Rifleman Archive
Thread: StartleShot1/2
Waste93
Wed Aug 18, 2004 1:05 pm
#40
Both BH and Carbineer can do Blind right now.
XaverriJade7 wrote:
Also, seems like people have moved past the Blind status effect idea. I still like it though. It's already in-game, so it's not asking for much of any work at all as far as coding it in. I know BHs are one ranged profession that can Blind- can Carbineers do it too?(Too many of their specials were broken when I mastered). If they have it, then I can see how we may be infringing on their territory. If not, let's not forget about this until we know for sure if these other ideas will even be considered by the Dev team.
jhfries
Wed Aug 18, 2004 3:05 pm
#41
The ability to stop an opponent from advancing/moving would be cool. Sort of like a delay I guess, not really a posture change, just a plain old "fly paper" effect, for x amount of time, perhaps varyingat different levels of skill.
Another thought would be to remove it all together and perhaps create a different attack, such as someone mentioned an action or health only attack much like brawling professions. Perhaps a Concealshot 2? Greater damage maybe? Less risk? Faster? I think we should stick to the mantra of high damage, low state offence.
Thanks guys,
Ivon
Wed Aug 18, 2004 3:10 pm
#42
ooh, the "alertness" skill that is currently at support4 and master fencer right now could also give a mod with a saving roll vs movement slowdown/delay.. just something to think about 
XaverriJade7
Thu Aug 19, 2004 12:47 am
#43
PsychoticChipmunk wrote:
Well to help the rangers, allow startleshot to stack with traps. That way you can slow the person down by half or so(capped) by using multiple traps and the shot. As per the difference between startle 1 and 2 I agree, an AoE would just be too powerful. We could make damn near everyone crawl to get us and just reverse kite people/get out of the battle and retreat alive(assuming we slow them down enough) so how about this. They both stay single target and just hit for more slowing ability between the two. Startle 1 slows them down from 15-18% randomly (1/6th) and startle 2 slows them from 30-34% randomly (1/3rd) startleshot 2 also has the chance to either kick someone out of burstrun or to simply make somebody tired so they can't burst run, even jedi. Not sure which of those would be the most realistic to have.
One other idea along these lines is to have the 1st version be the higher 30-34% single-target slow and make the 2nd version an AoE 15-18% slow. That's only if an attack of this sort can be made AoE without getting too powerful.
Also, seems like people have moved past the Blind status effect idea. I still like it though. It's already in-game, so it's not asking for much of any work at all as far as coding it in. I know BHs are one ranged profession that can Blind- can Carbineers do it too?(Too many of their specials were broken when I mastered ). If they have it, then I can see how we may be infringing on their territory. If not, let's not forget about this until we know for sure if these other ideas will even be considered by the Dev team.
). If they have it, then I can see how we may be infringing on their territory. If not, let's not forget about this until we know for sure if these other ideas will even be considered by the Dev team.
PyscoJuggalo
Thu Aug 19, 2004 3:45 pm
#44
Waste93 wrote:
Both BH and Carbineer can do Blind right now.
XaverriJade7 wrote:
Also, seems like people have moved past the Blind status effect idea. I still like it though. It's already in-game, so it's not asking for much of any work at all as far as coding it in. I know BHs are one ranged profession that can Blind- can Carbineers do it too?(Too many of their specials were broken when I mastered
I think BH is the only ranged professionthat hasblind attacks.........
Spray Shot(carbine) and Eyeshot(pistol).
Though many carbineers now pick up MBH to get the nasty speed and specials(I swear by Spray shot, my favorite special in all carbine).
Back on topic
If we gave Startle 1 & 2 Snare abilities to keep it balanced we can do this:
Startle 1 has a 30 second snare effect and Startle 2 can have a 15 second snare effect. That way the AOE would not be Overpowered.
Also making it stack with P-darts would still keep the ranger's/Scout's usefullness with traps.
