Ranger Archive
Thread: Talk of merging Ranger & SL
DaveG wrote:
Wow, you're all still here?
I thought you walked away from this thread?
Twice! 
j/k
Kinshi wrote:
5. It fits in a RP sense (really makes the profession more true to the 'Antarian Rangers'
As leader of the Antarian Rangers on Eclipse the only way this would make us more like the Antarian Rangers of the EU would be to add some skills which would let us help Jedi, such as not giving a Jedi visibility when grouped with a Ranger.
The Antarian Rangers in the EU were a group of non-Jedi that helped and supported the Jedi.
Aside from this small detail the concept sounds interesting to me.
SOE seems to be getting flat lazy on revamps/bug fixes and would rather bring out expansions for more money.
/grumble
Almagill wrote:
Kinshi wrote:
"The idea has been presented, , thus you may do what you will with it."
We did. Thanks.
Message Edited by Kinshi on 06-09-2005 07:38 PM
please add me to the 'no' group as well.
Iseult
Master Ranger / Mediocre Carbiner
Bloodfin
* ps. not meant to be a 'troll' of the awe-inspiring, florescent green post to the north.
* p.p.s - by "to the north" I mean a little to the north. Sick beat me to the submit button.
Message Edited by Iseult on 06-09-2005 10:51 PM
Message Edited by Iseult on 06-09-2005 10:55 PM
Owen-Lars wrote:
Ive yet to see an official response backing these claims up or saying it wont happen so as far as im concerned it could or couldnt happen. Until i see an official post for or against these claims ill just take the discussion and claims with a pinch of salt.
Can't find an 'official response' but, from this very thread:
WornTraveler wrote:well I just asked Tiggs if this was oficcially being considered to happen, and the answer was a simple no. It is the first time I have ever talked to her and was delighted to reviece an answer
Which will do for me until such time as we see a red name stating otherwise.
Kinshi: You really need to relax a bit. You're so determined to argue your case that you were actually picking arguments with Phenix where he was offering possible points he was agreeing with you on. A number of the people who you are slating as being 'against' your idea have done no more than express their opinion that they dislike the idea and, while I have been picking at your case a bit, if you look back to my original response actually thought the idea had some merit, was not disimilar to a solution I was going after ingame with one of my toons atm and, by and large, all am trying to get you to do is acknowledge that this is, currently, no more than vapourware rather than constantly asserting that it's what IS going to happen when you don't know that to be the case.
That post:
Almagill wrote:
Before I toss my ranger hat into the ring on this one, who's been sneaking a look at my projected template for "The Final Respec of All Respecs"
Been sat trying to justify butchering my ranger template AGAIN to incorporate a little SL def/off mods and still keep my BH lines and maybe change to pistols.... (got a great FHW, 400+ damage in my barely skilled hands... oh what could I do with PROPER speed and accuracy mods... muahaha)
oh the decisions...
Okies, yup, can see the attraction for Rangers in this idea, we get off/def mods and a viability in combat that's a bit lacking atm. For SL's, yeah, tracking and group concealment is well handy. Hmm, smells to much like a win-win situation.
So, IF it was to go beyond the vapourware stage, we need an indication from the dev side of what they are proposing WAY in advance of them starting to implement it, then a list of what's getting fixed rather than just a royal sweep under the carpet of all the broken stuff.
RL examples: LURPS, SAS patrols, Chindits, Border Reivers, Atilla the Hun (oh come on, you know he HAD to be a ranger at heart, lol)...
hmm. ok, I know roughly what way my hat is inclined to go, but am going to ponder a little first.
frightwig wrote:
DaveG wrote:
Wow, you're all still here?
I thought you walked away from this thread?
No you're right, although I could still hear the cafuffle from over there
Tell you what.......everything I've said aside, the biggest problem I have with the idea is this:
The devs are not going to go: "Well, here is the plan. Here is what we're thinking of doing. Do you like it? Would you like to play that?"
The are going to go: "Well, here is the plan. Here is what we're thinking of doing. It's on the live servers, have fun."
