Ranger Archive
Thread: CU: Unconstructive rants and bitter tirades here, please
DesktopSaki
Wed Apr 06, 2005 7:12 pm
#53
CuchulainnDarklight wrote:
I have to disagree,I find the new non-combat role of Ranger great fun.
If you are on Chimaera and are getting married, having a party, or any outdoor entertainment just send me a tell!
Cuchulainn Darklight, formerly master hunter now, Master Supplier Of Tents, Gazebos and Marquees!
Cuchulainn Darklight, will not track, nor apply camo, nor use traps in hunts, nor take orders for organics, as these may well involve or, lead to,combat and I am categorically NOT a combat profession, unlike doctors and BEs who are combat professions and can hunt for their own organics, whilst I craft camps as a non-combatant for the thriving galaxy-wide market in luxurious outdoors living equipment!
I sense great sarcasm in you, young Skywalker. 
(Edited for a horrid misspelling.)
Message Edited by DesktopSaki on 04-06-2005 10:27 PM
WittyNewt
Thu Apr 07, 2005 10:40 am
#54
DesktopSaki, great post, exactly my thoughts and you saidit so well. thank you.
I kept taking the punches due to my love of ranger just like you. I was even beginning to accept and prepare for the possible lower health of 2k we keep hearing about post CU. I started to think, well with my ranger/tka template, I will just have to fight more smartly, use more traps etc, afterall I can cope unbuffed on yavin fine at present, its just not as efficient if I want to be out pulling in a harvest, but is certainly a lot of fun in all other situations 
However, like you the final straw has been the rifleman/jedi stealth ability. This to me just defies all common sense. You have a class that spends 2 trees on stealth and you decide to give this ability to one that spends none? well apart from cover
To me, just this single act really makes me question the direction the post CU SWGis going and the reasoning abilityof those in dev land. The devs had a great opportunity to give us a key role in the GCW and placate us at the same time - stealth abiity at master ranger and they miss the trick?
Bizarre
CuchulainnDarklight that married/tents wizcrack really cheered me up. Thanks
Almagill
Fri Apr 08, 2005 2:17 pm
#55
CuchulainnDarklight wrote:I have to disagree, I find the new non-combat role of Ranger great fun.If you are on Chimaera and are getting married, having a party, or any outdoor entertainment just send me a tell!Cuchulainn Darklight, formerly master hunter now, Master Supplier Of Tents, Gazebos and Marquees!Cuchulainn Darklight, will not track, nor apply camo, nor use traps in hunts, nor take orders for organics, as these may well involve or, lead to, combat and I am categorically NOT a combat profession, unlike doctors and BEs who are combat professions and can hunt for their own organics, whilst I craft camps as a non-combatant for the thriving galaxy-wide market in luxurious outdoors living equipment!
The New 'Revamped' CuchulainnDarklight, so camp he makes Liberace look like a dead guy in a sequinned jacket.
Nice big tent, some deckchairs, couple of gualama, we could set up as a Player Event Park on the naboo Shores..
"'lama Rides! 'lama Rides! Bring yer kiddies forra ride on the cuddly 'lamas. 500cr there and back! Toffee Apples!! Candy Floss!! Roll Up Roll UP!!"
In the tent there'd be a cage with various species of Ranger pacing up and down, snarling at the punters, wishing they were out wild and free, roaming the grassland plains like the proud hunters they used to be...
/sigh
Might as well put an order in with my local tailor for a spangly jacket....
[not having a good day]
Dariane_Kamutsovy
Fri Apr 08, 2005 2:31 pm
#56
Almagill wrote:
Nice big tent, some deckchairs, couple of gualama, we could set up as a Player Event Park on the naboo Shores..
"'lama Rides! 'lama Rides! Bring yer kiddies forra ride on the cuddly 'lamas. 500cr there and back! Toffee Apples!! Candy Floss!! Roll Up Roll UP!!"
In the tent there'd be a cage with various species of Ranger pacing up and down, snarling at the punters, wishing they were out wild and free, roaming the grassland plains like the proud hunters they used to be...
