Pistoleer Archive
Thread: Pistoleers vs. the Deathwatch
MetallicaJunkie wrote:
I'm tired of EVERY noob pistoleer spitting their **edit** about dual wield and how it will make us uber again, NO.
Firstly the devs can't program things right, only way duel wield will be done is to re-adapt multi-target to draw a second pistol. In that case, we gain nothing really, just an animation that makes us look pimp.
Secondly the ability to pull out another gun and increase our damage output slightly doesn't help us compete, in order to balance our duel wield abilities we would have to suffer a decrease in speed or accuracy or worse yet the loss of special moves in dual wield mode like with multi-target. This will effectively make pistoleer a definite poser profession for guys who want to hold a nice looking gun in each hand, but as mentioned above, all dual wield could possibly do for pistoleer is up our pimp status not our combat status.
End of discussion concerning dual wield, twirly moves and holsters and more discussion with regards to pistols, pistoleers and the future of our profession, aka what we actually NEED.
Murton
Genocide
Eclipse Server
Two hands on my gun blasting away.
I know a certain little boy who needs a nap! 
Anyways, about Duel Wield! Since nobody knows exactly how it will be implemented but the developers, we have no place to say it will suck, or be good. Best we can do is hope, but I think it will turn out great. If it does double our damage output with the second pistol, yeah its going to rock. I just hope they decrease the HAM costs on pistols a little first. Supposedly the CB is changing pretty much the whole system, so I'd definatly say duel wield has good potential here. The flaws we can think of it having now, may not work the same way were thinking, after the balance. Though, if you dont like the idea of duel wield then... dont use 2 guns. Just use 1, or change professions. Also, we ARE getting new weapons. The DE-10 just came out today, and the geo pistol before that. Sure, I'd like them to be released more quickly too but, from what we've seen so far it takes time, and other professions need new stuff too.
Falcor Krevan - Starsider
Fordep wrote:
A standard DX2 is better than a standard Scatter... but a Krayt Scatter is way out of the DX2s league.
Arkelion wrote:
MetallicaJunkie wrote:
I'm tired of EVERY noob pistoleer spitting their **edit** about dual wield and how it will make us uber again, NO.
Firstly the devs can't program things right, only way duel wield will be done is to re-adapt multi-target to draw a second pistol. In that case, we gain nothing really, just an animation that makes us look pimp.
Secondly the ability to pull out another gun and increase our damage output slightly doesn't help us compete, in order to balance our duel wield abilities we would have to suffer a decrease in speed or accuracy or worse yet the loss of special moves in dual wield mode like with multi-target. This will effectively make pistoleer a definite poser profession for guys who want to hold a nice looking gun in each hand, but as mentioned above, all dual wield could possibly do for pistoleer is up our pimp status not our combat status.
End of discussion concerning dual wield, twirly moves and holsters and more discussion with regards to pistols, pistoleers and the future of our profession, aka what we actually NEED.
Murton
Genocide
Eclipse Server
Two hands on my gun blasting away.
I know a certain little boy who needs a nap!
Anyways, about Duel Wield! Since nobody knows exactly how it will be implemented but the developers, we have no place to say it will suck, or be good. Best we can do is hope, but I think it will turn out great. If it does double our damage output with the second pistol, yeah its going to rock. I just hope they decrease the HAM costs on pistols a little first. Supposedly the CB is changing pretty much the whole system, so I'd definatly say duel wield has good potential here. The flaws we can think of it having now, may not work the same way were thinking, after the balance. Though, if you dont like the idea of duel wield then... dont use 2 guns. Just use 1, or change professions. Also, we ARE getting new weapons. The DE-10 just came out today, and the geo pistol before that. Sure, I'd like them to be released more quickly too but, from what we've seen so far it takes time, and other professions need new stuff too.
Falcor Krevan - Starsider
Good point. Too bad you had to go against your own advice.
However, you are correct about the CB. However dual wield will notbe the answer. I'm looking more for the solution to come from weapons speeds. There is no reason why a master rifleman with anAP3 weapon like the T21 should be hitting the same speed caps that a master pistoleer hits with a scout blaster. If anything, I think this will have the biggest impact on the Combat Ballance.
MetallicaJunkie wrote:
I'm tired of EVERY noob pistoleer spitting their **edit** about dual wield and how it will make us uber again, NO.
Firstly the devs can't program things right, only way duel wield will be done is to re-adapt multi-target to draw a second pistol. In that case, we gain nothing really, just an animation that makes us look pimp.
Secondly the ability to pull out another gun and increase our damage output slightly doesn't help us compete, in order to balance our duel wield abilities we would have to suffer a decrease in speed or accuracy or worse yet the loss of special moves in dual wield mode like with multi-target. This will effectively make pistoleer a definite poser profession for guys who want to hold a nice looking gun in each hand, but as mentioned above, all dual wield could possibly do for pistoleer is up our pimp status not our combat status.
