Shipwright Archive
Thread: Dear Shipwrights, please stop blindly REing components in pursuit of an outdated and outmoded ship.
KaylBreinhar wrote: QUIT BLINDLY WASTING RE PARTS IN PURSUIT OF A SHIP THAT NO LONGER FITS INTO THE REALISTIC STRATEGIC MAKEUP OF JTL. THE KSE HAD IT'S DAY, AND IT ENDED WHEN THE M22-T WAS INTRODUCED.
Message Edited by Raja_Asenn on 09-06-2005 10:18 AM
Sar-larid wrote:
KaylBreinhar wrote:
This, or this, or definitely this...
Not terribly impressed...
KaylBreinhar wrote:
Just in case...
Aw, whatever...
KaylBreinhar wrote:
This too...
Getting the point yet?
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Can we get player bounties on shipwrights like that?
I think you've just proved Kayls point.... I look at those components and I know exactly what kayls problem is. Each and every one of those components has one stat that's probably in the top 5%, making whichever component that held that stat worthwhile before it was reverse engineered. By reverse engineering it with a bunch of junk you get a part that noone would really want in thier ship, whereas there are PLENTY of pilots out there that would pay hundreds of thousands of credits (or more, potentially) for high quality parts pre-REd.
You just have to know what kind of stats to look for, and when I see parts like this I too wish to tell everyone to think before they RE!!!! Heck, if all you players want is a Firespray disk for that occasional high quality loot then I have some to spare. I know pilots who would rather go out and loot 100 low level parts to trade for that one high quality part that you'd throw away just for the chance at having a firespray. Either way it cannot hurt people to look at their loot before reverse engineering.
I've seen people blindly selling thier loot at the chassis dealer for credits, or blindly RE'ing for a firespray, who probably had enough good quality parts that they could have sold and bought 10 of the things, if they sold them to the right people. And better yet, if they hadn't thrown away thier good parts then they'd have something worthy to put into the ships when they do actually get them.
/throws 2 credits out.
/exit thread.
** edit **
OK, and now that I've had my coffee and actually read that last part, I see you were actually agreeing with Kayl. Which brings me to my next lesson to all of you people out there. DON'T POST WITHOUT READING, YOU CAN MAKE YOURSELF LOOK SILLY 
Message Edited by Thunderbyte on 09-06-2005 09:55 AM
Jagged-F3l wrote:
Observe, it is your opinion that the Firespray is not worth us blindly RE'ing space loot.
It's not a matter of opinion that it's not worth it when some shipwrights would gladly trade you one of thoseblueprints for each of a number of those parts.
Jagged-F3l wrote:
Second, the Firespray still has the status of being rare. There just aren't that many of them out there, and some "collectors" are willing to pay for this reason.
I can tell you WHY they're "Rare"(if they even really are anymore); because generally people other than non-regular-pilots/shipwrights don't want them(how many pilots that don't have a clue about flying have you seen say "As soon as I get master I want to get a firespray" ?). As for why they're rare on Eclipse(if I was so inclined no doubt I could rake in enough disks in a week to produce 1 schematic, if only 1), there're some reasons why I wouldn't sell them "Cheap", as someone would certainly just buy them up and sell them at the rediculous prices they've been going for.
The difficulty in gettng a firespray isn't getting the schematic, anymore; from my perspective it's the resources required to actually build it that are the problem and cost.
Jagged-F3l wrote:
Third, the Firespray completes the whole elite Bounty Hunter ensemble, including the jetpack and Mandolorian armor. Some wealthier Bounty Hunters will pay almost anything to "complete the picture".
That's not a bounty hunter ensemble, that's a Boba Fett wannabe ensemble, hehehe.
Thunderbyte wrote:
You just have to know what kind of stats to look for, and when I see parts like this I too wish to tell everyone to think before they RE!!!! Heck, if all you players want is a Firespray disk for that occasional high quality loot then I have some to spare. I know pilots who would rather go out and loot 100 low level parts to trade for that one high quality part that you'd throw away just for the chance at having a firespray. Either way it cannot hurt people to look at their loot before reverse engineering.
To give some perspective on that, I've been doing RE(both collecting and KSE hunting parallel) since JTL launched.
98% at least, if not ALL of my disks have been from LOW level components(1 and 2). I can't remember getting more than 1 disk from anything higher than that.
On top of that,I didn't start getting LOTS of disks until I FOCUSED on 1 and 2 levels; which once got me 4 disks in3 minutes of RE work(btw, those weren't "Junk" L1's and L2's, either, lol; I watch for good stuff on ANY "viable" level).
Thunderbyte wrote:
OK, and now that I've had my coffee and actually read that last part, I see you were actually agreeing with Kayl. Which brings me to my next lesson to all of you people out there. DON'T POST WITHOUT READING, YOU CAN MAKE YOURSELF LOOK SILLY
Don't be too hard on yourself, I have a special subtlety, 
ShaiLyn wrote:
However, if getting another firespray suddenly became more important to me than looking for good RE parts, then I'll throw away whatever I want whenever I want. Blindly or otherwise.It sucks that people throw away good stuff to the chassis dealer, but that's their choice.
