Pilot Archive

Thread: Actis, Belbullab, RGI, EPulse3, and everything unbalanced

hi_i_am_new_here
Tue Nov 01, 2005 1:57 am
#40







invincible components on the Corellian Corvette,



Blown up over 100 to date




_________________________________________________________
There are two things certain in life: Death and Taxes. -Benjamin Franklin
**Co-Manager of -RunningCrest Shipwrights-
Jadefalcon TheAvenger
Y-8 Guide for Dummies

xTekx
Tue Nov 01, 2005 8:32 am
#41

Hey Maudee. I've got this wonderful little level 4 engine you can use. Currently Dimmu has it and is leveling his character. But soon as he's done with it you can use it. It works well in PvP to. muahaha



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xTekx-Omega 9

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PaceNebulon
Tue Nov 01, 2005 9:25 am
#42






Maudee wrote:





Halyn wrote:





Maudee wrote:

You're my hero Halyn


See you on SS soon.


-Maudee







Hope you're coming as an Imperial--Leaph likes being outnumbered.






Of course I'll be flying Imperial! I can't leave my T/I. Besides, I've just got to have a run at Leaph in my intercepter!


Speaking of... I just can't bring myself to char transfer and leave all the wonderful Bloodfin peeps behind. So I'll be starting fresh.... without an RE engine

So... for any SS pilots.... I'd be interested in running the starmap about 20 times with some CL1's.Perhaps someone would like to twink me through the NS cave and recieve a cut of the loot!

Let me know if anyone's interested.


-Maudee





woo hoo another interceptor pilot! Also, I would definitly be interested in the starmap thing.



Pace Nebulon+Stealth+
...has mastered the Pilot profession
TIE Interceptor Guide to PvP
"Your generic TIE grunt is just plain suicidal. And the TIE Defender jockey is bloodthirsty. But the TIE Interceptor pilot, he's suicidal and bloodthirsty. When you see a squad of those maniacs flying your way, you'd better hope your hyperdrive is operational." - Kyle Katarn

AideonOfAesir
Tue Nov 01, 2005 9:58 am
#43

And unless I'm decorating my house or vaping Norram in Deep Space I'll be happy to br your friendly neighborhood Bounty Hunter and pull all the aggro while you parwan down to the skeleton. Speaking of which, I should probably hop in game and see if Norram wants to do that now or later.



Abi Ocopaqui

Pre Nge:
Master Bounty Hunter
- Master Combat Medic - Pistoleer 4-0-0-0

Mayor - New Horizon, Rori



"Luck is merely an illusion, trusted by the ignorant and chased by the foolish." - Timothy Zahn

JanuHull
Tue Nov 01, 2005 3:53 pm
#44






xTekx wrote:
Hey Maudee. I've got this wonderful little level 4 engine you can use. Currently Dimmu has it and is leveling his character. But soon as he's done with it you can use it. It works well in PvP to. muahaha






Heh, don't joke about L4s, I've got two that are unreal. Low 60s speeds, high 60s YPRs.


Dear God, there's an L10 Blaster toting A-Wing in there somewhere....





Janu Hull
CertifiedjWing Nut
CFA

"This is not the ground game, please see a therapist for your outrage."

Halyn
Tue Nov 01, 2005 4:54 pm
#45

I'll readily attest that Tek's level 4 engine makes a TIE Interceptor move...he made me work for both kills in Kessel that day.




Halyn Lance -- Rara Avis Flight School
Common sense is highly uncommon.
...has mastered the Pilot profession.
"I'll type this slowly so even Imperials can understand..."--Michael Stackpole, RS IRC
xTekx
Tue Nov 01, 2005 5:18 pm
#46






JanuHull wrote:





xTekx wrote:
Hey Maudee. I've got this wonderful little level 4 engine you can use. Currently Dimmu has it and is leveling his character. But soon as he's done with it you can use it. It works well in PvP to. muahaha






Heh, don't joke about L4s, I've got two that are unreal. Low 60s speeds, high 60s YPRs.