Sounds cool. Then my CH part will be usefull to...
It seems I've been sinking sp for 2 valuable professions...
KaiRaene
Fri Apr 08, 2005 6:47 pm
#57
Hey now.. get back on topic...
I was just reading Mr Smedleys observations about SOE, EQ2 and the brief paragraph about SWG. Hmm.... a quote:
The "Combat Upgrade" is now live on the SWG test server, and it's getting very positive feedback from the SWG playerbase.
Yeah, right. The thread with the whole letter that Tiggs posted it in is getting shorter by the minute. They are deleting the po'd posts and I watch my posts go from page 5 to 4 quickly. I swear, with crap like that the decision to cancel is getting easier and easier. Was holding out for some hope but I just dont see it....
I was just reading Mr Smedleys observations about SOE, EQ2 and the brief paragraph about SWG. Hmm.... a quote:
The "Combat Upgrade" is now live on the SWG test server, and it's getting very positive feedback from the SWG playerbase.
Yeah, right. The thread with the whole letter that Tiggs posted it in is getting shorter by the minute. They are deleting the po'd posts and I watch my posts go from page 5 to 4 quickly. I swear, with crap like that the decision to cancel is getting easier and easier. Was holding out for some hope but I just dont see it....
Almagill
Fri Apr 08, 2005 7:14 pm
#58
KaiRaene wrote:
Hey now.. get back on topic...
I was just reading Mr Smedleys observations about SOE, EQ2 and the brief paragraph about SWG. Hmm.... a quote:
The "Combat Upgrade" is now live on the SWG test server, and it's getting very positive feedback from the SWG playerbase.
Yeah, right. The thread with the whole letter that Tiggs posted it in is getting shorter by the minute. They are deleting the po'd posts and I watch my posts go from page 5 to 4 quickly. I swear, with crap like that the decision to cancel is getting easier and easier. Was holding out for some hope but I just dont see it....
Hehe, you've got to learn to read corporate letters with your B$ filter in place.
"recieving positive feedback" So long as they can point to one post going "hey, this is the best thing since sliced bread" they can prove they've recieved +ve feedback.
Remember also there is a mindset that says that the players who are happy with the situation are ingame playing, the ones that are out here bitching don't necessarily represent the majority.
There's only around 500 people responding to the survey, a couple of hundred of whom are voting it down. We had exactly the same thing with the Jedi revamp and the JtL testing.
A vocal minority screaming "am quittin' and am takin' ma 27 accounts with me, and the 1000 players in my guild are going too, so nyerrr" and then a month or so down the line you will find some of those very same posters on the trade forum, selling off loot that's come from the expansion...
NalaniKonomohu
Fri Apr 08, 2005 10:46 pm
#59
Can i interject with a lil analogy to the dev staff....
So the other day, I decided to take a Safari. I thought to myself, "whom better to Guide me than a Master Ranger of these Parts. One who knows the lands, knows the creatures, and knows how to track them better than anyone else." But then realism got the better half of me and I decided to have my local Kung Fu instructor lead the saffari, i mean, he's easily the better choice to hunt creatures.
Dont worry rangers, us ArmorSmithies we'll cuddle up in your camps with you out at 0,0 on Rori where we are obviously supposed to be in this new system. /curtsey
So the other day, I decided to take a Safari. I thought to myself, "whom better to Guide me than a Master Ranger of these Parts. One who knows the lands, knows the creatures, and knows how to track them better than anyone else." But then realism got the better half of me and I decided to have my local Kung Fu instructor lead the saffari, i mean, he's easily the better choice to hunt creatures.
Dont worry rangers, us ArmorSmithies we'll cuddle up in your camps with you out at 0,0 on Rori where we are obviously supposed to be in this new system. /curtsey
Wyeth-SB
Fri Apr 08, 2005 11:49 pm
#60
Ha, good one!