That doesn't make any sense. If getting firespray disks is SOOOO difficult, wouldn't it be easier to sell a few components at a high price and just BUY a firespray?
KaylBreinhar wrote:
Think of it this way - 500k+ for a stellar loot part'll buy a LOT of L1/RE1 crap on the bazaar
Paladon wrote:
The "+" after the "500k"(while technically accurate)is a bit of an understatement, if anyone wants tocheck my signature.
Sar-larid wrote:
Jagged-F3l wrote:
Observe, it is your opinion that the Firespray is not worth us blindly RE'ing space loot.
It's not a matter of opinion that it's not worth it when some shipwrights would gladly trade you one of thoseblueprints for each of a number of those parts.
One's man's garbage is another's treasure. This works both ways in this case.
Jagged-F3l wrote:
Second, the Firespray still has the status of being rare. There just aren't that many of them out there, and some "collectors" are willing to pay for this reason.
I can tell you WHY they're "Rare"(if they even really are anymore); because generally people other than non-regular-pilots/shipwrights don't want them(how many pilots that don't have a clue about flying have you seen say "As soon as I get master I want to get a firespray" ?). As for why they're rare on Eclipse(if I was so inclined no doubt I could rake in enough disks in a week to produce 1 schematic, if only 1), there're some reasons why I wouldn't sell them "Cheap", as someone would certainly just buy them up and sell them at the rediculous prices they've been going for.
I don't agree. I know many excellent pilots that want one strictly for show. In fact, there are enough pilots on Chilastra that want them that it causes a supply-demand issue, driving up the price.
In addition, I don't agree with your claim that the Firespray is a "bad" ship. This is strictly a relative term. It highly depends on what the pilot is doing with the ship and the tactics they prefer to employ in doing it.
The difficulty in gettng a firespray isn't getting the schematic, anymore; from my perspective it's the resources required to actually build it that are the problem and cost.
I don't understand your statement, "...the resources required to actually build it that are the problem and cost." Aren't the resource requirements the same as any other master ship? I am asking because I have never completed a set of disks (primarily because I don't deal in loot), and hence not crafted one. If so, why is this so difficult. I craft about 5 master ships a week and don't see the problem. However, if you're not a "crafting shipwright", I can see where this would be a problem (especially at the rate that resource dealers sell resources).
Jagged-F3l wrote:
Third, the Firespray completes the whole elite Bounty Hunter ensemble, including the jetpack and Mandolorian armor. Some wealthier Bounty Hunters will pay almost anything to "complete the picture".
That's not a bounty hunter ensemble, that's a Boba Fett wannabe ensemble, hehehe.
True enough. However, part of the game is a wanna-be role playing for some players. Nothing wrong with that.
Paladon wrote:
ShaiLyn wrote:
However, if getting another firespray suddenly became more important to me than looking for good RE parts, then I'll throw away whatever I want whenever I want. Blindly or otherwise.It sucks that people throw away good stuff to the chassis dealer, but that's their choice.
That doesn't make any sense. If getting firespray disks is SOOOO difficult, wouldn't it be easier to sell a few components at a high price and just BUY a firespray?
You fail to understand that in order to do this, there need to be shipwrights RE'ing for the purpose of finding the disks required to create the blueprint, as the drop rate is fantastically low. All-in-all, I think there is a place in the market place for all kinds of shipwrights doing what they want to do (or what they do best). One person barking at the shipwright community to stop doing it their way and do it his way---didn't we call this communism not too long ago?
KaylBreinhar wrote:
Think of it this way - 500k+ for a stellar loot part'll buy a LOT of L1/RE1 crap on the bazaar
The "+" after the "500k"(while technically accurate)is a bit of an understatement, if anyone wants tocheck my signature.
Jagged-F3l wrote:
Sar-larid wrote:
Jagged-F3l wrote:
Second, the Firespray still has the status of being rare. There just aren't that many of them out there, and some "collectors" are willing to pay for this reason.
I can tell you WHY they're "Rare"(if they even really are anymore); because generally people other than non-regular-pilots/shipwrights don't want them(how many pilots that don't have a clue about flying have you seen say "As soon as I get master I want to get a firespray" ?). As for why they're rare on Eclipse(if I was so inclined no doubt I could rake in enough disks in a week to produce 1 schematic, if only 1), there're some reasons why I wouldn't sell them "Cheap", as someone would certainly just buy them up and sell them at the rediculous prices they've been going for.
I don't agree. I know many excellent pilots that want one strictly for show. In fact, there are enough pilots on Chilastra that want them that it causes a supply-demand issue, driving up the price.
In addition, I don't agree with your claim that the Firespray is a "bad" ship. This is strictly a relative term. It highly depends on what the pilot is doing with the ship and the tactics they prefer to employ in doing it.
I've gotta agree with Jagged.
