Shipwright Archive
Thread: Seriously how do you guys come up with your pricing?
Little-Green-Guy
Tue Nov 09, 2004 3:26 pm
#27
Here's how we derived @ our pricing structure.
First of all...you take the 'common denominator' of the 'inverse ratio' ofan aggressive'multiplier' (of your choice)to adjustthe price, on a single resource.
Then, you take that number......multiply to the 5th power (x^5).
Now, calculate the 'actual time' involved in crafting.
For ease of use..i have created this theorem (Please feel free to use and/or modify as you see fit) :
lets assume:
x = amount of hours involved (crafting time)
y = price on resources
we use the following equation.
5x * 2(3y * 45 - 2) / .00001
Those of you who have passed the third grade..are aware we have just created a ratio..or a fraction...alternatly, a percentage.
Hang with me..almost finished.
Take that, newly aquired, percentage and add the new multplier of 3 (This is for all the /tells we get).
finally, tack on another2000 credits/per item. (to adjust for the 'possible' standard devation in your equation)......
Walla! Your all set..new Shipwright Pricing Structure.... 
certifiedandrew
Tue Nov 09, 2004 10:11 pm
#29
GoodOldLarry wrote:On Scylla, the prices on ship designs and components are all over the place. I just saved??? 400k on a Rihkxyrk, style 1.Obviously you guys are gouging the heck out us pilots. Have you played as a pilot? The moneys not there for your profiteering.How much does it actually take to make one of these ships? I respect a mans effort and a fair profit for his wares but wow.
Ask the Quija board!
RagNoRock5x
Tue Nov 09, 2004 11:39 pm
#30
Little-Green-Guy wrote:
Here's how we derived @ our pricing structure.
First of all...you take the 'common denominator' of the 'inverse ratio' ofan aggressive'multiplier' (of your choice)to adjustthe price, on a single resource.
Then, you take that number......multiply to the 5th power (x^5).
Now, calculate the 'actual time' involved in crafting.
For ease of use..i have created this theorem (Please feel free to use and/or modify as you see fit) :
lets assume:
x = amount of hours involved (crafting time)
y = price on resources
we use the following equation.
5x * 2(3y * 45 - 2) / .00001
Those of you who have passed the third grade..are aware we have just created a ratio..or a fraction...alternatly, a percentage.
Hang with me..almost finished.
Take that, newly aquired, percentage and add the new multplier of 3 (This is for all the /tells we get).
finally, tack on another2000 credits/per item. (to adjust for the 'possible' standard devation in your equation)......
Walla! Your all set..new Shipwright Pricing Structure....
In OTHER WORDS - Aproximatly this
Novice = 67,499,800,000
Tier 1 = 202,499,800,000
Tier 2 = 404,999,800,000
Tier 3 = 809,999,800,000
Tier 4 = 1,079,999,800,000
Master = 1,754,999,800,000
Siriusly tho if you take out the "/.00001" then you actualy got yourself a nice pricing guide
Dessimus
Wed Nov 10, 2004 1:21 am
#31
spathotan wrote:
I got my X-wing for 120k, my A-Wing for 240k, and the stats are just as good as those ones priced 500k and up. Right of a vendor, in my servers biggest commercial city. This guy is in a tent, and within 100m from him is about 5 other SW vendors with the same exact ships for 4 and 5 times the ammount. Now is this just my server, or do they all have 1 good SW, i damn nice guy/girl, people-person type and about 10 other SW that are just jackasses and want a profit.
We are not jackasses buddy. Of course the vast majority of us are trying to make a profit. Capitalism's a b|tch isn't it? In my opinion 120k is way too cheap for an x-wing. I'm not saying that I am being greedy and only care about money. I care most about satisfying my customers and enjoying this profession, but I am not wealthy at the moment, so I need to be able to turn a nice profit or I cannot continue to operate my business. I don't spend hours surveying, running all over the damn place tending to harvs, crafting every single piece by hand just to be a nice guy or "good SW" as you called it. I do it to render a service to other people, which just like in RL denotes being paid for said service. As for your 120k x-wing, thats good. You got a great deal. If people can find great deals like that, more power to em. But I am not gonna change my prices just cause bob slob next door is cheaper. just my 2 cents I guess.
