bazaar or
in your living room.
And it does not work as long as someone can buy the stuff off the bazaar or
in your living room.
4. I'm also tired of people just taking our abilities for granted.
You wanna sell the best Armor/Weapons become a Smith.
You wanna sell illegal armor/weapons become a SMUGGLER.
I have proposed SEVERAL times that Smugglers be allowed to place special
contraband vendors if they have Spices 4 (to place spices) or Slicing 4
(to place armor and weapons) as long as they have Business 3 (needed for
a vendor in the first place).
This way if a merchant wants to deal in illegal goods they HAVE to be a
smuggler just like if we want to sell stuff we need some artisan to do so.
smuggler just like if we want to sell stuff we need some artisan to do so.
EDIT: I should add that in those proposals there are reprecussions for running a contrabrand
vendor- such as earning Infamy and Visibility.
Message Edited by HOTDOG on 02-22-2005 12:27 PM
Hurlobacca
Wed Feb 23, 2005 5:43 am
#247
From the Cambridge Dictionary: smuggle: to take things or people to or from a place secretly or illegally. Another dictionary also mentioned it was usually done to avoid duties or taxes.
If a smuggler was smuggling goods, he'd already have a customer lined up before he ever left point A on his way to point B. He certainly wouldn't set up a shop to sell his illegal wares at his destination because he's a smuggler, not a merchant. He'd most likely sell the whole lot of whatever he had to one person, amerchant, who would then take care of the distribution since that's what merchants do. That's the way it's always been. During prohibition, bootleggers would run the moonshine from the south to wherever they were taking it, make their delivery and then return to repeat the process. Getting into the speakeasy was notdifficult and anyone who wanted to go out for a drink or buy some to bring home could do it. A modern example would be cigarettes which are regualarly smuggled from states like mine, Virginia, to the northeast where state taxes on tobacco are much higher. Oftentimes these cigarettes end up in the mom and pop convenience stores rather than being sold out of the back of a truck. In these examples, there's always a potential risk for the smuggler and for the sellers and sometimes even the buyers such as in the case of the speakeasy if it got raided.
I've already stated that I support the idea of hiring smugglers to bribe officials to overlook your illegal inventory. I've brought up the idea of hiring a smuggler to make sure i don't get scanned and turned overt/killed while transporting my sliced goods from my workshop to my vendors. I also think more has to be done to improve Smuggler but removing sliced items from vendors makes no sense. I've also already stated that the new looted speed/accuracy stims should have been a craftable item for smugglers. I think they should get rid of the downer on spices but maybe keep the timer or make it equal to the duration of the boost so you are not perma-boosted on spice. Maybe chef buffs that affect the mind should be crafted by smugglers keeping the consistency of smugglers having things for your head and chefs having things for your stomach. That would mean giving pixie to chefs too. This is probably not practical due to skill tapes, lack of resources among smugglers, etc but you should have some type of consumables you can sell on a consistent basis like you did with muon and pixie before the chef revamp.
Besides the other reasons I've stated ad nauseum, i think it's a mistake if you settle for having sliced items removed from vendors. It will be viewed as a major change to the way many players procure their sliced weapons and how many merchants operate and I think you all are better served focusing on promoting changes that really give you some new interesting enjoyable content and abilities to earn a living at your profession instead of focusing on slicing which is boring, not to mention the prospect of selling your wares without vendors which would be a drag for any profession.
Well, this horse is beat to a bloody pulp so this would be a good time to exit this debate. I apologize for my verbosity and for occasionally letting my passion on this issue be focused at individuals rather than the issues at hand.
Message Edited by Hurlobacca on 02-23-2005 08:03 AM