Dear God, there's an L10 Blaster toting A-Wing in there somewhere....








But i wasn't joking. hehe.. I'm dead serious about it being a good lvl 4. And believe it or not, i've seriously been considering sticking that thing back into my advanced or interceptor. It's such a challenge flying with that engine against people who have lvl 8's or above. My best kill with it was against Abi while she was in her Awing. (Sorry Abi. I just have to brag a little about it) I consider that one of my best kills ever. I had to work so hard against her.


So yeah. Level 4's are viable





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xTekx-Omega 9

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dkleinw
Tue Nov 01, 2005 10:44 pm
#47

I understand what the OP is trying to say. I didn't get into JTL until about a couple months ago. I am a Master Architect, and decided to get into mining. Well, that was easier said then done LOL. Dediced to go freelance, heard it was the easiest. I do not PvP, and was "grinding" my way up the latter so I could use my Y8.


Well, I love the little fighters. Kept using a standard Scyk well into Tier 2. Then had a heavy Scyk made. Ya, it can carry more, but didn't seem that fun. Then I found the Bel 22.


At first, I thaught, the limits on mass is going to hurt. But I stalked the bazaars, and kept bugging my guildy MSW about parts. I sent theMSW numerous tellslike "Can you make a reactor better then this......(attach stats of current reactor). Over a months time, and for less then 500K I have built up a nice little interceptor.


These are my observations for what its worth. The theory of the mass limitation has3 major holes in it:


1 - Weapon Overcharge is WAY over powered. With a 1100 + Capacitor, you can shoot the twin guns on a Bel 22 almost all day AND have juice to throw into shields as needed.


2 - There are ALOT of lower mass, Level 4-6 parts that are about 90% as good as the Level 7-10 and at a fraction of the mass. I have a 1450 Reactor at 8900 mass, 880 engine with 60 pitch, etc at 9200 mass. A shield with 1900 front and back, 24 recharge at 11000 mass.


3 - Yes, The guns I use have damage ranges of only 1100-1550 and 1550-2300. BUT, they both do 64% verses shields and armor AND here is the kicker, they have a re-fire rate of 23 and use 28 per shot. Yes, those heavy 3600+ blasters could never be fitted into my interceptor, but I basicly take 5 shots for every 3 they take. So I actually do MORE damage in 10 seconds then they (heavies with higher damage weapons) do.


So combining the 3 above items, I have a ship that has shields, armor etc that is 80% of a heavies, I am faster and more manuverable, AND when outfitted right, actually can do more damage. End result, All that extra mass on the "heavy" fighters is mostly useless and does not compensate for my extra speed and manuverabilty. Because of the excessive firepower of Weapon Overcharge and my machinegun firing weapons, I could tear someones shields apart in less then 15 seconds.


That is how the Bel 22 is "unbalanced". What the OP was stating was, the FUN of JTL is to try to have people in near equal ships, and to test your skills, manuvers, "tricks" and the way your ship is outfitted to see who can claim to be a better pilot. Also, that if everyone had a Bel 22, Actis or RGI, combat would take FOREVER and get boring real fast. The OP was just commenting that its nice the PvP tend to police themselves and try to have everyone in comperable ships during PvP events.


I haven't PvP, and I wouldn't use my "JODZ Maruader" to do PvP. Wouldn't be much fun. I like using it for the Tier 4 Escort missions, me alone against 8 or more Tier 5 Mobs. All that stands between good and evil is a single lone interceptor I don't use Epulse. I like to "personelly" flame those Mobs.


The end result, I have gone against up to 14 Tier 5s at one time, and it was close, but I flamed them all, and was able to fly away. Individual results may vary, but in the right hands and flown by a dedicated pilot, NOTHING can touch the Actis, RGI or Bel 22 except another. And since I can not stand going against those bugger A-Wings, I could not imagine how boring it would be to go against another Bel 22 in PvP. I'd hyper away just to end it.


