Pilot Archive
Thread: Suggestions for improving the fun of space PvP
i still really don't see where you are coming from with the timesink. believe me, i despise timesinks as well, but you spawn at the station, hit RO4, hyperspace, enter DS and hit EO4, it literally takes less than a minute. also, how do people who are done leave the zone if they spawn at the station? maybe you need to "clone" inside the station then run to your ship and launch, it's not really a timesink (aside from loading times). but then you have the problem of no buffer in which to run more than 1 droid program. i don't know, i'm just struggling to really see the timesink.
i've had players who said "that sucked" and leave as well after PVP. but again, you don't know they are basing that entirely off dying in one hit. bring those same pilots to PVP vs someone with a better engine and give them both weak guns. does constantly turning without even seeing the player on your screen while he shoots you elicit a different response? so they die in 10 hits without landing 1 on their opponent. i guess i really don't understand how that is any more fun. you died because you have weaker equipment, not due to a flaw in your aim or a flaw in your manuvering. you die in the current system and you really have only yourself to blame.
that's not my scenario. i only need eo4 and i have a great reactor so i just load up, hit hyperspace and hit 1 button.
if they need to get into the zone ASAP, there are a plethora of options available to them. if they are just going back for PVE they can take an extra 20 seconds to load all the programs they want. all i'm saying is it is NOT a 5 minute timesink as players in here are purporting. you don't even need to run any programs if you don't want to.
hell, run 1 then run 1 the second you load in DS. loading in the zone resets the DI counter remember.
Rorenikibi wrote:
Where space PvP is failing is in its exclusivity of template. Right now, the only competitive ships are high speed, ultramaneuverable ships with a monstrous engine, crazy YPR and a BFG on the nose.
Different chassis for different professions and quests, but the statistical performance range for function in PvP is needle point thin. Heavy Fighters, POBs, and Fighter/Bombers have zero role in PvP other than cannon fodder.
That's. Just. Plain. Wrong.
PvP on the ground was deemed screwed up because only professions dealing in Mind damage were ever viable when the statistical range of functional PvP armor became equally narrow pre-CU. If you're PvP armor wasn't 85-90% composite, and your template didn't have a Mind shot, you didn't PvP as anything more than cannon fodder (or a Jedi).
PvP will only be viable and workable when its all encompassing. The POBs, B-Wings, Kraytsand Oppressors need to be as much a part of the working picture as the JSF and Vaskai. You guys who think this is all kosher are in the same trap that Riflemen/Combat medics were in with their 90% armor and 1500 tick Mind Poison and Stun damage JawaRifles.You've narrowed the range of workable performance to the narrowest pinnacle possible, and you think because it works for you, anyone else who thinks they should be able to do it differently and perform just as well are simply whining.
Get your heads out of your ass and look at the big picture for a friggin' minute.
WRONG
this is EXACTLY the kind of misinformed BS that experienced pilots are fighting to get people to stop posting. it's idiocy and proved completely untrue day in and day out.
i fly my oppressor exclusively.and i have won almost 80 fights.itis big and comparatively slow. in space PVP you can fly whatever you want and remain competitive. point in fact i flew a kihraxz with bazaar equipment and a level 5 gun for 1 month and won more than i lost. you sir, are flat out misinformed.
the only part of your post that has any validity whatsoever is the fact that POB ships do not fit in. i have addressed that point no less than 3 times on this thread.
really it's you who needs to get his head out of his ass. you are taking your own annecdotal experiences and posting them as if they were fact although players who do pvprefute your "facts" every single day. hell, the top two PVP'ers on gorath fly oppressors. just because you think heavy ships have no purpose doesn't mean it's so. they actually have a very well defined role and that role is supported by light fighters. you want to talk about parity in this game? a heavy fighter can take out a light fighter even though that should not really be possible. that's parity and would be utterly impossible with a damage reduction mechanic.it's absurd to compare the current dynamic to temploits or anything to do with ground combat.