Jagged-F3l
Wed Nov 10, 2004 6:10 am
#32
GoodOldLarry wrote:
On Scylla, the prices on ship designs and components are all over the place. I just saved??? 400k on a Rihkxyrk, style 1.
Obviously you guys are gouging the heck out us pilots. Have you played as a pilot? The moneys not there for your profiteering.
How much does it actually take to make one of these ships? I respect a mans effort and a fair profit for his wares but wow.
First, I do play as a pilot. Turnabout is fair play though, so let me ask, "Have you ever played as a shipwright?"
Second, I don't think it's fair for pilots to complain about ship prices at all, for a variety of reaons:
- You can obtain the components you need as loot when doing your thing in space. I see this as a serious problem for the long-term success of shipwrights.
- Pilot skills do not consume your skill points. If you need money, do as the rest of us do and pick up a profession that you can make money on.
Mad-dog98
Wed Nov 10, 2004 6:47 am
#33
I will KILL the next guildmate who gripes about my ship chassis pricing. I WILL NOT SELL AT A LOSS!!!! I WILL SELL AT A FAIR PRICE TO BOTH MYSELF AND MY CUSTOMER!!!! I'm coming into this proffession after being a Master Armorsmith (which I'm still doing) and honestly can't believe how much people are complaining. I figured my prices for ship chassises and components EXACTLY the same way I do for Armor, with a SUBSTANTAILLY lower mark up than I put on my armor. Its like this...
Step 1: Look at schematic
Step 2: Determine the specific types or resources needed and amount of each resource
Step 3: (Here's the tricky part) Determine a CPU for each resource used.
I determine this by how specific the resource is i.e. Mineral=3cpu, Metal=4cpu, Steel=5cpu, Kiirium Steel=6 This is what i'm willing to pay for a resource, ifitexceeds this if/when i buy resources i eat it, but most of the time i harvest everything myself through hunting and harvesters.
Step 4: Mutilply amount of resources used by accompanying CPU
Step 5: ADD MARK UP
Step 6: Sliced Mark Up if Applicable (do all my own slicing, 3 accts, 3 toons per server)
Step 7: Adjust base mark up as needed
Now I don't do this everytime I make a suit of armor. i created a spreadsheet in excel that does this all very much faster than doing it by hand everytime (i have too much free time i guess). I'll use Adv Composite as a comparison to a Tier 1 ship.
Composite uses 5725 UNITS of resources to create a single suit. my base mark up is 275% on unsliced Composite, Sliced i add another 25% on top of that, with the exception of Stun Comp Automatically double the base price, then add slicing mark up. So with the exception of Stun Comp a suit of VERY NICE, Sliced Adv Composite Armor costs 173,292 credits from me, 1/2 to 2/3 the price of 99% of the armorsmiths on my server selling Composite with similar/better/worse stats.
I am now OFFICIALLY Master Shipwright/Master Armorsmith and I'm making a Z-95 (rebel Tier 1 Ship Chassis). This uses 5000 UNITS of resources. Using the same type of considerations for resource CPU and a 200% mark up, NO SLICING (havn't tried slicing ship parts yet) a Tier 1 ship comes out to 63,000 credits. To me a MORE than reasonable price for a starter ship considering you no longer have to use the shuttle to fly between planets, the amount of resources used in the ship, and the fact that I refuse to use CRAP resources for anything. Using the EXACT same mark up and resource CPU considerations, an A-Wing comes out to 1,008,000 credits. Again I don't think this is out rageousely priced, B-Wing 2,010,000 credits. Mark up STILL 200%. and PEOPLE GRIPE AND COMPLAIN, COME ON PEOPLE, this is the end all be all fighter for your profession IT SHOULD BE PRICED ACCORDINGLY and uses 150k in resources to create.
People will gladly pay 2.1 Mil for an AV-21, what can you do with that besidesgripe when the Nightsister kills you in a drive by force knockdown and then kills your precious AV-21 just to spite you. You can't fly to another PLANET with it, you can't KILL anything while riding it, it does NOT save you THAT much money in repair costs compared to other vehicles.I will not pay 2.1Mil for an AV-21, not worth it, doesn't use enough resources to be priced like that. YES i do understand the power plant is a loot component, its not worth 1.5-2mil for that component in my honest opinion.
