Pilot Archive
Thread: Why doesn't space-PvP have damage mitigation?
lostswede wrote:
Hmm this is my thoguht about this, why not divide the ships in classes with diffrent damage reduction.
Light (scyk, a-wing, Jedi starfighter, Z95 and so on) get 0 Zero reduction
Medium (X-wing, Dunelizzard and so on) gets the 25% we got now
Heavy (B-wing, Kryat, Opressor and so on) get 50% reduction
Super heavy (Deciminator, YT1300, Nova and so on) gets the 75% some oen suggested
I think that would make the bigger ships more worth to use in PvP, but this is just my thoughts and i may be flawed in this.
Fein out
I like that idea. Why not use that same mitigation scale for PvE vs capital ships as to make bombers usefull.
Ducimus wrote:
Treena_Daal wrote:
Starson wrote:
Oh well I guess I will stay pve, where there is a challenge.
You're kidding, right? There are very, very few things in PvE that can legitimately be called a "challenge".
And THAT is coming from the 'PvE Correspondant'!
Gods know I enjoy a challenge. I'm geting a pretty good one out of this gunboat, too. But the fact that I am at 4444 with my second squadron since I really learned to fly, and am only now being challenged says something to me.
Treena_Daal wrote:
Gods know I enjoy a challenge. I'm geting a pretty good one out of this gunboat, too. But the fact that I am at 4444 with my second squadron since I really learned to fly, and am only now being challenged says something to me.
Once you get good at flying and understand the game, the whole thing becomes trivial. I suspect you'll be doing all 9 like i did. Soloed all of them but two missions on the first mastery too.
If JTL had more of an endgame, i probably would never have gotten into space PvP. Given the current state of JTL, im less and less inclined to participate in the current JTL "end game" each day. Threads such as this one is one reason why. Damage reduction? Please.. ive walked the walk long enough to know better, just like many other people have. Another reason is other misc bugs, balance issues and exploitations. Most of the hardcore pilots i knew are gone, or are severely jaded and are about to be gone for the same reasons.
In the back of my mind i always thought about retiring and opening up a SW shop. Name it.. A SW with a freaking clue. Only reason im hesitant is cause SW is like a job unto itself. So its either that or farm slicing comps or help out with missions.
Some end game huh?
You want a challenge, try this.
1. See how fast you can solo the whole vette formation. Do it for time. Try and beat your prevous record.
After that.
Try it again in an unshielded tie.. now THAT ought to be a challenge. Havent done it yet myself. Ive gone to DS without shields, i should try the kessel vette next.
Gunni wrote:
It might have been asked before, but I'm just wondering...
Our server is trying to organize a large Space PvP event, however a lot argue that it won't be as fun as it could be simply because of the 1-2-3 hit kill's that exist when another player fights another player in Space. I came up with the idea that coordinating with a CSR or developer to set 75% dmg mitigation to try and make the fights last longer as a temporary solution...
A lot of this thread got sidetracked into situational awarness and related discussions, though some good ideas were proposed throughout. But in coming back to the original focus of creating a PvP event in space and having it last a little longer than 1-2-3 kills. I participated in a smallish/medium PvP event several months back. The only requirement was Tier 1 weapons only, no missiles, no specials. Everything else (including droid programs) were a go. To remove the factor of outside interference, it wasn't done overt in any fashion, or in DS. Rather through careful coordination, all members of one side dueled the members of the other side at a predefined meeting point. Then both sides went to thier respective corners and the fun began. Deaths were still on the fast side, but much longer than with high tier weapons. It did add a lot of fun to the whole experience.
If all you are looking for is an organized PvP event and don't mind a little bit of extra overhead on the setup, then this might be a solution you could consider.
Just my two electrons worth.
edit due to a couple of terrible typo's that sliped through 
Message Edited by SunsetSam on 07-11-2005 02:16 PM
Yup...also yeh for this Saturdays pvp event peeps who're on Bria...check the Bria forum.
I was trying to be relative to context and stuck it over there.
-Leaph
umm you are not a Dark Lord of the 'Sith, the Emperor is the only one who can hold that title, please remove it thank you..
Gunni wrote:
wasj2004 wrote:
Lowering the dammage % might work for a temporary solution to make a PVP event last a little longer. But for a permament fix they need to get a little more detailed. Small fighters should go down in 2 to 3 hits. As small as they are, all you have to do is spin and fly iradicly when being fired at and they become very hard to hit. Now the heavy fighters like the rikhserk, krayt, Bwings and Ywings are a different story. Even with the best engine they are no match for a small fighter when it comes to manuvoring. And currently, even with the best armor and sheilds, they go down just as fast as a small fighter. They are supposed to be heavily armored attack attack ships that can take a beating. 2 to 3 hits isnt much of a beating! Higher hitpoint sheilds and armor maybee? Not sure what the best solution is, but somthing should be done.
