Rifleman Archive
Thread: Sneaky Sniper or Mr. Heavy Machine Gunner?
Tilon
Sun Feb 01, 2004 6:47 am
#92
1. As our skill tree is set up now. Do you feel we are snipers or heavy gunners?
Right now I feel we are a combo of these two. Sniping when we need to and heavy gunner when need to. Though more often then not Heavy gunners. Nothing like being buffed and unloading on a lair to kill everything before it gets to you. Sniping is more or less restricted to when we hit mind pools even though it drains the hell out of us as well. 100+ HAM for a Headsht3, come on. Also sniper shot and conceal shot fall into this as well.
2. Do you feelwe should be leaning more towards heavygunners or snipers in our skill tree? Our should we balance them out more, keeping them both?
In all honestly in order for us to be effective snipers, it'd make everything unbalanced. One shot one kill, concealability though that is mostly ranger there, increased range and in order for us to be pure snipers, we'd need more then just 80m really and the game engine cannot handle that as well as many of our connections.
So we are stuck with a mix there of, sniping and then when it gets down to it, pulling out the assualtrifle for the gunner work. The use of Cover for extended range is a good idea, or say certain specials have longer range or even just certain rifles. Sniping in PvP would be cool.. but it doesn't work. Only sniping we do now is away from the heavy action taking guys down with lower mind stats then sniper shotting them. Most our PvP action is SS2 on the crowd hoping to cut them down before they get you. This also goes into our high ranged defense which it should be.
3. If you had to pick one or the other what would you want, 100% heavy gunner or 100% sniper?
I really don't think we should ahve to pick one or the other, We should be diverse and open to versitality. Forcing us to just be one thing limits the proffession and it's effectiveness.
4. If the profession is built more on sniping, do you think we should have more range? What should we have?
Hell yes we should have more range. I'd say at least 100m with a 15m min rangeto make it effective. Giving us 70m would be a joke and a waste. Then again the cleint and the so forth most likely could not handle it.
5. If the profession is built more on gunner, do you think we should have more damage types? What should we have?
We should already have more dmg types. Spray-Acid, Tusken-kinetic. I saw the new one coming and I can't wait to get my hands on it. Aside from that the dmg is fine as is the rate. Running and gunning should be not the best for us. Our best is standing still shooting like mad. Though we really need to lower our HAM costs to be effective, with these increased costs it is hard to sustain fire unbuffed for longer then 10 seconds. Heading into heavy action I have to have BoH and Muon or after10 shots, I'm done and shortly there after dead.
For the most part we are fine as is. Though would love better sniping potential. The biggest gripe I have are dmg types and HAM costs. We can't heal our minds like other profs so why should we be paying as much? We run out, we're done.
NeoTheHutt
Sun Feb 01, 2004 12:21 pm
#93
1: Heavy gunners
2: balance
3: Sniper
4: yes, around 75m
5: Kinetic, Blast, Stun
cincoalto
Sun Feb 01, 2004 3:09 pm
#94
I doubt this would ever happen but what i would like to see is this. Pretty much keep current riflemen as is (fixing bugs obvisouly). But i would like to see aother Elite elite riflemen class. Where u have to be master currentrifle and maybe marksmen. in this branch we finally get a big advantage over other classes. we woudl get dbl 64m range, have a newer "sniper rifle" for the extra range and accuracy that has increased dmg but much slower. we would also get a new machine gun type weapon that does kinetic dmg and has ability to spray dmg over lots of targets, with a kd, and does decent dmg, but is inaccurate if moving. (would also have to make current T21 a lil more of a mix between the 2 of these, lil slower speed and more accurate at closer rng). as a master elite elite riflemen you would also get the holy 1 shot 1 kill type deal. But with this you would A.) have to be at perfect rng B.) wait till target is not moving C.) be under cover or something like a meditate where u become very vulnerable to melee attacks but increases ur accuracy at this long rng (this would force u to have afriend in case something sneaks up on u like it should be)D.) this attack would almost completely drain ur mind so if u don't wait till all these fall into place then u not only miss but r screwed.