Back to the Adv Composite Armor vs Tier 1 Ship Chassis. If I sold ANY composite at 63k for the full suit people would think I were insane, newb, or just plane STUPID, 173k a suit undersells most armorsmith on the server and from me you get MORE than you paid for, its come out to 30 cpu for those who don't quite get how I figure my pricing up top. 12.5 cpu for a ship is BY FAR MORE THAN FAIR, when you look at the pricing of ANY OTHER CRAFTING PROFESSION. I speak from experience in the other professions not as an outsider, I know what it takes to BUILD 90% of the items in the game, including Architect, Tailor, Doctor, Droid Engineer, Weaponsmith, Bio-Engineer, Smuggler (not really a craft intensive profession), Chef, and last but not least Master Artisan. These people selling ships at 3 cpu will get no where in the profession, just lose money, and give up b/c they can't buy the resources anymore or can't afford to keep their harvesters going. I would go out and buy all their ships up and start selling them myself at my prices if i didn't break myself on harvesters and resources gearing up for Shipwright, which I only did b/c I have serveral millions worth in armor ready to be sold and WILL sell. So watch out 3 cpu ship sellers, I'm coming, your venders will be empty and your ships will be mine and I will be the one with the nice profit for once.
My 2,010,000 credits worth of an opinion
Little-Green-Guy
Wed Nov 10, 2004 7:15 am
#34
RagNoRock5x wrote:
Little-Green-Guy wrote:
Here's how we derived @ our pricing structure.
First of all...you take the 'common denominator' of the 'inverse ratio' ofan aggressive'multiplier' (of your choice)to adjustthe price, on a single resource.
Then, you take that number......multiply to the 5th power (x^5).
Now, calculate the 'actual time' involved in crafting.
For ease of use..i have created this theorem (Please feel free to use and/or modify as you see fit) :
lets assume:
x = amount of hours involved (crafting time)
y = price on resources
we use the following equation.
5x * 2(3y * 45 - 2) / .00001
Those of you who have passed the third grade..are aware we have just created a ratio..or a fraction...alternatly, a percentage.
Hang with me..almost finished.
Take that, newly aquired, percentage and add the new multplier of 3 (This is for all the /tells we get).
finally, tack on another2000 credits/per item. (to adjust for the 'possible' standard devation in your equation)......
Walla! Your all set..new Shipwright Pricing Structure....
In OTHER WORDS - Aproximatly this
Novice = 67,499,800,000
Tier 1 = 202,499,800,000
Tier 2 = 404,999,800,000
Tier 3 = 809,999,800,000
Tier 4 = 1,079,999,800,000
Master = 1,754,999,800,000
Siriusly tho
woot! know that was intended..ehehhehe
FLFReno
Wed Nov 10, 2004 10:08 am
#35
"These people selling ships at 3 cpu will get no where in the profession, just lose money, and give up b/c they can't buy the resources anymore or can't afford to keep their harvesters going."
That's a flat out lie. With my humble shop, I've been able to run mineral and power harvesters since JTL without the need to do solo groups (I save those for my armor and buff costs). If I stopped doing solo groups...right now...and never did any pilot: well, I'd be just fine with making 100k a day on average.
So what if I'm not ungodly rich after selling ONE tier 4 ship, I'm making a living and seeing other pilots in the skies with me.
You expect a new player to pay 65k for a starter ship? A casual player able to come up with 1 million for their tier 4 ship? Bah, you know that if you harvest your own power and materials with JUST the slots you have left over (6 heavy mineral, 2 fusion) you can get all the stuff you need to make those ships...and that your "uber" resources will give you a 67k mass experimented TIE/advanced over my 66k mass experimented TIE/advanced...that I made for about 10,000-20,000 credits.
Heck, selling that advanced gives me almost 180k of pure profit, which if I can sell one every two days? That'll keep me afloat, I'm pretty sure...
That's a flat out lie. With my humble shop, I've been able to run mineral and power harvesters since JTL without the need to do solo groups (I save those for my armor and buff costs). If I stopped doing solo groups...right now...and never did any pilot: well, I'd be just fine with making 100k a day on average.
So what if I'm not ungodly rich after selling ONE tier 4 ship, I'm making a living and seeing other pilots in the skies with me.
