Rifleman Archive
Thread: Sniper Shot
elevation43
Fri Jun 04, 2004 12:41 pm
#53
Ogge_the_Lizard wrote:
Baccaa wrote:
Well that makes sence. I think the description on the shot said a high damage attack(nothing about DBing) Thanks a bunch.
Actually I thinkthe description says something like: "A very powerful shot that can kill an incapacitated target"
And the skillbox itself states: "At this level the Rifleman becomes the only profession in the galaxy that can kill incapacitated targets from long range"
I think that is pretty clear what it's all about.
oOooo u got told
Seeker1
Wed Mar 30, 2005 8:28 am
#54
Rather than remove the sniper shot all together and leave db's for melee range only, why can't it be worked to have the same kind of rights to a db as you would looting a corpse in the current game setup? Hopefully this hasn't been brought up already in profession discussions, I just haven't seen it.
Ackehece
Wed Mar 30, 2005 8:45 am
#55
Seeker1 wrote:
Rather than remove the sniper shot all together and leave db's for melee range only, why can't it be worked to have the same kind of rights to a db as you would looting a corpse in the current game setup? Hopefully this hasn't been brought up already in profession discussions, I just haven't seen it.
timers...
If you are 50+m away and you incap someone in pvp you will have to run to their body (putting you out of position). wait through the warm up timer and then DB them. With the incap timer being shorten rifleman would never get to the body in time before they recapacitated. Therefore it is better to let the brawler standing there do the DB.
The reason that it is being removed deals with the idea you can defend a person who is incapped now. As the DB requires a timer - it can be interrupted. With a ranged DB they may not notice the timer on the rifleman starting to warm up a DB. Whereas you would see a brawler standing with in 6m of the downed target and getting ready to db.
OTOH: this leads to a counter-death blow. Rifleman will be at the edges of the battle. You see a teamate drop. You see an enemy combat charge the corpse and start to setup a db. You fire a quick shot at that combatant interrupting his death blow.
Odinwaa
Wed Mar 30, 2005 9:32 am
#56
Well the loss of sniper shot is crushing to individual play. One on one pvp if I incap at max range, will I have adequate time to get to the corpse before they come out of incap? If they drop sniper shot we should have a shot similar that takes out a major portion of one of the pools on a successful role, inflicts a major wound, or a chance to incap auto.
I am getting scared that we will have lost most of our excellent specials. And thus the whole point of being the best at the longest distance.
/headshot3?
/mindshot2?
/snipershot?
I am getting scared that we will have lost most of our excellent specials. And thus the whole point of being the best at the longest distance.
/headshot3?
/mindshot2?
/snipershot?
Odinwaa
Wed Mar 30, 2005 12:14 pm
#58
Ackehece wrote:
Odinwaa wrote:
Well the loss of sniper shot is crushing to individual play. One on one pvp if I incap at max range, will I have adequate time to get to the corpse before they come out of incap? If they drop sniper shot we should have a shot similar that takes out a major portion of one of the pools on a successful role, inflicts a major wound, or a chance to incap auto.
I am getting scared that we will have lost most of our excellent specials. And thus the whole point of being the best at the longest distance.
/headshot3?
/mindshot2?
/snipershot?Our Role is completely changing.We ask that you forget the old system entirely as it has nothing to do with how the new system works and how the professions work together. They will never allow 1 shot incaps. Our specials are completely changing to the new role. So much so that 1 on 1 pvp as a rifleman will be a BAD idea. Timers will be longer on our attacks then many of the other professions, our weapons will be longer delayed.
Ok I am starting to ease into your idea of our roles changing. But if 1 vs 1 pvp as a rifleman is a BAD idea is this really a combat balance? The reason I say this was before it wasn't such a good idea anyway with KD/Dizzy from a melee and we were done. My impression of this whole process was that we were going to see that each combat prof. had certain skills that while different, would allow any prof. to fight any other prof. and stand a chance depending on how your tactics were used. But I am beginning to think that I assumed wrong.
Ackehece
Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:45 pm
#60
Odinwaa wrote:
Ackehece wrote:
Odinwaa wrote:
Well the loss of sniper shot is crushing to individual play. One on one pvp if I incap at max range, will I have adequate time to get to the corpse before they come out of incap? If they drop sniper shot we should have a shot similar that takes out a major portion of one of the pools on a successful role, inflicts a major wound, or a chance to incap auto.
I am getting scared that we will have lost most of our excellent specials. And thus the whole point of being the best at the longest distance.
/headshot3?
/mindshot2?
/snipershot?
Our Role is completely changing.We ask that you forget the old system entirely as it has nothing to do with how the new system works and how the professions work together. They will never allow 1 shot incaps. Our specials are completely changing to the new role. So much so that 1 on 1 pvp as a rifleman will be a BAD idea. Timers will be longer on our attacks then many of the other professions, our weapons will be longer delayed.
Ok I am starting to ease into your idea of our roles changing. But if 1 vs 1 pvp as a rifleman is a BAD idea is this really a combat balance? The reason I say this was before it wasn't such a good idea anyway with KD/Dizzy from a melee and we were done. My impression of this whole process was that we were going to see that each combat prof. had certain skills that while different, would allow any prof. to fight any other prof. and stand a chance depending on how your tactics were used. But I am beginning to think that I assumed wrong.
it is a more rock paper scissors balance:
That is there will be situations where we will almost always come out on top and there will be situations where we will almost always be beaten to death. It is not just profession balance but situational balance.