So hats off to the PvP players who realize, the FOTM does not necessarily make PvP fun! But until I decide to PvP, I will still jump into hairballs with a dozen or so Tier 5s with my interceptor


Oceaf


M4dC4t
Wed Nov 02, 2005 6:36 am
#48

I fail to see where there could be any unbalance in space, Space is what you make of it, the ships have there mass an ddesign which makes them so handle in diferent ways. As a Rebel master pilot I use several ships, Nova, x-wing, Y-8 and Arc-170 and each has there purpose.


Nova for Heavy missions to take out large targets when helping with guild space quests

X-wing with a tractor beam, mining Lasers and a blaster for solo mining

Y-8 if I can get it to work right for group mning and hopefully much fastre resource gain

Arc-170 has the control of a A-wing which makes it a fast fighter good for takeing on high lvl figher groups

Belbullab handles much like the x-wing in my book and used to be my pick for mining but the extra weapon slotin the x-wing makes it a better ship.


I'm very sorry if you think that space is unbalanced, the thing your missingabout space is it's all about your skills, your ship and the equipment you put on it so no ship can ever be the same sorry to say so there can not be a unbalance I'm sorry to tell ya.



Real target lock is needed
More Profs are needed
SOE and all the Nerf people need to realize that a true balance is an unbalance.
Halyn
Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:13 am
#49






M4dC4t wrote:

I fail to see where there could be any unbalance in space, Space is what you make of it, the ships have there mass an ddesign which makes them so handle in diferent ways. As a Rebel master pilot I use several ships, Nova, x-wing, Y-8 and Arc-170 and each has there purpose.


...





Prior to Rage of the Wookiees, space as an entire system was close to balance. A-wings and TIE Oppressors were most often the point of dispute, since the A-wing was the smallest ship in the game and the TIE Oppressor is the only fighter to carry three missile tubes. Also prior to RotW, ships followed a general pattern:


The more mass, the slower the handling, the bigger the hitbox. The less mass, the more agile the handling, the smaller the hitbox.


That's in general--didn't always hold true for the Freelancers, but basically that's what it boiled down to.


Unbalance became obviously apparent when RotW was introduced and we had superagile high-mass fighters. An A-wing was small, lightweight, and fast--which is why it had 65k mass. The Actis was brought in suddenly, which is smaller than the A-wing, has 90k mass, and is more maneuverable. When you compare two ships and one has no obvious drawbacks over the other, there is an unbalance.


I'd really recommend looking at the stats for each ship (look in the FAQ). Just looking at the numbers should indicate that there's an imbalance.


Space isn't just about your individual pilot skills. The PvP environment takes several things into account--personal skills, the stats of the chassis, the ship loadout. If any one of these is highly out of balance, it gives one of the pilots a huge edge. We all will agree that, ship loadouts being equal, the superior pilot will win most of the time. But if the pilots are equal, and one chassis is far superior to another, than that pilot has the advantage. If pilots are equal and the chasses are the same, then the pilot with a better loadout will have an advantage.


Most pilots will readily admit they have no problem with differences in pilot skill or ship loadout determining a fight--both require skill on the part of the pilot, actually, since ship loadouts can be tricky. But when certain chasses are far overpowering on the battlefield, that is where there is an unacceptable imbalance--especially when the chasses in questions are supposed to be decades older than the modern snubfighters.




Halyn Lance -- Rara Avis Flight School
Common sense is highly uncommon.
...has mastered the Pilot profession.
"I'll type this slowly so even Imperials can understand..."--Michael Stackpole, RS IRC
JanuHull
Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:30 am
#50






M4dC4t wrote:

I fail to see where there could be any unbalance in space, Space is what you make of it, the ships have there mass an ddesign which makes them so handle in diferent ways. As a Rebel master pilot I use several ships, Nova, x-wing, Y-8 and Arc-170 and each has there purpose.