But since that would prob never happen i would like to see current rifle a mix between machine gunner and sniper. we need 2 weapons though. t21 that is slower more dmg and inc range, and a more machine gun like gun with a kdish like attack, (perhaps something that drives them to dive into prone butlets them also get back up in a sec or 2)or atleast something to slow down stuff running at us besides the feared warning shot!
mrmark200000
Tue Feb 03, 2004 10:20 am
#95
1 i'd go with sniper
2 sniper, dont think were much of a heavy gunner
3 sniper
4 i agree with previous posts- double the range of other weapons, and hit accurately at those ranges
5 like others said, pre nerf t21 anyone?
TakeshiRyuuko
Tue Feb 03, 2004 11:01 am
#96
1. As our skill tree is set up now. Do you feel we are snipers or heavy gunners?
As we are set up now, we are what our profession states, we're riflemen. In today's Army, Riflemen are the core of theinfantry. From thisplateau we can either specialize inSupport (Heavy MachineGunner) orSniper. How we apply different specials while we play determines our preference totitles.
2. Do you feelwe should be leaning more towards heavygunners or snipers in our skill tree? Our should we balance them out more, keeping them both?
Keep both, but modify just a bit. As specialists I feel Sniper and Support should be extended professions which we have to earn yet more experience. ( Such an Idea might also help get people off of profession dabbling.)
3. If you had to pick one or the other what would you want, 100% heavy gunner or 100% sniper?
Keep it the way it is if anything. I know my tag says 'Master Sharpshooter' but I'd rather it be a Rifleman.
4. If the profession is built more on sniping, do you think we should have more range? What should we have?
If sniper were to become an extension of rifleman, I'd say 3 things need to happen alsoa couple weapons need to be solely Sniper oriented.
A. Range should be extended if only to 80-90 m (despite what dev's say I think that if I can see my target I should be able to shoot it, and I've seen alot of creatures show up in my view at sometimes 90-100 m away, so a range extension for a Sniper Specialist isn't out of the question. They just need to work the code a little more to get it to work.)
B. If anything a speed cap of 4-5 seconds should be placed on Snipers, as they are methodical shooters that pick targets and wait for their shots. The One Shot Kill as proposed by most pro-snipers should have a speed cap of 10-12 seconds. Harsh time penalties but think about what you're supposed to be doing as a sniper.
C. As an extension rifleman, a tree in Sniper Specialist should be devoted solely to camoflague (Rangers flame away) as it only makes sense that a Sniper is SUPPOSED to be hidden from view of his targets. Several other aspects such as terrain negotiation and other stealth actions can be apart of this tree.
WEAPONS:
Disruptor Rifle - The one hit one kill weapon. Disruptor Rifles take time to charge thus the extended speed cap on Snipers.
T21-Ghost - A specialized version of the T21 Rifle the T21-Ghost should have a scope and be scaled completely toward Damage to illicit a One Shot Kill, as such this weapon willhave a considerably slow refire rate(12 second cap).
ARMOR:
Very Light armor restrictions or even a downgrade to Ranged Mit 2 ( at least as far as defenses go)
5. If the profession is built more on gunner, do you think we should have more damage types? What should we have?
As with the Sniper Specialist, Support also has several points and different weapons.
A. Range of 60m is perfectly legit for this specialization as you should be noticeable by everyone in the vicinity (see Weapons List). From this range a suppression move such as Suppression Fire is a good idea.
B. As a Support Specialist I propose an extension of Ranged Mitigation to a Ranged Mit 4 (a defense only Mitigation) only available in this Specialization. As a rule of thumb a support gunner is usually the most heavily armored of any rifleman type.
C. Support gunners should be allowed the speed cap we currently have of 1 second (Duh... using heavy machine guns). Of course accuracy will be given up for speed.
WEAPONS:
E-Web -The support gunner's BFG, if people around you don't see this hangingoff of your shoulders, there is somethingwrong with their eyesight. The heaviest firepower available to the Support gunner shouldhavea medium ofmax damage (say 200-300) but the speed more than makes up for lack of damage per shot. Accuracy will falter with the speed of the shots though.
T21 Goliath - Considerably lighter than the E-Web, but stillacannon unto itself, the Goliath is the fastest T21 around. Less damage output than your standard T21 but the speed again compensates.Consideringthe Goliath's size compared to the E-Web...better accuracy.