Cpl_Fisher
Wed Mar 30, 2005 4:50 pm
#61
Mafaza wrote:
relax, all combat profs are lost/freaking out atm
I never freak out, when I get confused, I just start breaking things....
ScreaminBanshee
Wed Mar 30, 2005 5:02 pm
#62
i disagree with the one on one bit... a long range rifleman should, if he knows what he is doing, be able to do damage before the enemy even gets close... fire all shots from seperate cooldown groups, retreat and repeat... of course a person w/ higher terrain negotiation will catch you, but thats where the second profession kicks in. switching to a sword (for a stacked template) or a tkm (for a varied template) will provide survival. You commented on a rifleman with only rifles skills, but that just isn't the case in this type of game. I believe you are a tester, and considering i haven't played since september i am not, but as one of the best pvpers on tempest i've developed an instinct about what this game is like. Perhaps you can correct me, i would hold no grudge at being proven wrong, as this is just what i have drawn from the information i am privy to. However, to me it seems like devs took stacking to a new level. One can now stack to be good at the same thing in different situations (i.e. crowd control in short or medium range w/ a pistol/carbine template, or high damage in short and long range in a swords/rifles template), could use professions that indirectly help each other (bh/rifleman is a good thing for one on one it seems, as they are both structured in that way, likewise a bh/carbineer seems a little conflicted as one is for crowd control whilst the other is for one on one), or could use 2 different professions that are good in completely different situations, yet still help each other (like rifleman/tkm or carbines/fencer), thus not being as good in one genre, but more versatile. If you could improve or correct these statements that would be great.
P.S. i am aware i left out the other .5 professions we have skill points left over for, but just for discussion's sake i thought this would suffice.
edit: this was in response to Ackehece
Crud Onacracker
Message Edited by ScreaminBanshee on 03-30-2005 04:02 PM
Message Edited by ScreaminBanshee on 03-30-2005 04:03 PM
Ackehece
Wed Mar 30, 2005 5:14 pm
#63
ScreaminBanshee wrote:
i disagree with the one on one bit... a long range rifleman should, if he knows what he is doing, be able to do damage before the enemy even gets close... fire all shots from seperate cooldown groups, retreat and repeat... of course a person w/ higher terrain negotiation will catch you, but thats where the second profession kicks in. switching to a sword (for a stacked template) or a tkm (for a varied template) will provide survival. You commented on a rifleman with only rifles skills, but that just isn't the case in this type of game. I believe you are a tester, and considering i haven't played since september i am not, but as one of the best pvpers on tempest i've developed an instinct about what this game is like. Perhaps you can correct me, i would hold no grudge at being proven wrong, as this is just what i have drawn from the information i am privy to. However, to me it seems like devs took stacking to a new level. One can now stack to be good at the same thing in different situations (i.e. crowd control in short or medium range w/ a pistol/carbine template, or high damage in short and long range in a swords/rifles template), could use professions that indirectly help each other (bh/rifleman is a good thing for one on one it seems, as they are both structured in that way, likewise a bh/carbineer seems a little conflicted as one is for crowd control whilst the other is for one on one), or could use 2 different professions that are good in completely different situations, yet still help each other (like rifleman/tkm or carbines/fencer), thus not being as good in one genre, but more versatile. If you could improve or correct these statements that would be great.
P.S. i am aware i left out the other .5 professions we have skill points left over for, but just for discussion's sake i thought this would suffice.
edit: this was in response to Ackehece
Crud Onacracker
Message Edited by ScreaminBanshee on 03-30-2005 04:02 PM
Message Edited by ScreaminBanshee on 03-30-2005 04:03 PM
a very good summary you have there.
It does address the fact our combat skills will stack now and yes a ranged/ranged combatant will be more powerful (in a very literal sense).
however rifleman have at least one weakness that has not be stated yet in the documents that can make it so that rifleman will not be so good one on one. we will need the second ranged profession or we will be left out of much content.
A Carbineer/Pistoleer will have in a straight up fight with a rifleman/carb or rif/pista 70% chance I feel of coming out ahead in one on one pvp. OTOH! in group combat a Rifleman/XXXX will rock ^-^
Message Edited by Ackehece on 03-30-2005 05:16 PM
ScreaminBanshee
Wed Mar 30, 2005 5:21 pm
#64
well my main concern is that as a damage dealer with long times between shots and that moving while doing a special will interrupt shots is we obviously will need a profession that can slow the other guy down, or that can handle him once he gets there. and i assume that they make ranged/ranged and melee/melee more powerful by incorporating overall damage modifiers for the respective damage within the various ranged and melee professions. however, they could also make it so that a bh has a special in one cooldown group that matches or goes with a rifleman special in a different cooldown group. this would allow a rifleman to fire his special, and while that is cooling down, fire the special that helps him from the bh group. now none of this adresses your mysterious unkown defense problem. i would have thought that it would have been what i stated in my first sentence here, but that seems to have been implied in the documents... hmmm... maybe professions will have toughness vs other professions similar to the tk unarmed toughness now, and rifleman lacks any significant defense. i shall ponder possible solutions (or you could throw me the bone yourself ^_^... damn the NDA)
Crud Onacracker
Waste93
Wed Mar 30, 2005 6:24 pm
#65
Just because there will be no more ranged DBs doesn't mean that SniperShot is going away.