I'm not saying anything against the devs (or anyone). It isn't good business for them to spend a lot of time and money generating an idea, working on it, getting feedback, testing it,then not useing it. So anything that gets attention is going to happen. So we won't know what to expect, till it happens. That scares me just a little bit.
It's possible that they'd do this, and it'd be great. It's possible I wouldn't like it. Broken as we are now, I'm still a Ranger. I wouldn't like to have something else that is different, still broken, not fun, AND not be a Ranger.
But that's just me.
earthshredder wrote:
earthshredder wrote:
OK. I have pretty much read through this whole post, and at 6 pages I was quite impressed. But what really impresses me is Kinshi's insight and intelligent arguments for this idea.
Since he has come to our Guild, he has shown his vast knowledge of the game and insight into seeing that something needs to be done about our lack of attention in this game. Not only Rangers, but also Squad Leaders. But so far all I have seen from this community is bashing and knashing.
Please point out ANY bashing and knashing done? As you said, this is an idea and Kinshi has presented his ideas. Other rangers tosses ideas and arguments around and came up with others, and also intelligent arguments. As far as I know, we all just are behaving civilized and in a well mannered way with this idea. Frankly, you saying this community is bashing and knashing is a slap in the face and an insult.
No answer here now?
I for one agree with Kinshi. It is a thing of beauty to witness the effects that a Squad Leader has on a group of Master Rangers. When we hunt, we HUNT! We annihalate, and I mean ANNIHALATE! To see up to 7 Master Rangers, cause thats all we can get in the group plus the SL hunt in the manner and fashion that a unit can is astoundhing.
It might be. It might also be good to have 2 rifelman, 1 doc, 1 cm, 2 rangers,a tkm and a smuggler in a group or whatever. Point I want to make is: if the group is having fun, is working together, wether you are with 3 or 8 in a group makes no difference. SL and Ranger have DIFFERENT ideas. They only share a few base lines in scout, but in the field out there (and also in RP) the whole "lifestyle" is completely different.
(come hang out with our Guild. But wait...you don't even know us and you judge us. typical. Actually we have out of our members 4 Rifleman 4 BH 1 CM 2 TKM 1 Swordsman 3 or 4 Carbineers , but you wouldn't know that))
Where did I judge you? I only say, there are way more options for a Ranger to be grouped to have fun and the same goes for an SL. Why and how you perceive this as a judgement on your guild I do NOT understand. The fact that you accuse me of doing so is shortsighted.
But I want to see where we have been given any attention in the last two years of playing this game. Lets see........
1. Camps were nerfed because people didn't want to have to stop, have a Scout or Ranger with them to get vehicles mounts etc.. (thanks for going to bat for us on that one)
Thus the idea was mentioned to make camps more usefull. I'm too lazy to make a link. Hint: MODULAR camps. Which will be able to benefit a lot of professions, and as far as I know, was preceived that way by all communities involved.
(Yeah, I've read that thread along with all of the original postings from N'Raas (who was the best corr weve ever had) So I've seen it and still nothing on it....or can you give me some info I don't know)
No. I have not other info. Point is made, there are many good ideas worked out already.
2. BH didn't feel the need to have scout as prereq for their profession ( can anyone say mass numbers produce)
Well, the good BH's exempt, we all know where that is coming from. ...
(It doesn't matter who's exempt, the point is it got done...get it?)
And NO. Look how the BH community is treated by anyone else (same as jedi). As Rangers, we have a lot of respect from many other professions. I for one, rather receive that then to be called (rightfully so) a bunch of whiners.
3. Oh yeah, that next expansion for Ranger should be coming out because were so vocal and ournumbers influence the game (uh..not)
Point is, we aren't. Unlike some others. Don't get me wrong... People already know I have not a single grain of respect left for SOE, but in the end, all the yelling, shouting for attention will be the downfall.
(Yeah and Jedi and Wookies should be exempt)
I'm beginning to question your intellect...