I've had 3 pilots in the last week ask me if I had any Firesprays or knew where to get one. All of them are Aces, and not green ones. I myself fly a Firespray more then any other ship, because it can pack a huge punch. Me and 2 friends completed the Tier 5 Kashyyyk duty with Nova bosses: the JSF handled fighters, my Firespray made short work of the Novas, and the Oppressor worked the middle ground.
Solo PvP they are not the best ships, but the heavy ships like the Firespray will be in more demand after the POB's get upgraded with the current TC publish to fill the role of a tank buster. In a PvP battle sunday, we faced two well piloted Novas along with the compliment ofA-wings, Vaskis, and Heavy X-wings (Bel-22s, JSF, and RGI were banned from this event). Those Novas could take a beating and half from the Heavy TIE / TIE Advanced / Oppressor crew, and dealt it back very well. 2 Firesprays and a TIE Bomber filled the role of taking those out.
The Firespray got a bad rap, its highly underated as a PvE ship. The only single pilot ships that come close in my opinion are the Heavy X-wing and the Rhix. Hear me out, to make an uber Firespray you need 2 re'd lvl 10 guns, but with 2 of those you are looking at as much firepower as any 3 gun ship equipped with 3 RE'd lvl 8 reward guns (capacitor energy/shot limitations 3 guns vs 2 ect..). It easily has the mass to house these weapons plus 2 missile slot. Most of my re'd lvl 10 guns run about 40-43k mass, so I still have 130k mass left to use after I equip these.
Then you have the gun placement. Some people see that as a weakness, but its by far the best gun placement for killing gunboats and corvettes. You can fire completely in the blind spot of a gunboat while following it from directly behind, also safely puts you in the safe zone when taking out guns on vettes. Considering most people like to farm gunboats for loot in the end game. There is really no down side to the Firespray other then you need uber components to make it great.
The Firespray is an UBER PvE ship but it requires UBER components to make it happen.
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As far as RE'ing components, I RE everything, but I keep the best loots safe util I make the best of possible re'd components. For the components that are junk, I sell them to chassis dealers. I can't keep enough firesprays in stock to stop re'ing every piece of junk I get.
But I agree with you, anyone who RE's a1300 energy lvl 4 capacitor, or a 2800 max damage lvl 6 weapon without taking alot of time to match them with the best parts is missing out on the chance of making a component worth more then a firespray.
Message Edited by Fuss on 09-06-2005 04:05 PM
The Rebels have the 23x-243k (or higher now) B-Wing with four gun mounts, the Freelancers have the tri-gun Krayt (quad with turret, obviously) - Imperials have the Opp and Firespray.
Some of the arguments have been, 'That's my playstyle.' If that's the case, then your 'playstyle' is 'a bad shipwright.'
Buy Level 1, 2, 3 loot from the bazaar, from newbs, from wherever, and RE that. You get way more out of it, and you can come way closer to breaking even buy selling the results back to the dealer. But if you insist on burning through all the loot you have without even looking at it, then don't expect respect from your peers or pilots. And if someone hands you a pre-Nerf Level 6 Engine or a really nice Starmap component, just cancel the trade and say, "Sorry, I don't know what to do with this, I'm just grinding out KSE discs."
Jagged-F3l wrote:
I don't agree with your claim that the Firespray is a "bad" ship.
...What claim?
You're using quotation marks and noone in the thread to that point even posted the word "bad". Where washis claim?
Jagged-F3l wrote:
I don't understand your statement, "...the resources required to actually build it that are the problem and cost." Aren't the resource requirements the same as any other master ship? I am asking because I have never completed a set of disks (primarily because I don't deal in loot), and hence not crafted one. If so, why is this so difficult. I craft about 5 master ships a week and don't see the problem. However, if you're not a "crafting shipwright", I can see where this would be a problem (especially at the rate that resource dealers sell resources).
5 master ships isn't 5 firesprays. The regular master ship schematics are infinite use(and while the disks aren't so Difficult to get, they're not something you just try over and over again to get right). Add to that the attempts to get mass a chunk past 213k (Eclipse people might recognize the names Gefiseiarc, Ysukomi, etc. in 10k-70k piles).
Jagged-F3l wrote:
True enough. However, part of the game is a wanna-be role playing for some players. Nothing wrong with that.
Wish BH's could see Jedi players that way,
Jagged-F3l wrote:
You fail to understand that in order to do this, there need to be shipwrights RE'ing for the purpose of finding the disks required to create the blueprint, as the drop rate is fantastically low.
It's only a fantastically low rate if you're doing it completely wrong:
Sar-larid wrote:
On top of that,I didn't start getting LOTS of disks until I FOCUSED on 1 and 2 levels; which once got me 4 disks in3 minutes of RE work
Jagged-F3l wrote:
One person barking at the shipwright community to stop doing it their way and do it his way---didn't we call this communism not too long ago?
Back in school they called it "Teaching". But if 2+2 ='ing 5 is your thing, sure, do it your way,
(btw, it's not only "One person" barking, )