That sounds more like a long-term fix and I do agree with it. I wouldn't mind having my JSF be fragile like the A-Wing while my TIE Oppressor can take many hits to the shield and still stay up but as it is now, you're rocked no matter what ship your in, (generally whoever's the fastest and has best roll/yaw/pitch rates will win)
xTekx wrote:
work? they dont' know what that means? they think they get whatever they want when they want it if they cry enough? oh wait, that's the jedi forum.. sorryMessage Edited by xTekx on 07-09-2005 05:50 PM
Keep your anti-jedi sentiment where it belongs, in your withered little hateful heart. Them being a jedi and you being a bounty hunter has nothing to do with the issue. You must feel big and cool bashing on him being a jedi because you're a big bad BH but it has NO place at all in a discussion about space PVP. So go crawl back under a rock in the BH forums if you want to moan about jedi some more, it has no place here. And just in case your deluded little mind needs a refresher, even those who 'exploited' the respec system for jedi (and jedi were not the ONLY ones who exploited it, many a crafter/ranger turned MBH arose from the respec system) had to "work" as hard or harder than any ohter profession to do it. And I won't even presume to know how hard you 'worked' at getting your professions, since that would make me more like you.
What I've been doing is pulling WAY ahead of the gunboat, turning around, and stopping. I let the fighter escort come to me, and I blast as many of them as I can. Once they've past me, I fly to my left, and get far away from the gunboat again. It almost never takes a shot at me until the fighters are all disabled/dead. But while jousting the gunboat, my weak armor is showing through. I'm probably going to dump my capacitor down to an REd level 2. I won't have as much energy to dump into my shields, but it should give me some room to put some major armor up front. At least it will absorb a few hits, rather than disapearing completely the first time my shields go down. Between that and the missiles, I should be OK. Remembering that I have Bomber Strike may also help.
JTL should of been made way different, more along the lines of say, FreeSpace 2. I think alot of what hurt JTL is being intergrated into the ground game for things like Shipwrights.
And Ducimus, on page one you talk about the never ending fights, well I was having those before rage even came out. I used to run a TIE Interceptor with my old preNerf level 6 engine (95.9 speed) and would get into long drawn out fights agaist other fast moving a-wing pilots. I've come up with a few tactics that seem to work well in the turn fight situations.
The Damage reduction calls you see are from space newbies who fly dead on to each other and get poped like idiots.
Small ships (Eta-2, Bellabub, A-Wing) should be detroyed by big ships (Oppresor, Krayt, B-Wing) in one hit.
Bigships should be destroyed by smaller ships in around 5-7 hits (but bigger ships would destroy them in 2-3).
This means you don't have to worry about people surviving forever, because one nice shot from the proper ship and they're dead. Your battles are lasting 20 minutes because everyone is in a fast little fighter. Make a variation, make different roles in PvP. Small ships will always have long fights when they're fighting each other, just as big ships will probably have long fights if fighting each other as well, but a small ship would die fast to a big ship and vice versa, the pilots skill will depend which wins (is the small fighter good enough to evade fire and maneuver behind the larger fighter, or is the larger fighter got fast fingers and is able to pop off a deadly volley right down the small fighters throat?)
My biggest gripe is that with the current system of dying so fast (and I'm talking about big ships here: small ships should die fast) it means larger ships are not only not plausible in PvP, but it means there's no room to pull certain maneuvers, because if you stop looping you open up yourself to take a shot, even if its only for a second, and that means you're dead.
Hmm maybe it is a damage output and damage resistance based on size of the ship we are using in both PvP and PvE we are really talking about. I know for sure that my JF can withstand the same damage as my Oppressor right now anddo same damage because both of themuse same lvl8 reward sheild and 2 lvl8 reward guns both well REed, the heavier amrour plates the oppressor does only seem to do any use in PvE and not PvP.
So my idea of classes of ship may not been so bad but it may also be used in PvE to give large bombers good use there (right now i use my JF in PvE also because it is quicker nad more manouerble then my Oppressor even in PvE.)
This is how it may look.
Light starship (TIE interceptor, A-wing, Eta-2 and so on)= 80% sheild and weapon damage output
Medium (Ixiyen, Dunelizard, X-wing and so on)= 100% sheild and weapon damage output
Heavy (Kryat, Rihkxyrk, Bwing, Y-wing and so on)=125% sheild and weapon damage output
Super heavy (Deciminator, Nova, YT1300 and so on)= 150% sheild and weapon damage output
I cant see any ship that should be heavy for Imps as it is now, there designs look light or medium so i think they need a new ship for the heavy part if this is done and i think making Skipray blast boat as a Kryat copy would fill the heavy fighter need would work. Feel free to flame me or make constructive thoughts about this, this is just my thoughts.
Fein out
Message Edited by lostswede on 07-12-2005 06:38 AM