Smuggler Archive
Thread: Concerns about slicing.
Knightcrest
Thu Jun 23, 2005 4:49 pm
#170
maxtheusher wrote:
Drakenya wrote:
Spiderhammer wrote:
One more thought... regarding drops in tough places
relax.. how many weaponsmiths go out and kill gorax and krayt...
this adds to the eceonomy of the game. as long as the slice is worth it the components will be available and the cost will reflect t their availability. If you want to be crafty and business savy then you offer cheap slice for anyone who can get you the components plus some extra components for yourself..
But krayts/goraxs are a bit different from DWB/Avatar
Yep, if you're careful you can solo Krayts and Goraxes
Yeah I can handle that and it might be fun so long as the drop rate isn't horrible. Can make for some fun group hunts. I am just not a big fan of the DWB/Avatar concept as nasty as it is in there.
Cooter_Scylla
Thu Jun 23, 2005 4:52 pm
#171
Why does a simple loot drop system sound like an amazing fix, creative, or just generally accepted as a solution to so many people. It is nothing more than a subpar bandaid fix. It's no better than when Ultima Online used to create new items and "content" by just upping the HAM bars and recoloring a monster, then recoloring an existing item to drop with better stats. After so many years of online game development (across multiple companies), people are just happy to be fed the same "innovation" over and over again?
I know I should probably just kick back and drop into the "general acceptance" crowd. To me accepting subpar systems seems as lazy as not developing a system that will hold it's appeal over time - not just the first 2 weeks of release to live. If you are allgoing to have one shot at a revamp for smuggler, whyare you going to settle forsuch a simplistic "fix"? Who knows when the next revamp will be, if ever - shouldn't we bepushing for quality right now?
I know there's not really anything we can do, and more than likely they have their minds made up - but that shouldn't stop us from raising fresh ideas based on current game mechanics. Current game mechanics are the key to success, it's not coming up with brand new programming and new systems which they will not create.
Drakenya
Thu Jun 23, 2005 4:56 pm
#172
Question about the loot drops: If they are added to kyrats/goraxs/whatever, will the drop rates increase, or will everything else become a bit more rare because in addition to dropping pearls/scales/tissue, smuggling stuff is now being dropped? If this is the case, all loot drops will go up in price bring smuggler drops up as well.
maxtheusher
Thu Jun 23, 2005 4:57 pm
#173
Cooter_Scylla wrote:
Why does a simple loot drop system sound like an amazing fix, creative, or just generally accepted as a solution to so many people. It is nothing more than a subpar bandaid fix. It's no better than when Ultima Online used to create new items and "content" by just upping the HAM bars and recoloring a monster, then recoloring an existing item to drop with better stats. After so many years of online game development (across multiple companies), people are just happy to be fed the same "innovation" over and over again?I know I should probably just kick back and drop into the "general acceptance" crowd. To me accepting subpar systems seems as lazy as not developing a system that will hold it's appeal over time - not just the first 2 weeks of release to live. If you are allgoing to have one shot at a revamp for smuggler, whyare you going to settle forsuch a simplistic "fix"? Who knows when the next revamp will be, if ever - shouldn't we bepushing for quality right now?I know there's not really anything we can do, and more than likely they have their minds made up - but that shouldn't stop us from raising fresh ideas based on current game mechanics. Current game mechanics are the key to success, it's not coming up with brand new programming and new systems which they will not create.
Check it, I think I was the most vocal dissident when the new sliciny system came out. GM has proposed something that is a good idea, and will add to the system as it stands. The fact that he didn't come here with a suggestion of say, a minigame, or something, means exactly this:
This is the BEST thing we can get out of slicing. GM knows what we want more than any other Dev. He also has a lot more say than we do. But there's things even he can't do. So be happy about the addition, or keep with the pipe-dreams.
gassygunslinger
Thu Jun 23, 2005 4:58 pm
#174
I still think theres a BIG issue with the caping on stats!!! If they go above the cap, they will be worth the effort, but it will ruin the balance the CU made, and make it impossible tocompete unless u have a lot of money. On the other hand, if it doesn't go above the cap, it will do nothing for uber-weapons, and not be in any way worth it.
maxtheusher
Thu Jun 23, 2005 4:59 pm
#175
gassygunslinger wrote:
I still think theres a BIG issue with the caping on stats!!! If they go above the cap, they will be worth the effort, but it will ruin the balance the CU made, and make it impossible tocompete unless u have a lot of money. On the other hand, if it doesn't go above the cap, it will do nothing for uber-weapons, and not be in any way worth it.
this is an important point, I believe Wes is already aware and is going to bring it to the Devs as a major concern.