End of discussion concerning dual wield, twirly moves and holsters and more discussion with regards to pistols, pistoleers and the future of our profession, aka what we actually NEED.
Murton
Genocide
Eclipse Server
Two hands on my gun blasting away.
just to clarify...... i'm not a "noob" pistoleer, i've been using pistols since launch and have been a pistoleer since august
i said i think dual wield will make us "comparable" with others........ with the way speed works after the combat balance, speed will be out of the question, the only thing we have to worry about is armor piercing
basically, compared to carbineers and pikemen, we do half the damage, just a little faster....... i see dual wield as a way for us (given that you're using two of the exact same pistol) a way to deal twice normal damage..... meaning we could actually stand up against medium armored opponents
since heavily armored mobs would be considered high-end/group content, it is up to the rifleman/swordsman/commandos to deal most of the damage
giving us medium AP isn't the answer..... carbineers have a medium AP weapon and hardly ever use it
we are useful in a ton of other ways- damage types
we can easily target the weakest areas of certain mobs with our AP1 or AP0 pistols with mobs that have vulnerabilites
i'm sorry if you don't agree with me, but if you REALLY want an AP2 weapon, pick up carbineer or pikeman
Message Edited by Kevie on 05-26-2004 04:34 PM
If doing half damage turns into doing normal damage with two guns, how has this helped? We still have to lay out the cred for a second weapon. We still need two weapons to do merely normal damage, when the other classes are hitting harder JUST as fast if not faster than us. We look fly, but we're still gimped.
My own template is Pistoleer/Dancer. So it's quite likely that I'll get no spot in any party headed out that way. What kind of cruel joke is it to put a Master Pistoleer schematic in the game and then put it in the hands of enemies we can barely scratch? It's like they're dangling it at us isn't it? "Here is a lovely new pistol. Which you can't have."
WinterRoseASFR wrote:
If doing half damage turns into doing normal damage with two guns, how has this helped? We still have to lay out the cred for a second weapon. We still need two weapons to do merely normal damage, when the other classes are hitting harder JUST as fast if not faster than us. We look fly, but we're still gimped.
during the combat balance, speed will be reworked...... so we again be the fastest along with fencers
with AR1 mobs, we will do100% as much damage, instead of 0%
rexan wrote:
Arkelion wrote:
MetallicaJunkie wrote:
I'm tired of EVERY noob pistoleer spitting their **edit** about dual wield and how it will make us uber again, NO.
Firstly the devs can't program things right, only way duel wield will be done is to re-adapt multi-target to draw a second pistol. In that case, we gain nothing really, just an animation that makes us look pimp.
Secondly the ability to pull out another gun and increase our damage output slightly doesn't help us compete, in order to balance our duel wield abilities we would have to suffer a decrease in speed or accuracy or worse yet the loss of special moves in dual wield mode like with multi-target. This will effectively make pistoleer a definite poser profession for guys who want to hold a nice looking gun in each hand, but as mentioned above, all dual wield could possibly do for pistoleer is up our pimp status not our combat status.
End of discussion concerning dual wield, twirly moves and holsters and more discussion with regards to pistols, pistoleers and the future of our profession, aka what we actually NEED.
Murton
Genocide
Eclipse Server
Two hands on my gun blasting away.
I know a certain little boy who needs a nap!
Anyways, about Duel Wield! Since nobody knows exactly how it will be implemented but the developers, we have no place to say it will suck, or be good. Best we can do is hope, but I think it will turn out great. If it does double our damage output with the second pistol, yeah its going to rock. I just hope they decrease the HAM costs on pistols a little first. Supposedly the CB is changing pretty much the whole system, so I'd definatly say duel wield has good potential here. The flaws we can think of it having now, may not work the same way were thinking, after the balance. Though, if you dont like the idea of duel wield then... dont use 2 guns. Just use 1, or change professions. Also, we ARE getting new weapons. The DE-10 just came out today, and the geo pistol before that. Sure, I'd like them to be released more quickly too but, from what we've seen so far it takes time, and other professions need new stuff too.
Falcor Krevan - Starsider
Good point. Too bad you had to go against your own advice.
However, you are correct about the CB. However dual wield will notbe the answer. I'm looking more for the solution to come from weapons speeds. There is no reason why a master rifleman with anAP3 weapon like the T21 should be hitting the same speed caps that a master pistoleer hits with a scout blaster. If anything, I think this will have the biggest impact on the Combat Ballance.
I didnt go against my own advice. What that says, is we dont know how the CB will turn out, and we have no way of knowing until it comes out. But, from what I've heard about it, I think it will be good. That guess might be wrong, considering only the devs know what will be done with it.
Next time you try to nitpick someones statement into proving them wrong, try not to do it yourself. You say I'm correct about nobody knowing how the CB will turn out, yet your saying duel wield WILL NOT be the answer. You dont know that. 
Falcor Krevan
Tyronet City InformationMessage Edited by djswift2k on 05-27-2004 01:22 AM