Nova for Heavy missions to take out large targets when helping with guild space quests

X-wing with a tractor beam, mining Lasers and a blaster for solo mining

Y-8 if I can get it to work right for group mning and hopefully much fastre resource gain

Arc-170 has the control of a A-wing which makes it a fast fighter good for takeing on high lvl figher groups

Belbullab handles much like the x-wing in my book and used to be my pick for mining but the extra weapon slotin the x-wing makes it a better ship.


I'm very sorry if you think that space is unbalanced, the thing your missingabout space is it's all about your skills, your ship and the equipment you put on it so no ship can ever be the same sorry to say so there can not be a unbalance I'm sorry to tell ya.






The Bel and JSF handle over above and beyond anything an X-Wing can muster. Hell, they're just about over the head of your typical A-Wing. You are correct, its more about the Pilot than it is the machine, but that's no excuse to throw logic to the wind when it comes to balancing the performance of different spacecraft.


The JSF and Bel are smaller than an A-Wing, almost as massive as a stock X-Wing, Dunelizard and more mass than a TIE Advanced,plus have better maneuvering statistic modifiers than any other ships in the game.


Its too much benefit forvirtually nosacrifice. And they aren't the only ships that are at issue.


The Vaksai, even though its a single gunned ship, is a scoche overmass at 150k, the Advanced X-Wing is easily too massive at 180k. The RGI is probably the best of the bunch, except for the bugged hitbox. We're not just coming down on the Clone Relics by any stretch.



Hell, as far as the ARC is concerned, its probably too light for what it wants to be.


I look at my own Heavy X-Wing and sometimes think its too much, which is why I keep an A-Wing handy, and have been known to go up in a Y-Wing or even get a crew together for my Nova Courier.





Janu Hull
CertifiedjWing Nut
CFA

"This is not the ground game, please see a therapist for your outrage."

M4dC4t
Wed Nov 02, 2005 8:51 am
#51

I have flown just to see both X-wings after I got the advanced and hate to say they both fly like a boat, the Bel as you refer to flys just about the same with a larger hit and more defence. The JSF if you recall is fast fighter used primarly for intercept just the A-wing. I can't anything about the imp since I have never flown them but no Rebel ship carries 3 misslie tubes aside fromteh Nova. Again I state that the ships are fine if you don't like how a ship handles change the components, switch ship or just learn how to FLY!!! If they make all fighter equal per skill level there will be no point, the thing about flying is it is based on you personally not so much the system but you and how you prep your ship so deal with it. I can go into Kessel with anyship I have and I know what ship I need to attack the ships there and depending and what I'm there to do is what I take.



Real target lock is needed
More Profs are needed
SOE and all the Nerf people need to realize that a true balance is an unbalance.
PaceNebulon
Wed Nov 02, 2005 9:14 am
#52


It is true that the pilots abilities play a critical role in any ship both in piloting and in outfitting but here is my issue with the Bel-22/JSF.


From the FAQ:


(Tier 4) Eta-2 Actis Interceptor (Jedi Starfighter): N/A Resources 90k mass [SP: 2 Guns] 1 missile
[Spdx 0.95 Acc 50 Dec 50 Pitch 600 Yaw 600 Roll 300]

(Tier 4) TIE-Advanced: 80k Resources ~65k mass [SP: 2 Guns] 1 missile
[Spdx 1.0 Acc 40 Dec 60 Pitch 300 Yaw 300 Roll 150]


I compare it to the advanced because it is closest to the JSF in terms of weapon loadout, size, and performance. So, it is twice as maneuverable as the advanced but it does take a hit in speed so that balances. However, it is way smaller than the advanced and yet still has 25k more mass. It is this mass verses size issue that make it and the bel-22 (to slightly lesser degree, the Bel is about the same size as the advanced) unbalanced.



Pace Nebulon+Stealth+
...has mastered the Pilot profession
TIE Interceptor Guide to PvP
"Your generic TIE grunt is just plain suicidal. And the TIE Defender jockey is bloodthirsty. But the TIE Interceptor pilot, he's suicidal and bloodthirsty. When you see a squad of those maniacs flying your way, you'd better hope your hyperdrive is operational." - Kyle Katarn

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