Shipwright Archive

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Strudle wrote:

i think full unconditional factory support is in order. The massive resource costs i think will limit nearly all schematics. To run a ful lfactory run of say reactors requires millions of resources that simply arent possible.

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I must respectfully disagree. Full factory support for shipwrights would take away more than it would add, and "massive resource costs" won't have an effect on someone in a large guild or with an established fleet of harvesters. In effect we would be asking that Shipwrights be able to craft odd-level components that are on par with even-level components, and be able to make them en masse. The bad things about that outweigh the good.

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IIscandar wrote:

>Sheesh... even Personal Shield Generators have to be replaced after so much "use and abuse."

>I guess that I'll simply have to continue using my MSW as a personal support character and
>stop entertaining any thoughts... any thoughts at all, of attempting to build a viable Starship business.

I went back in the forums and did some reading on this subject. So what you are suggesting is that
by being able to PVP only in deep space without decay, the shipwright profession is not viable? What about PVE ? What about PVP in other sectors?

Is this the same as saying that no decay in factional combat on the ground makes armor and weaponsmith not viable?

Maybe I'm not understanding the issue correctly. Please tell me if I'm missing the point, but If I go off of my experience
and many others here, I see a lot of shipwrights with a lot of repeat customers that have very viable Starship businesses.

Message Edited by IIscandar on 04-14-2005 04:34 PM

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You can use Deep Space to negate any decay accrued thru PvE. All that is needed, and I have checked this myself... is to make a minimal repair at the shipyard where you reappear after death and then travel to Deep Space and use it as a revolving door. When you leave DS.. voila... all damage is fully repaired... all decay to components is negated.

As for PvP in other sectors.. I have yet to se anyone (on Sunrunner) that will PvP in "local space"... and even then, the procedure outlined above makes this a moot point.

PvE in local space... Hmm... when was the LAST time that any master-level ship was destroyed or heavilly damagedresulting form a failedPvE engagement outside ofLocal Space? I seldom hear anyone making that complaint.... "damn... those four Tier5 pirates in Kessel really chewed up my TIE Oppressor... I'll have to replace the entire ship now. Wait.... I forgot about Deep Space... SIlly me... brb guys and we can all go around again"

I know, from personal experience, that once I have my ship set up the way I want it, I'll have little use for SW other than "consumables"... and that makes SWs no better than convenience store operators.

Message Edited by Pallida on 04-15-2005 12:23 PM

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Pallida wrote:

As for PvP in other sectors.. I have yet to se anyone (on Sunrunner) that will PvP in "local space"

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Wow, that sucks for you, on SS our PvP events usually span several sectors, none of them Deep Space.

Try to fit in there somewhere that the new Elite MP Ship Parts are nowhere NEAR up to where they should be.

The Elite Shields should be at LEAST 30k (giving it about 10 hits before it'll be destroyed) and the armour as well.

MP ships have no maneuverability to speak of, and so rely on their extra protection, crew, and fighter support for survival.

MP Ship guns could stand to be upped as well.

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IIscandar wrote:

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Alyxian wrote:

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IIscandar wrote:

>OK I'm editing this because I'm either blind or its just been added as its been somewhat answered...

>but now you have an issue where you would only be able to place multiple engines if they are the same stats which without factories is near impossible to do but >this also affect players by making looted engines worthless in some chassis since you are not going to find looted parts with the same stats.

The idea of multiple engines would only be really usefull in larger ships. These ships do not benefit as much from the super nice loot engines since the ypr limits on the chassis make the high ypr engine less effective. Your right though, without at least limited factory support (10 count schematics also mentioned in the post) creating engines with the same stats would be very difficult. If limited 100% factory support was added it would open up crafted engines to a new market yet still allow for loot engines to be used in single engine craft.

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Just because my car has 4 tailpipes visible does not mean it has 4 engines

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That's true, but if you have 4 blasters showing on your car, you have 4 not 3. Still, when I look at the xwing I see 4 intakes and 4 exhaust ports. It seems that adding extra engines is not very popular idea, I guess I'll take it out before I submit.

Later I added:

On second thought, I think I'll leave it in because it was one supporting reason why limited (10 count) factory schematics could be very usefull.

Message Edited by IIscandar on 04-14-2005 04:42 PM

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So what you're saying is that you're leaving it in since its one of the few viable reasons for a feature that we all seem to be more or less split on? Is there a good reason for it OTHER than in support of factory output because I dont think thats a good enough reason as is.