Vaelorn
Thu Aug 19, 2004 11:38 pm
#45
How about this:
In the counter sniping tree, remove Startleshot 1 and 2, and replace them with Flurryshot 1 and 2 respectively. Leave Flushing Shot 1 and 2 as they are. Then in the abilities tree, add Rifle Melee Defense 1 and 2, like the Pistoleer profession; Rifle Melee Defense 1 would be a melee-range rifle butt attack that has a fair chance to knock downthe MOB, while Rifle Melee Defense 2 would be an improved version with a faster re-use time and an increased chance of knockdown. I'd say that most riflemen would not want to run up to a MOB to use the knockdown attack in an offensive fashion, so the attacks would mainly be reserved for use when a MOB charges a rifleman and he needs to defend himself against a melee attack. These attacks would go well with the Melee Defense modifiers in the abilities tree. As mentioned before, a new rifle-only Improved Aim command would also be very nice to have in the abilities tree, with the skill mods in the sniping tree changed to work with this new aim command. Perhaps have the new rifle aim in the first abilities box, with Rifle Melee Defense 1 in the second box and Rifle Melee Defense 2 in the fourth box. That fourth abilities box is typically the very last box that a Rifleman will ever learn, and it will be well after they have filled up all of the other skill boxes (unless they have another combat profession, or tons of banked combat experience), so Rifle Melee Defense 2 would tend to be effectively available only to Master Rifleman, without actually being in the Master Rifleman box.
As far as the concealment tree goes... either fix Cover to make it work, or remove it and add something that's actually useful. I *never* use Cover, for two reasons. First, I cannot Peace while under cover; when I want to stop shooting my target, I want to stop shooting my target *now*, and I can't understand why am I *forced* to continue attacking while in Cover. Secondly, the "/tellpet" commands apparently don't work while in Cover, and all of my Creature Handler pet command hotkeys use "/tellpet" so as not to spam spacial chat. It would appear that I'm not missing out on anything either, since every post I have read about Cover says that it either does nothing at all, or it's benefits are so marginal as to be inconsequential and not worth using.
ReggaeMaster
Fri Aug 20, 2004 9:22 am
#46
Startle1 should be a posture shot up that has a chance to bring someone out of Feign Death.
Startle2 should be a posture down attack
Afoi
Startle2 should be a posture down attack
Afoi
razorfin
Sat Aug 21, 2004 8:56 am
#47
And this is why people suck at pvp /end flame
PokOgoota wrote:
Hmm, I wasn't aware Stun affected state defenses. In that case, maybe a root or a slow - slow their movement for 5 sec on a 30 sec timer, or somesuch. The Advanced Aim suggestion is a really good one, too.
Waste93 wrote:
Stun already lowers the targets defenses including those to state effects. Which is why FlushingShot1/2 is better than StartleShot1/2.
Mangiacapra
Sat Aug 21, 2004 9:05 am
#48
I'd trade it for a leg/action pool shot, that has a small chance bonus to slow down the target for a few seconds.
Towelie-LXIX
Sat Aug 21, 2004 1:19 pm
#49
I think I'd be in favor of moving it to concealment 4, and having it work like conceal shot does. It should be a single target random pool attack. Maybe a 3, 3.5 or 4x multiplier (Startle 2 that is). The posture effects should be removed. We're not a control class, we're damage output. (More of a support class). Startle 1 could be placed in the concealment branch also, have a "greater" chance of concealment while under cover than conceal shot. Same with Startle 2.
I don't know just some ideas. This would make the shot useful in both PvE, and PvP. We really do lack a high damage single target random pool shot. State effects aren't that big of a deal, we have flushing shot for stun, and flurry for dizzy, as a rifleman thats all we need, the other professions can take care of the rest.
ITOAO
Mon Aug 23, 2004 4:00 pm
#50
I think the we should leave the states alone after reading the posts here and thinking about it. I really can't stop thinking about the possibilities of a shot that would slow your target for a set period of time. Something that would target the legs and make a target not able to use burst run OR knock them out of burst run for a period of time would be great. So many ideas, I wonder whats possible.
Brainplay
Wed Aug 25, 2004 5:51 am
#52
Waste93 wrote:
I'm liking the idea of having it slow the target. Question is does that unfairly infringe on Scout/Ranger traps that do the same?
Also what would the difference be between StartleShot1 and StartleShot2? Making an AoE slow attack could be a bit much. Either way it would also have to be on a timer.
Dont make it a snare make it a ROOT effect. Most animations now have a temporary rooting effect when use at a stop then attempting to move. If already moving this isn't the case.
example: Combat Medics are ROOTED for 4 seconds to toss any poisons or stims. Surprise shot could potentially ROOT the target if it hits for a few seconds but doing nothing more. No states, no posture down, just stopping them in their tracks for a few seconds.
This would give the needed boost that any ranged professions needs to combat melee professions. I mean if we run in any direction other than a perfectly straight line a melee WILL catch us.