Rifleman Archive

Well there's your problem ... use the T21 instead of the E11 and you'll get different results. I hate the E11 ... piece of crap gun.

The AR works awesome in PvE, because I am having lots of fun with my Laser Rifle on Kauri and it definitely works on a lot of mobs on Tattoine, at least. If it doesn't work in PvP we need to fix that, pure and simple. Why not call for that change instead of asking to kite the other classes? That's a lot easier to fix and won't get the other classes riled up.

I definitely agree with Jaegen that the Devs need to come up with a better fix to speed instead of changing the caps. They need to make the equation linear, not logarithmic, as Noules suggested.

Becuase we should be the masters of long range? AR is a totally differen problem. Since when has a pistol ever been able to shoot as accurate as a rifle at a rifles range.

Well the thing is that just about everyone wants armor to be fixed, however the dev's haven't said a thing about it. Not even accepting that it is broken that I've seen. So that makes me think that asking for that is stretching the possible.

Lets throw out the range cap idea (even though we can't hit an elephant while running so that isn't a problem) and just say that from 32 on you won't hit the broadside of a barn, from within 32 meters we won't be able to hit the broad side of the pentagon (like now) and carbines work well from...I dont know 50-20?

I really wish that correspondants couldnt get rated, I have like a 2.5 rating, mostly becuase of people who disagree with me. Oh and every rebel on starsider gives me a 1 star, ive had my posts disappear there before. No matter what I say rebels there give me a 1 star. Some guy will say this costs to much, I will say yeah I agree. Bam 1 star, Im like **edit** did I say.

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Phuobar wrote:

Hey Noules, your precision number is not correct.

The accuracy test is the same as the weighted coin problem (eg if a coin is not perfectly balanced, how many coin flips do you need to determine that and what's your accuracy)? It's a simple formula using the gaussion distribution to solve.

For 139 data points, the accuracy is +/- 13% point, so the true accuracies are

62% to 88% while standing/standing/autofire

77% to 103% standing/standing/BS3

49% to 75% moving/moving/style

What this means it the data point is utterly useless since the true autofire could be 88% and BS3 be 77%.

If you want 1% accuracy, you'll need 5,000 datapoint.

But that's beside the point. If accuracy is the issue, fix the accuracy modifer. Why introduce some unwieldly concept like a range cap?

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Hmm, it's been a while and statistics was probably my worst math subject, but I calculated the std deviation of the data set to be upper bounded at 1/2 * sqrt(N). Isn't that a 4% expected variance for 139 points?

Pistols how do you think we should be compinsated for being slowed down by a third?

BTW stop saying we can kite you.... we cant and if your scared about it im willing to lower our accuracy whle running even more... Plus you always forget we get a fixed number of shots...

That's the standard deviation for a continous outcome distribution and doesn't apply here.

Here, what we have is a 2 outcome problem (hit or miss). Then what we're trying to determine is what is the hit percentage (or miss percentage if you don't want to deal with active defense) based on N samples. So the deviation need to be calculated from the gauss distribution. The formula is ugly, so I won't post it.

Unfortunately, at 100, even 200, data points the spread is fairly large. At 1,000, the spread drop down to 3%, so it get better.

But that's beside the point. The question to answer is "is the special accuracy to-hit modifier" affected by the range modifier or not? The easiest test is to shot at max range, shoot at ideal range, and shoot halfway in between. Then repeat using special.

Let's say the special to-hit modifier is 12.5%. 500 data points will give us +/- 4% spread, 1/3 the difference we're investigating, so is enough to determine if the special to-hit modifier is affected by range or not.

The test have to be done by newbies since master will capped out due to high weapon skill.

Ald, the stats you provided for me seem pretty consistent with the equation, although I don't have the information about the move modifiers yet. It seems like pistol accuracy while standing might really be only adding half the expected value, i.e. +15 PAWS seems to be equivalent to about +7.5 pistol accuracy.

I recently ran the rifle accuracy test, and the accuracy mod for strafe 2 seems to be -10 (yes, a penalty) and the mod headshot 3 seems to be +5.

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Phuobar wrote:

That's the standard deviation for a continous outcome distribution and doesn't apply here.

Here, what we have is a 2 outcome problem (hit or miss). Then what we're trying to determine is what is the hit percentage (or miss percentage if you don't want to deal with active defense) based on N samples. So the deviation need to be calculated from the gauss distribution. The formula is ugly, so I won't post it.

Unfortunately, at 100, even 200, data points the spread is fairly large. At 1,000, the spread drop down to 3%, so it get better.

But that's beside the point. The question to answer is "is the special accuracy to-hit modifier" affected by the range modifier or not? The easiest test is to shot at max range, shoot at ideal range, and shoot halfway in between. Then repeat using special.

Let's say the special to-hit modifier is 12.5%. 500 data points will give us +/- 4% spread, 1/3 the difference we're investigating, so is enough to determine if the special to-hit modifier is affected by range or not.

The test have to be done by newbies since master will capped out due to high weapon skill.

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Hmm, I did a (very) little research on this, and it seems that the standard deviation in this situation should be sqrt(N/2).What is the reasoning to calculatethestd dev of 139 points to be 13%?

Also, I disagree that the question is if range modifier affects special move modifiers. At 60m, using weapons which should have similar range modifiers at the point, pistol exhibits roughly +50 accuracy mod using specials while rifle shows +5 to -10. Regardless of the special move accuracy being affected by range mods or not, it doesn't seem too far fetched to say that this isn't the way it should be.

Finally, you're not better off using newbies. You're better off using a master(or with cappedhigh speed) and someone optimized for defense. You can get +120 ranged defense if you use two players (one being a master SL) which is more accuracy bonus than any ranged class other than BH hybrids. This should provide a -greater- miss rate than using novices as well as more rounds per unit time.

lol those logs are a joke, i dont see any damage by you anywhere on it, so all you show is one side of the coin... show the real log, the one showing YOUR damage real time with his.

what a joke

You do realize that the log was intended to prove how often a pistoleer hits from that range don't you? He was letting the pistoleer attack him just to prove the point that from 60 meters they are able to hit a large amount of the time. Hell I"ll go back and give you a percent if your lazy about it.

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Yazule wrote:

lol those logs are a joke, i dont see any damage by you anywhere on it, so all you show is one side of the coin... show the real log, the one showing YOUR damage real time with his.

what a joke

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Aldeon specifically said the log was a measure of the pistoleer accuracy (not damage, not delay, nothing in fact other than the pistol accuracy under specific conditions). There's nothing inherently wrong with the tests, although there are some process issues I'm concerned about (the pistol specials test has a large degree of uncertainty because of the relatively fewer number of shots, and I'm curious how 60m range was maintained during the 'moving' section).

I would figure out the percentage but I need to leave this house, my head is exploding from these fumes.