Plus you have to figure out how the mass would work on that. because if you take current components as they are and mulitply that by 4 for say an Xwing... thats most of your mass right there. Youre going to have to up the mass on everything or drop the mass on engines. And what are you supposed to do it you cant find a shipwright that can make the parts for you? (thats hypothetical) or you cant find 4 exact engines? I really think that this is over complicating a system that doesnt need to be tinkered with as it can be a pin in the rear enough as it is.

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gojimbogo wrote:

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IIscandar wrote:

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Alyxian wrote:

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IIscandar wrote:

>OK I'm editing this because I'm either blind or its just been added as its been somewhat answered...

>but now you have an issue where you would only be able to place multiple engines if they are the same stats which without factories is near impossible to do but >this also affect players by making looted engines worthless in some chassis since you are not going to find looted parts with the same stats.

The idea of multiple engines would only be really usefull in larger ships. These ships do not benefit as much from the super nice loot engines since the ypr limits on the chassis make the high ypr engine less effective. Your right though, without at least limited factory support (10 count schematics also mentioned in the post) creating engines with the same stats would be very difficult. If limited 100% factory support was added it would open up crafted engines to a new market yet still allow for loot engines to be used in single engine craft.

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Just because my car has 4 tailpipes visible does not mean it has 4 engines

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That's true, but if you have 4 blasters showing on your car, you have 4 not 3. Still, when I look at the xwing I see 4 intakes and 4 exhaust ports. It seems that adding extra engines is not very popular idea, I guess I'll take it out before I submit.

Later I added:

On second thought, I think I'll leave it in because it was one supporting reason why limited (10 count) factory schematics could be very usefull.

Message Edited by IIscandar on 04-14-2005 04:42 PM

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So what you're saying is that you're leaving it in since its one of the few viable reasons for a feature that we all seem to be more or less split on? Is there a good reason for it OTHER than in support of factory output because I dont think thats a good enough reason as is.

Plus you have to figure out how the mass would work on that. because if you take current components as they are and mulitply that by 4 for say an Xwing... thats most of your mass right there. Youre going to have to up the mass on everything or drop the mass on engines. And what are you supposed to do it you cant find a shipwright that can make the parts for you? (thats hypothetical) or you cant find 4 exact engines? I really think that this is over complicating a system that doesnt need to be tinkered with as it can be a pin in the rear enough as it is.

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Ok cast the factory part aside. I still think multiple layers of armor and mulptile shields on POBs would be great. However, it appears from research that multiple part slots where a part of POB ships during beta. Not sure yet why that was removed. I do see your point. lets drop the engine thing.

I would like to say though on blasters for the Xwing, just because there are 4 slots doesn't mean you'd have to use them. You could also drop to lvl 5 or 7's or a combo of both.

Message Edited by IIscandar on 04-15-2005 04:28 PM

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IIscandar wrote:

>Sheesh... even Personal Shield Generators have to be replaced after so much "use and abuse."

>I guess that I'll simply have to continue using my MSW as a personal support character and
>stop entertaining any thoughts... any thoughts at all, of attempting to build a viable Starship business.

I went back in the forums and did some reading on this subject. So what you are suggesting is that
by being able to PVP only in deep space without decay, the shipwright profession is not viable? What about PVE ? What about PVP in other sectors?

Is this the same as saying that no decay in factional combat on the ground makes armor and weaponsmith not viable?

Maybe I'm not understanding the issue correctly. Please tell me if I'm missing the point, but If I go off of my experience
and many others here, I see a lot of shipwrights with a lot of repeat customers that have very viable Starship businesses.

Message Edited by IIscandar on 04-14-2005 04:34 PM

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You do realize I can PVE all day long and when my components have taken a beating, I run into DS and leave immediately to get a full free decayless repair. Altering the no decay situation would open up the need for either more shipwrights and/or increase business for those that are struggling to stay afloat.

Not all shipwrights are like you or me doing fine and dandy on sales, and many good SWs have left the prfoession for this reason among others. It is a problem that needs a new solution.

I'm all for no decay PvP, but not a no decay zone. I'm sure most shipwrights could agree on this point, since DS is empty for the most part anyway except for the people using it for free no decay repairs.

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Rogue1970 wrote:

You do realize I can PVE all day long and when my components have taken a beating, I run into DS and leave immediately to get a full free decayless repair. Altering the no decay situation would open up the need for either more shipwrights and/or increase business for those that are struggling to stay afloat.

Not all shipwrights are like you or me doing fine and dandy on sales, and many good SWs have left the prfoession for this reason among others. It is a problem that needs a new solution.

I'm all for no decay PvP, but not a no decay zone. I'm sure most shipwrights could agree on this point, since DS is empty for the most part anyway except for the people using it for free no decay repairs.

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Wow. That is one 'sploity 'sploit. No wonder I sell like one part every three months.