4.Artisnas, ARTISANS! complained so much that they get to use camo kits without us, oh wait that's everyone can now. (another thanks for going to bat for us on that one)
Yeah, well, I already said in the beginnin of the CURB document all arti's would get a hard time. It's hard, yes. But there are ways AROUND it. Giving out our skills is just plain blunt and has made the lot of us VERY angry. Besides, I think, it's not so effective after all.
(Oh,so if someone bashes your head with a bat, wouldn't it make ya mad? Or is it not so effective after all?)
There were a lot of other options mentioned for artisans. But, as we ALL know, SOE decided NOT to listen and go for the easy way out. The easy way out for SOE would be to move the Ranger skills into scout (maybe except for tracking, give that to SL) and REMOVE RANGER ALL TOGETHER from the game.
That for one, I will FIGHT until my demise.... If you don't get that picture inside you, merging of 2 borked professions will NOT provide a solution, to neither side.
5.Lets not mention traps.(still waiting, get those devs for us. cause we know you can)
See 1.
And let me guess, your gonna say 'But we tried to talk to them, but they didn't wanna listen", Ya know what...BS!
Why is that BS? It's a known fact they ignore the Ranger community. Why else are Ranger ideas taken and given to OTHER professions? It's a fact.
(Exactly. This has gotten us no where. But our skills being dolled out to people who didn't need them)
You have no idea about the reasoning of the Devs/SOE: why not give it all away, let the numbers drop even more so we can remove this profession from the game.
Our paitence, being nice, not making a squeak (oh well, they will get to us in the next 5 years or so..ho-hum) has produced nothing...nada...zip! But someone comes with a viable suggestion, and it's shot down with old promises and visions of dilusion. No one in this thread has had any viable argument for this except "well they said that were gonna be next right after smuggler, yeah and lets see, the next jedi revamp , BH revamp, Doctor revamp,(because those guys will make the noise). And what will come out of this camp..........(hear that..NOTHING!).
And here you get me pissed of. I will stay nice tho. Get some glasses and read the posts again. One of my MAIN issues is: why would they merge SL and Ranger, if they can't fix EITHER of them within a reasonable time frame, HOW can you expect them (SOE) to merge them and have a WORKING SL/Ranger Profession?
Hint: look at the CURB... What they did/how they did it....
(Uh..read that too. Notice how before we made a stink that we weren't gonna be considered combat profession, that's the only time I have seen that happen)
It also happened with the bonus on harvesting in groups.... Master ranger got +50 on harvesting... As Rangers, the most of us become very noisy when it really going downwards (reason: see above).
Know what guys, come up with something anything. Do your job. Make me (the guy who also plays the game) happy. Find a better idea then. Ask the jedi corr what he does to get results because whomever your talking to now ain't cuttin' it. And go ahead, bash, insult, make fun of, trash, and whatever. But ya know something, I am just as mad as you are..maybe even more because nothing has been done for our profession. And I for one am tired of it. I want results, and were not gettin' em.
So give Kinshi a break. And just kinda say "Hey not a bad idea", because I haven't seen anything that even comes close to this.
You know what? You should give it a rest and move on... As in l33t speak: "move on, this is not the thread you're looking for" or something like that. You read things that are not there and in the process you alienate the Ranger community.
(Know what, NO! Thats the problem...get it? Give it a rest, we have for too long. And what's to show for it? Answer that one. This is the typical response for the whole thing. Give it a rest it'll be OK., calm down everything will be fine. They'll get to us eventually . And as we sit back and let them take away camps, camo, tracking (if BH got there way, which I hope to see a big no to). And were already alienated, or haven't you been looking?)
You should give the community a rest instead of bashing on them. The idea is being discussed and all you can do is spam/troll/rant in favor of kinshi. This will be my final post on this matter to you. Unless you start posting constructive facts to be known which then can be discussed, I will not spend my time on this ranting. You made your point. You're completely with Kinshi on his idea, I made my point. I'm 100% the opposite. Leave it at that.