Message Edited by quadpers0n on 06-21-2005 10:34 AM
Once again, you are failing to see the scenarios from other people. That you only need 1 droid program does not mena everyone is on the same boat. Assuming each droid program takes between 40 - 60 seconds, that is already 4 minutes in the process. Yes, the timer does get reset when you hyper but you only hyper once. So assume you can lower it down to 3 minutes, you still have hte timer form the last one that you have to wait to expire. A lot of people on this forum somehow become selfish and fail to see the need of others. Right now you are acting that way by basically saying, I do not need to run 4 droid programs so too bad for those who do, wither run 1 like me or let them take a long time. Assuming the above idea got implemented, It would not affect you at all. It would benefit you aswell but not as much as it would benefit others. Really, I am not flaming you, ust making an observation.
no no no. you are talking about WANTS. not needs.
you only NEED engine overload to be competitive. if your objective is to get back into the action *instantly* go with what you NEED, not with what you want. if your objective isn't to get back into the action instantly, go with what you want.
a post claimed it's a 5 minute timesink to rejoin PVP and that is absolutely, 100% false. you don't even NEED droid programs. wanting everything and claiming things as fact that have potential to scare away players is the real selfish act here.
let's be perfectly clear to new players out there who might be reading this.
you don't need a perfect ship
you don't need a ton of droid programs
you don't need massive guns
you don't need massive shields.
and most importantly, you don't need to win 100% of the time.
does all that stuff help? absolutely but you don't need to worry about anything,just get up there and fight. aim and awareness can take the place of all your trinkets and worries every single day you fly. posters on this thread are arguing about their composite and buffs not being good enough and they don't even need any of it.
quadpers0n wrote:
Rorenikibi wrote:
Where space PvP is failing is in its exclusivity of template. Right now, the only competitive ships are high speed, ultramaneuverable ships with a monstrous engine, crazy YPR and a BFG on the nose.
Different chassis for different professions and quests, but the statistical performance range for function in PvP is needle point thin. Heavy Fighters, POBs, and Fighter/Bombers have zero role in PvP other than cannon fodder.
That's. Just. Plain. Wrong.
PvP on the ground was deemed screwed up because only professions dealing in Mind damage were ever viable when the statistical range of functional PvP armor became equally narrow pre-CU. If you're PvP armor wasn't 85-90% composite, and your template didn't have a Mind shot, you didn't PvP as anything more than cannon fodder (or a Jedi).
PvP will only be viable and workable when its all encompassing. The POBs, B-Wings, Kraytsand Oppressors need to be as much a part of the working picture as the JSF and Vaskai. You guys who think this is all kosher are in the same trap that Riflemen/Combat medics were in with their 90% armor and 1500 tick Mind Poison and Stun damage JawaRifles.You've narrowed the range of workable performance to the narrowest pinnacle possible, and you think because it works for you, anyone else who thinks they should be able to do it differently and perform just as well are simply whining.
Get your heads out of your ass and look at the big picture for a friggin' minute.
WRONG
this is EXACTLY the kind of misinformed BS that experienced pilots are fighting to get people to stop posting. it's idiocy and proved completely untrue day in and day out.
i fly my oppressor exclusively.and i have won almost 80 fights.itis big and comparatively slow. in space PVP you can fly whatever you want and remain competitive. point in fact i flew a kihraxz with bazaar equipment and a level 5 gun for 1 month and won more than i lost. you sir, are flat out misinformed.
the only part of your post that has any validity whatsoever is the fact that POB ships do not fit in. i have addressed that point no less than 3 times on this thread.
really it's you who needs to get his head out of his ass. you are taking your own annecdotal experiences and posting them as if they were fact although players who do pvprefute your "facts" every single day. hell, the top two PVP'ers on gorath fly oppressors. just because you think heavy ships have no purpose doesn't mean it's so. they actually have a very well defined role and that role is supported by light fighters. you want to talk about parity in this game? a heavy fighter can take out a light fighter even though that should not really be possible. that's parity and would be utterly impossible with a damage reduction mechanic.it's absurd to compare the current dynamic to temploits or anything to do with ground combat.
Message Edited by quadpers0n on 06-21-2005 10:34 AM
Not true quadpers. The opressor and the kihraxz are relatively small targets as seen here: http://img139.echo.cx/img139/3392/swgships0yy.jpg
1. Is the timer that big of a deal? The time it takes to fire up my ship I use to mentally re-run the last fight to better combat my enemies tactics, when I'm with a group its a great way to get as many people re-grouped at the DS load station so you're not all loading one at a time.