NalaniKonomohu wrote:
Dont worry rangers, us ArmorSmithies we'll cuddle up in your camps with you out at 0,0 on Rori where we are obviously supposed to be in this new system. /curtsey
Balrozgul
Sat Apr 09, 2005 2:46 am
#61
Well first off let me say that by and large I like what is being done in the CU. The skills and abilities of all the combat professions seem to make sense. All except for ranger. My novice ranger box did not gain me another lvl, and I suspect that my next one will not as well. Our entire existence will now be FORCED to group to survive. I dont mind a little encouragement as far as grouping, but do not force that upon those of us who still want to solo. The reasons why we SHOULD be considered a combat class have been listed before but Ill list them again that I can think of.
We:
1. Debuff creatures
2. Apply States
3. Inhibit movement
4. Pull aggro
The fact that we are not particularly good at any of this is NOT a reason to be overlooked as a combat profession.
General problems with ranger in the CU:
1. Others get our skills, most notably rifleman getting true concealment when rangers devote their entire lives to stealth.
2. Variant creature levels make tracking almost useless.Sure I cantrack down that nest of fambaa to the northof us, but which fambaa will it be? A lvl 30 fambaa that I might be able to kill with one of the CU combats? Or maybe a 150lvl fambaa that would chew me up and spit me out unless I was in a group? Theres no way to tell for sure and groups tend to not bother waiting for a ranger to be so kind as to track for them.
3.Traps are still dependent on creature lvl. That meansmostly they are completely useless in a large group, as the creatures would be too high of a level to trap even for a master ranger.
4. Our health andlevelare not increased byranger skills. This not only drags down group levels making people less likely to group with us, but makes our harvesting increasingly useless, as we get higher harvests of lower level creatures (which is all we canhunt),while others can get lower harvests of much higher level creatures. I would notbe surprisedat all if a practicaltest showed that master bounty hunters once again became more efficient hunters of creatures even despite our great master ranger harvesting mod.
Bottom line for me is: I dont mind paying 140 skill points to master ranger, HOWEVER Id like to get something in return for those points. Ranger needs to become the class that falls in between crowd control and damage. Give us our own weapons and traps that are more effective at higher levels for controlling what happens to a creature. THIS IS NOT UNBALANCING. For one, we'd still be paying 140 skill points which is a LOT more than any other combat profession. For two, most people do not spend their general game time in pursuit of creatures, theyre more interested in NPC dungeons. We need to come together as a class. Stop with the detailed proposals until they agree to give us a general ROLE in their scheme. After weve been accepted as a probable hybrid we can make it perfectly clear HOW to go about doing that. Traps, weapons, concealment, creature criticals, whatever. This is the position I think we all need to take in order for our profession to even survive this CU.
Nastzguehl
Sat Apr 09, 2005 3:19 am
#62
I have been thinking a while now and have come to some kind of answer .
We agree that a lot of our loved Ranger is broken or in some way useless but we still stay Ranger and play it more as a role than as a profession.
So what if we drop Ranger after CU and go for an effective combat template with enough of Scout to do what we need to do to play or role as a Ranger but now as a real role as we aren't Rangers anymore but just roleplaying Ranger.
We could save the DEVs a lot of work because they could forget about our revamp.
Don't take me serious but the more I think about ..........hmmm I have to go and find out about all this combat professions I never thought about before.
Does anyone have a good post CU character builder at hand?
. We agree that a lot of our loved Ranger is broken or in some way useless but we still stay Ranger and play it more as a role than as a profession.
So what if we drop Ranger after CU and go for an effective combat template with enough of Scout to do what we need to do to play or role as a Ranger but now as a real role as we aren't Rangers anymore but just roleplaying Ranger.
We could save the DEVs a lot of work because they could forget about our revamp
.Don't take me serious but the more I think about ..........hmmm I have to go and find out about all this combat professions I never thought about before
.Does anyone have a good post CU character builder at hand
?
Almagill
Sat Apr 09, 2005 3:32 am
#63
I'm going to preface this post by pointing out that I am mightily po'd right now because of download problems but...