*Side Note*T21's Goliath and Ghost are in no way affiliated andknown names in SW lore. Just my names for the two different rifles as I felt a differentiation needed to be seen.
Darius18
Wed Feb 04, 2004 1:52 am
#97
unless of course you get into the higher power sniper rifles, then ranges can increase drastically beyond this
MSP0 wrote:
4.- Rifle accurate out to whatever maximum range the technology permits. Carbines out to 40m, pistols 20m. The standard Rifle engagement range in RL is about 2-400m.
UniSmurf
Fri Feb 06, 2004 1:08 am
#98
1. As our skill tree is set up now. Do you feel we are snipers or heavy gunners?
Both.
Sniper - Conceal shot, Headshot, surprise shot, etc.
Heavy gunner - Flurry2, Strafe2, etc
2. Do you feelwe should be leaning more towards heavygunners or snipers in our skill tree? Our should we balance them out more, keeping them both?
Neither.
The class is perfectly balance between the 2 at the momment. When you reach master it all comes together in a very big way. However, getting to master is a bit of a chore.
3. If you had to pick one or the other what would you want, 100% heavy gunner or 100% sniper?
Niether. I like how SOE has done the Rifleman class. They did a good job. We areTHE most powerfull PvE class in the game. We can solo rancors, Some Night sisters (depending on resists), Force crystal hunters, etcwithout a scratch isn't weak.
4. If the profession is built more on sniping, do you think we should have more range? What should we have?
Range is restricted by the game design. We have beat this to death and then some.
5. If the profession is built more on gunner, do you think we should have more damage types? What should we have?
As a heavy gunner we can focus on damage types (health attacks, action attacks, mind attacks) with AOE attacks.
I guess to summarize.. With the current T21 (post nerf) I don't see any issues with the class that limit me from kicking major butt.
Due to game design, there is not such thing as a sniper at long range. Nor do i think we should get that ability.
In pvp with my Jawa or T21 i do 600+ damage every second. I'd say that pretty good when i'm over 50m away. Funny thing is i do that damage to 5 or 6 at the same time with strafe2. Wow.. look at them drop. Imagine what 2 or 3 Master Riflemen could do *shiver*.
The only 2 things we really could use is 2 new rifles that do kenetic and heat damage types and bump the Jawa rifle to medium AP.
I think the tusken is supposed to be kenetic but shows as energy.. *Shrug*.
Anyway.. rifleman is the most amazing class in the game, don't be ruining it guys by asking for more then we should.
IvoTosroe
Fri Feb 06, 2004 2:03 pm
#100
ok, well, ive been reading a lot of threads lately regarding whether rifleman is a class of machine gun wielding grunts or silent assassins and here is what i think of the entire situation (im a novice rifleman):
Personally, after all the reading that I have done, I am quite dissapointed at having come so far at this point to novice rifleman. I was looking forward to being able to actually be a sniper of some sort but according to what I have read so far it does not appear that that will be happening. Therefore I think I'll be chaning professions very shortly rather than even trying to get master rifleman.
I do agree that the system should be balanced. But that simply means that if you select to focus onthe sniper tree, you should be more of a sniper, and visa versa for heavy gunner. Masters should have the ability to choose what they want to be out of the 4 treessince they are the masters of 4 separate trees focusing on different skill paths which lead up to master.
I do agree that the system should be balanced. But that simply means that if you select to focus onthe sniper tree, you should be more of a sniper, and visa versa for heavy gunner. Masters should have the ability to choose what they want to be out of the 4 treessince they are the masters of 4 separate trees focusing on different skill paths which lead up to master.