2. Gotta agree with quad on the viablity of the bigger ships, except the POBs pretty much any ship can be effective in PvP. It all comes down to tactics. Fit your ship to your tactics.
quadpers0n wrote:
no no no. you are talking about WANTS. not needs.
you only NEED engine overload to be competitive. if your objective is to get back into the action *instantly* go with what you NEED, not with what you want. if your objective isn't to get back into the action instantly, go with what you want.
a post claimed it's a 5 minute timesink to rejoin PVP and that is absolutely, 100% false. you don't even NEED droid programs. wanting everything and claiming things as fact that have potential to scare away players is the real selfish act here.
How do you evaluate what is a need and what is a want? For example, all those might seem like wants to you, BUT maybe they are needs for another player in order to be competitive with you. Just remember that not everyone is the same and do not evaluate people/circumstances by what you consider a need or wants.
BS. I flew my alts Krayt in a huge PvP battle a few weeks back. I died4 times is all during that very long night, and took out more then a few A-wings and JSFs. I survived far more hits then I died to. Yeah its huge, so don't present a target - get in and out of their range FAST.
ajag wrote:
quadpers0n wrote:
Rorenikibi wrote:
Where space PvP is failing is in its exclusivity of template. Right now, the only competitive ships are high speed, ultramaneuverable ships with a monstrous engine, crazy YPR and a BFG on the nose.
Different chassis for different professions and quests, but the statistical performance range for function in PvP is needle point thin. Heavy Fighters, POBs, and Fighter/Bombers have zero role in PvP other than cannon fodder.
That's. Just. Plain. Wrong.
PvP on the ground was deemed screwed up because only professions dealing in Mind damage were ever viable when the statistical range of functional PvP armor became equally narrow pre-CU. If you're PvP armor wasn't 85-90% composite, and your template didn't have a Mind shot, you didn't PvP as anything more than cannon fodder (or a Jedi).
PvP will only be viable and workable when its all encompassing. The POBs, B-Wings, Kraytsand Oppressors need to be as much a part of the working picture as the JSF and Vaskai. You guys who think this is all kosher are in the same trap that Riflemen/Combat medics were in with their 90% armor and 1500 tick Mind Poison and Stun damage JawaRifles.You've narrowed the range of workable performance to the narrowest pinnacle possible, and you think because it works for you, anyone else who thinks they should be able to do it differently and perform just as well are simply whining.
Get your heads out of your ass and look at the big picture for a friggin' minute.
WRONG
this is EXACTLY the kind of misinformed BS that experienced pilots are fighting to get people to stop posting. it's idiocy and proved completely untrue day in and day out.
i fly my oppressor exclusively.and i have won almost 80 fights.itis big and comparatively slow. in space PVP you can fly whatever you want and remain competitive. point in fact i flew a kihraxz with bazaar equipment and a level 5 gun for 1 month and won more than i lost. you sir, are flat out misinformed.
the only part of your post that has any validity whatsoever is the fact that POB ships do not fit in. i have addressed that point no less than 3 times on this thread.
really it's you who needs to get his head out of his ass. you are taking your own annecdotal experiences and posting them as if they were fact although players who do pvprefute your "facts" every single day. hell, the top two PVP'ers on gorath fly oppressors. just because you think heavy ships have no purpose doesn't mean it's so. they actually have a very well defined role and that role is supported by light fighters. you want to talk about parity in this game? a heavy fighter can take out a light fighter even though that should not really be possible. that's parity and would be utterly impossible with a damage reduction mechanic.it's absurd to compare the current dynamic to temploits or anything to do with ground combat.
Message Edited by quadpers0n on 06-21-2005 10:34 AM
Not true quadpers. The opressor and the kihraxz are relatively small targets as seen here: http://img139.echo.cx/img139/3392/swgships0yy.jpg
Now they can use the same weapons as the bigger ships assuming you are good at handling your ship's mass which most people got the hang of right now. Now take the Krayt and although it has much more fire power, much more mass, and can possibly use a lot more armor than your opressor, it is too big of a target to be usable in PvP with the amount of firepower you can dish from any ship. you can put 2k armor on it and it is still worthless. Try flyinging one in PvP and see if you still think the same way.