...there is, and has been for a number of years, a growing trend in businesses to find the shortest route to a Zero Problem solution. Now, this can be a fix, a patch, an ugrade, a refit. Or, if any of those look as if they are going to tie up resources, capital, staff, time you just remove the problem from the loop.
Net result. Zero Problem.
I'm looking at the skills and abilities that are popping up in other professions. Ones which we've been asking after since, well, actually Rangers have been asking for some of them since before I started playing. Yes, its also true that some of these skills were asked for by the professions that ended up getting them but the old test of 'does it tread on the toes of other professions' seems to have been thrown out of the window.
The fact that, regardless of health, our CL will result in the very creatures we are supposed to be hunting hitting US harder than anyone else just makes no sense.
In a group the ranger is going to be there to do what? Boost harvest rates by his magical presence and act as mule skinner in chief? Now we've got an expansion coming onboard that, if its designed for mid to high level characters, will be too tough for us to visit?
Yeah, we're outside the scope of the CURB. There is a stony silence the red names who, despite having been kept well up to date with the concerns of the Scout/Ranger line haven't even taken the time to say "look, don't worry, we're committed to the CURB right now but here's what we've got planned...in theory, in concept, well, on the back of a napkin from the staff cafeteria..."
I'm seriously starting to wonder if we're going to see the most radical of all skill point reductions for a profession, and find ourselves 'retired'? Sure it's crazy talk, its TC-Fever. But frell it. If we're going to be gimped to the point of having to have bodyguards to hunt on Tat (and no matter how you dress groups up, if we're the weakest one in the team, the rest are having to guard us).
...there is, and has been for a number of years, a growing trend in businesses to find the shortest route to a Zero Problem solution. Now, this can be a fix, a patch, an ugrade, a refit. Or, if any of those look as if they are going to tie up resources, capital, staff, time you just remove the problem from the loop.
Net result. Zero Problem.
I'm looking at the skills and abilities that are popping up in other professions. Ones which we've been asking after since, well, actually Rangers have been asking for some of them since before I started playing. Yes, its also true that some of these skills were asked for by the professions that ended up getting them but the old test of 'does it tread on the toes of other professions' seems to have been thrown out of the window.
The fact that, regardless of health, our CL will result in the very creatures we are supposed to be hunting hitting US harder than anyone else just makes no sense.
In a group the ranger is going to be there to do what? Boost harvest rates by his magical presence and act as mule skinner in chief? Now we've got an expansion coming onboard that, if its designed for mid to high level characters, will be too tough for us to visit?
Yeah, we're outside the scope of the CURB. There is a stony silence the red names who, despite having been kept well up to date with the concerns of the Scout/Ranger line haven't even taken the time to say "look, don't worry, we're committed to the CURB right now but here's what we've got planned...in theory, in concept, well, on the back of a napkin from the staff cafeteria..."
I'm seriously starting to wonder if we're going to see the most radical of all skill point reductions for a profession, and find ourselves 'retired'? Sure it's crazy talk, its TC-Fever. But frell it. If we're going to be gimped to the point of having to have bodyguards to hunt on Tat (and no matter how you dress groups up, if we're the weakest one in the team, the rest are having to guard us).
Almagill
Tue Apr 12, 2005 11:06 am
#64
You only get healing XP for healing IN COMBAT now??
What the heck is the point of having camps that allow healing in the field if, post CU, no medic worth their salt is goiing to let a player out of combat who still has wounds??
Has anyone been able to check if healing in camp still affects the time to max Wilderness XP?
/throw toys out of pram
What the heck is the point of having camps that allow healing in the field if, post CU, no medic worth their salt is goiing to let a player out of combat who still has wounds??
Has anyone been able to check if healing in camp still affects the time to max Wilderness XP?
/throw toys out of pram
Vorpaks
Tue Apr 12, 2005 11:29 am
#65
Almagill wrote:
/throw toys out of pram
Can I quote you on that?