Rifleman Archive

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AldeonAvardulin wrote:

I dont get how Pistol players any type dont realize how they are in fact masters of both long range and short range. We are supposed to be the masters of logn range, meaning we shoot 10x better then you at 64 meters.

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Aldeon, we're trying to explain our position to you using a variety of logical arguments, and you're saying the same thing over and over. If you are on a crusade to get Pistoleers nerfed, then I pity you, and hope the Riflemen soon get a correspondent who will instead get the Rifleman class fixed.

As far as I am concerned, this discussion was over before it began. You have made up your mind, and will not be swayed. Fare you all well, and may Sony have mercy on your class.

-c.

Anyone who understands the speed equations realizes that this so-called "speed nerf" only hurts very high level riflemen (+80 speed or higher) by preventing them from shooting a T21 or Laser Rifle once per second. Now they have to fire once per three seconds.

As Aldeon and several others have conceded, Aldeon's proposed change only helps riflemen in PvP and helps them by enabling them to kite other classes. While others have proposed changes on other threads that would reduce the kiting issue, Aldeon (and most of the gung-ho folks on this thread) seem to think it would be neat if a rifleman could run backwards and kill a pistoleer (or smuggler or BH or carbineer)from 64m by kiting him.

Right now, very high level riflemen are extremely powerful in PvP. The two best PvPers on my server are both Master RIflemen. The speed thing won't change that very much, because their power is based on mindshot2 and the unhealablity of mind damage, not speed. They hit me once with mindshot2 and I'm dead. But maybe lower speed hurts them, I'll take your word for it.

What I don't understand is why you use a "nerf" to very high level riflemen as a way to justify being able to kite other classes. Aldeon's reasoning is that you should be the "master" of long ranges. Fine. So if you make rifles 35% or even 50% more accurate than pistols at those ranges, you're a master. Making us unable to attack you at 64m is preposterous ... maybe we should make it so you can't fire at targets that are closer than 32m? I mean, come on. The whole reason the Devs gave us all the same range is to prevent kiting, and they're lengthening melee range is because kiting is such a big problem.

What I question is why your correspondent has chosen "kite other professions" as your #1 issue. Rifle _does_ have a lot of problems. Instead of pushing for 2.5 melee penalty to be removed or for a HAM cost reduction, you're pushing for something that will either (1) never happen because it's so stupid or (2) would be so unbalancing if it were in the game that every other combat class would be calling for you to be nerfed.

I think your correspondent, by focusing on nerfing other classes so he can get a leg up in PvP, is ignoring the real problems (both PvP and PvE) that lower level riflemen face. A riflemen who is 2-2-1-1 won't have his speed effected at all, and wants to get that **edit** 2.5 melee penalty removed. Maybe to you, as a Master who doesn't PvE and uses Muon Gold all the time, nailing those darn pistol guys is the #1 issue. But trying to nerf the rest of us is not the right way to represent all the other riflemen when you have some major problems with your own class that should be fixed.

You just dont get what Im trying to say. Rifleman are supposed to be the masters of logn range are they not? Pistoleers are the masters of short range, yet it happens to be pistoleers are the masters of both long and short range.

I am in fact trying to get you nerfed, just like you got us nerfed. Your getting us to shoot slow, all I want is to be the master of long range.

I once again invite any master pistoleer to PM me, and do some tests to prove that you are in fact accurate at both short and logn range.

Until you prove me wrong that you are not extremely accurate at long range, I will not stop trying to get range mods adjusted.

It is not that they can stack abilities, thats not the problem. The problem is that there styles have so much bonus to accuracy, there negatives dont matter.

Anyways, for the 20th time, I invite the Pistol Correspondant to PM me to do tests so he can prove that I am wrong. Is that so hard?

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Elanoic wrote:

Aldeon, we're trying to explain our position to you using a variety of logical arguments, and you're saying the same thing over and over. If you are on a crusade to get Pistoleers nerfed, then I pity you, and hope the Riflemen soon get a correspondent who will instead get the Rifleman class fixed.

As far as I am concerned, this discussion was over before it began. You have made up your mind, and will not be swayed. Fare you all well, and may Sony have mercy on your class.

-c.

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Interesting seeing how I see neither logic nor variety in your arguments. This isn't a religious crusade to destroy all others, however thanks to us being nerfed to kingdom come it is only fair that you be brought to our level or we rise up to yours...only thing is that we were nerfed for being your equals if not betters right? So bringing us back up would be somewhat hypocritical which I can ignore yet they are still proposing "fixes" that are hurting us more then the other classes. We are already screwed over by the dev's lack of foresight. Not the 2.5x melee mod, not the lack accuracy, but the fact that we kill ourselves faster then any other class thanks to our gift. Because of that fact we cannot use armor seeing how the primary encumberance if for mind harmind us and practically us alone.

Let Sony have mercy on us? Why when they have never shown it once.

Jaeg, I want you to admit to the fact that you guys are accurate at both short and long ranges. Otherwise, test with me and prove me wrong.

that should be an is, and harming...my kingdom for an edit button.

Jaegen88,

I was with ya on page 2 of this thread, you were doing ok in your response to Noules. But you lost me now, this last post wasa bit... troll'ish

If you are so impressed/envious of the rifleman's abilities to /cover and increased crawl speed, I'll gladly trade them both to you for the pistol user'sability to be 95% accurate at ALL ranges even while running. A two for one deal you cant pass up! Please do enjoy the fun teleporting bonus ability you will receive at no extra charge.

Seriously, Jaegen88 and Aldeon, you two need to take it out to the parking lot, have a nice little brawl to get it out of your systems, have a beer after, then sit down and figure out how you can come up with some kind of proposal that's fair for both proffessions... If the devs see nothing but a flamewar in discussions, they'll just ignore both of youand make a completely uninformed, "well the numbers in my projection said this would be a good idea" type 'balance' patch that will just make issues worse.

Help them help us.

Or flip a coin to see who gets to be uber and who needs to just hush...

I call heads...wait no tails ya tails....wait screw tails he sucked in sonic 2 I"m sticking with heads, come on baby needs a new line of skills.

Well you see the problem is, I have offered him 20 times to do testing together. But he hasnt responded to me once.

I still agree with Aldeon. Sometimes nerfs are just necessary. Increasing your own abilities won't always be enough. For example Jaegen, even if they make rifles 100% accurate at long range it does not change the fact the the Pistoleer is hitting me. Hitting me on my turf. You can give us all the accuracy in the world but this will remain the same. Like Aldeon said, give us the proof that a Pistol is very inaccurate at long range and maybe capping Pistol range won't be necessary. But I doubt you can provide the proof