Now unfortunately it seems that the whole extending range idea will not work according to what the devs say. As many have used in countering this statement, "Why can combat medics apply poision/diseases at 80-100m?" Seems very odd if you ask me. And as for 1 shot kills, depends on the situation of pvp that you are dealing with. I think that if you challenge someone to a duel, sure, 1 shot kills is a problem and it shouldn't be aloud. But if we are talking about overt tactics here, for example, if i am an overt imperial and happen to decide to pay a visit to anchorhead and there happens to be an overt rebel sitting out in the open in the middle of the city while imon the top of the hill peering down at him without him noticing, I think I should be aloud the opportunity for a 1 shot kill. Sure, not too many opportunities arise like this, but it does happen. And I think that should be therisk you have to take and deal withfor going overt in the first place. In regards to dueling, once again, 1 shot kills are a problem. But in regards to overt raids/tactics, I do not see any problem with 1 shot killing. Hell, I wasincapacitatedin one shot and shortly afterdeath blownthe other day in Bestine by an Apprentice Carbine Specialist from behind while I was using the Bazarre Terminal. I never saw it coming and it was all because I was overt and so was he. So explain to me why we can't have 1 shot killing then? Seems like an almost identical situation to me. And yes, it did happen for those of you who think I am a liar.
Some people tend to think that the rifleman profession is more or less just a more powerful and more ranged version of the carbine profession. Sure, this is a stretch, but from what I've read and heard so far as well as seen, it's a reasonable stretch.
IvoTosroe
Fri Feb 06, 2004 2:09 pm
#102
ok, well, ive been reading a lot of threads lately regarding whether rifleman is a class of machine gun wielding grunts or silent assassins and here is what i think of the entire situation (im a novice rifleman):
Personally, after all the reading that I have done, I am quite dissapointed at having come so far at this point to novice rifleman. I was looking forward to being able to actually be a sniper of some sort but according to what I have read so far it does not appear that that will be happening. Therefore I think I'll be chaning professions very shortly rather than even trying to get master rifleman.
I do agree that the system should be balanced. But that simply means that if you select to focus onthe sniper tree, you should be more of a sniper, and visa versa for heavy gunner. Masters should have the ability to choose what they want to be out of the 4 treessince they are the masters of 4 separate trees focusing on different skill paths which lead up to master.
I do agree that the system should be balanced. But that simply means that if you select to focus onthe sniper tree, you should be more of a sniper, and visa versa for heavy gunner. Masters should have the ability to choose what they want to be out of the 4 treessince they are the masters of 4 separate trees focusing on different skill paths which lead up to master.
Now unfortunately it seems that the whole extending range idea will not work according to what the devs say. As many have used in countering this statement, "Why can combat medics apply poision/diseases at 80-100m?" Seems very odd if you ask me. And as for 1 shot kills, depends on the situation of pvp that you are dealing with. I think that if you challenge someone to a duel, sure, 1 shot kills is a problem and it shouldn't be aloud. But if we are talking about overt tactics here, for example, if i am an overt imperial and happen to decide to pay a visit to anchorhead and there happens to be an overt rebel sitting out in the open in the middle of the city while imon the top of the hill peering down at him without him noticing, I think I should be aloud the opportunity for a 1 shot kill. Sure, not too many opportunities arise like this, but it does happen. And I think that should be therisk you have to take and deal withfor going overt in the first place. In regards to dueling, once again, 1 shot kills are a problem. But in regards to overt raids/tactics, I do not see any problem with 1 shot killing. Hell, I wasincapacitatedin one shot and shortly afterdeath blownthe other day in Bestine by an Apprentice Carbine Specialist from behind while I was using the Bazarre Terminal. I never saw it coming and it was all because I was overt and so was he. So explain to me why we can't have 1 shot killing then? Seems like an almost identical situation to me. And yes, it did happen for those of you who think I am a liar.
Some people tend to think that the rifleman profession is more or less just a more powerful and more ranged version of the carbine profession. Sure, this is a stretch, but from what I've read and heard so far as well as seen, it's a reasonable stretch.
-rav-
Mon Feb 09, 2004 9:19 am
#103
If you nerf the dmg anymore on rifleman we should get atleast 40mmore range, as it is now i dont hit much while im moving and when i master tka is chasing me idont havemuch choice then to run like hell.
TKM within 20m = dead
Also the specials are extremely high and it eats from a pool that cant be healed and even with 1000 focus 1200 mind im out of combat within several shots.
FeldwebelKarr
Sun Feb 15, 2004 1:33 am
#104
I think at Master Rifleman, we should get a sniper shot attack. Which 1 hit kills the player target, with a 10-15 minute timer before we can use it again. That gives us the sniping capabilities with out really being over powered.I would expect it to use alot of mind as well, maybe a couple hundred or something.