You expect a new player to pay 65k for a starter ship? A casual player able to come up with 1 million for their tier 4 ship? Bah, you know that if you harvest your own power and materials with JUST the slots you have left over (6 heavy mineral, 2 fusion) you can get all the stuff you need to make those ships...and that your "uber" resources will give you a 67k mass experimented TIE/advanced over my 66k mass experimented TIE/advanced...that I made for about 10,000-20,000 credits.
Heck, selling that advanced gives me almost 180k of pure profit, which if I can sell one every two days? That'll keep me afloat, I'm pretty sure...
Ewach
Wed Nov 10, 2004 10:38 am
#36
FLFReno wrote:
Bah, you know that if you harvest your own power and materials with JUST the slots you have left over (6 heavy mineral, 2 fusion) you can get all the stuff you need to make those ships
You are either ignorant or a liar.
You can't mine inert petrochemical or fiberplast with a heavy mineral, both of which are required to make the higher tier ships.
blueoasis
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:25 am
#37
Between my two chars, I have to have 14 extractors and one fusion reactor running to be able to make just a few tier 3-4 ships a day. This is my setup :
6 Heavy Minerals Extractors for steel
3 Heavy Minerals Extractors for ore
2 Heavy Minerals Extractors for alum
1 Heavy Minerals Extractors for iron
1 Heavy Chemical Extractors for inert petro
1 Heavy Chemical Extractors for fiberplast
1 Fusion Reactor
The maintenance costs on these extractors come out to about 15k per week per harvester, or about $225,000 a week.
As you can probably guess, even 14 extractors isn't getting the job done. I really would like to get my alum,iron, inert petro and fiber all up to 2 or 3 extractors each. Will probably have to see if some guildies will lease a few lots to me.
6 Heavy Minerals Extractors for steel
3 Heavy Minerals Extractors for ore
2 Heavy Minerals Extractors for alum
1 Heavy Minerals Extractors for iron
1 Heavy Chemical Extractors for inert petro
1 Heavy Chemical Extractors for fiberplast
1 Fusion Reactor
The maintenance costs on these extractors come out to about 15k per week per harvester, or about $225,000 a week.
As you can probably guess, even 14 extractors isn't getting the job done. I really would like to get my alum,iron, inert petro and fiber all up to 2 or 3 extractors each. Will probably have to see if some guildies will lease a few lots to me.
Message Edited by blueoasis on 11-10-2004 11:26 AM
RagNoRock5x
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:31 am
#38
Yes I know you made that up to be rediculusly long and over priced system Mr. Algebra
Going back and looking at the prices w/o the .00001 thing and it would be on the high end of my bricing quality scale 
15 and up is Crazy
10-15 is high end
7-10 CPU for chassis is fine
7-4 is cheep
4 and under isbuy out time
And to Mr. I-sell-cheep-cuz-i-only-need-this-much-money-and-i-like-seeing-ppl-in-space yes you could make 100k a day easy selling at your buyout prices. I just wish you were on my server, my stock of advanced is running low. And yes 65k for a novice chassis is high, I charge 50k for onesI make and 40k for ones I buy from other people.
A JTL player is not supposed to be self sufficent. He/She is supposed to play the ground game to finance there zero-g escipades. Yes they might have to work a bit to get chassis. Good. Better ships is a goal for people to reach. When you get higher up and actuly have to go and make money specificaly to get a ship, consider your self emirsed into SWG.
JTL is an expansion, not a seperate game. I am sick and bloody tired of people saying "space is un-profitable and pilots cant support them selves". Now while i will admit there should be a way where space can become profitable, like master duty missions or something. It should NOT be self sufficient. You should HAVE to play the ground game inorder to get better stuff for space. If you dont agree with this, go play your X-Wing allyance or whatever bloody other NON-MMORPG space sims are.
Nolseao
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:42 am
#39
my pricing is simple. for each resource i use it costs 2cpu so a Ixiyen which is what you bought would set you back from my vendor 120k credits. We know we can sell a little higher but personaly I dont like to rip people off. If you need a special order filling out email us in game either Ysal, Okacyzzyk or Mirai.
Our city hyperdrive yard all vendors are well priced , situated on Lok, New Haven, Far-Star server.