Nisdain
Thu Jun 23, 2005 5:00 pm
#176
gassygunslinger wrote:
I still think theres a BIG issue with the caping on stats!!! If they go above the cap, they will be worth the effort, but it will ruin the balance the CU made, and make it impossible to compete unless u have a lot of money. On the other hand, if it doesn't go above the cap, it will do nothing for uber-weapons, and not be in any way worth it.
Agreed, we all need specific information like this I dont think going beyond the "caps" by 8% or 10% is going to really screw up balance however.
ShrekECPI
Thu Jun 23, 2005 5:01 pm
#177
GreenMarine wrote:
Weapon & Armor breakage has been removed.
Removed for three reasons: 1) It was difficult to understand the breakage system. 2) It happened too often. Although it could be slowed, 3) it just wasn't fun anyway.
I've adjusted weapon slice bonuses and costs across the board.
Adding a crit chance should now be more of a worthwhile gamble. Certain combinations of slices are no longer patently better than others. Different types of slices should be more competitive. However, the numbers are still subject to change.
Some slices will now require components to apply.
Slices are unlimited item upgrades. I don't believe they should be free. The breakage system was too harsh a penalty. Instead, I'm enabling plan B. There are 9 components used by the current set of slices. Components cover a range in rarity and the difficulty of location in which they drop. For example, rebuilding the firing pin (level 4 fire rate) or applying a feather trigger pull (level 3 crit chance) now requires a Delicate Trigger Assembly, which drops in Death Watch Bunker and Avatar Platform. We may have to tweak the drop rate a few times to get it right.
This stuff should go to Test Center in a day or two.
Thanks Green
Now I think I should drop smuggler. I keep it for coolnes factor and I just like being against the "man". So not only do we not get a revamp, we get a big ole nerf enema.
- Alliance Soldier
HOTDOG
Thu Jun 23, 2005 5:02 pm
#178
Thanks for postin' GM. Muchappreciated and thank you for your work on our profession.
I have a suggestion. What if the components were in a locked container somewhere in these caves or the DWB. So you don't neccessarily have to kill the MOB but you do have to survive long enough to get to the container and get the goods.
Seems like that might even be more smuggler-like.
Otherwise. I think the difficult loot idea is awesome- and I'm hoping that these level slices will be as awesome as the tasks that lay before the smuggler getting the components.
Spiderhammer
Thu Jun 23, 2005 5:03 pm
#179
maxtheusher wrote:
Drakenya wrote:
Spiderhammer wrote:
One more thought... regarding drops in tough places
relax.. how many weaponsmiths go out and kill gorax and krayt...
this adds to the eceonomy of the game. as long as the slice is worth it the components will be available and the cost will reflect t their availability. If you want to be crafty and business savy then you offer cheap slice for anyone who can get you the components plus some extra components for yourself..
But krayts/goraxs are a bit different from DWB/Avatar
Yep, if you're careful you can solo Krayts and Goraxes
Not if you have most of your template taken up by being a weaponsmith.
my point is why do we think WE have to be able to go out and pick up our high end components like a jug of milk at seven elleven.
the fact is they'll exist, they'll be worth something, and somebody will get them and they'll enter the economy... its not like nobody is going to these places, its just not us alone. If they drop often enough there then they will be on the market. If slicing is going to be any good it cant be easy.... look at jedi... i am a half assed player at best.. i spend most of my time in the cantinas roleplaying and even i am almost force sensitive... btw anyone want to help me ambush and slay the old man when he visits...
maxtheusher
Thu Jun 23, 2005 5:03 pm
#180
Heyyyy maybe those locked MagSeals... you know, the ones that we can't slice for some reason... 
Cooter_Scylla
Thu Jun 23, 2005 5:04 pm
#181
If this is the best they can do for slicing, honestly I'd rather keep the current system. Let, me recolor a weapon and I'd be happier than with this proposed drop system - it has about the same smugglerish feel as camping for loot drops. It might be the best we can hope for, but that doesn't mean it's actually a positive change.
HOTDOG
Thu Jun 23, 2005 5:09 pm
#182
maxtheusher wrote:
Heyyyy maybe those locked MagSeals... you know, the ones that we can't slice for some reason...
Exactly! Just like they need a armor smith to roll in there and craft in there- we could roll in and bust a Mag Seal- maybe we need to have tools to do it- idunno.
Otherwise- I don't see loot dropping to be a real problem. We will get these components or someone else will. Look at Krayt tissues and the like. Weaponsmiths are always chock full of the dang things and they are high end content.
Seriously, if you can't handle the heat- use your respec token to get out of the kitchen.