Pilot Archive

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Yalton wrote:
Very true to a point. But I wasn't the one who brought up that they are at war.

First this War has been going on a few years. I understand that the Rebels buy their ships. What really suprises me is how nice the Empire is. Most Dictatorships remove ALL weapon manufacturing not under their direct control... Really suprised there is a place for the Rebels to buy ships.

Second the Rebels seem very well funded and have a lot of safe places. A ruler that is willing to build a weapon to destroy planets would eb willing to massacare populations that support the oppisition.

To be honest if I was the Emperoer there wouldn't have been ANY ship makers except ones controlled by the state and I would make it illegal to operate a ship with out being an Imperial pilot. This would give me complete control of commerce and the millitary. Since only Imperial pilots would fly and we know how corrupt they are then there would be some smuggling and uncontrolled commerce. But that wouldn't be enough to build and maintane real war fleets.

Given the fact that the Mon Cal Crusiers are such a big part of the Rebel fleet it is supprising the Mon Cal home world is still populated...

Now back from the tangent.

Is it smarter to keep developing new fighters or modify existing ones to better meet you're needs?

The answer is simple. Look at teh US Air Force and Navy. The F-14 and F-15 are both over 30 years old. Both have been modified a tremendous amount since they have entered service. Both are considered cutting edge fighters. They are going to be replaced by Bleeding Edge fighters. The F/A-18, F/A-22 and the F-35 are all expected to be inservice for at least 30 years. Does that mean the fighters won't change at all? No

All fighters are going to recieve upgrades to improve their performance. I would expect the Z-95 and the Y wing to ahve been upgraded to the point where they are still useful. Also given that the technolgy hasn't improved signigantly in 30 years and there wasn't a war to drive develpoment. Why should there be new fighter designs?

Now one piece of technolgy that isn't being really apllied here is the ability to negate inertia. What you say? They can't negate inertia.... WRONG. If they couldn't negate inerti they would die trying to jump form one place to another in hyperspace. Simple rules of physics would mean red splotches ont eh walls and seat so fevery hyper travel craft. Sinc they can negate inertia that means the only things tht controll how fast a ship can tunr is the vector control of the engine. So you shouls ahve a YT that can turn as fast as an A wing. Does this make sense? Not if you want balance and it isn't intuitive. But is is how the phsycis would work.

Edited for spelling.

Message Edited by Yalton on 05-22-2005 09:02 PM

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RebalMarineHunter wrote:

Eh, not asking much, but how about this?

The Jedi starfighter is an obsolete starfighter where the A-wing is an advanced fighter barely past prototype stage at this point. So, if that fighter is to exist it should only have 1 gun and no missles nore the ability to equip armor.

All other specs could remain the same this way...except mass, it needs to be lowered to 60K

Heavy Z-95, Heavy TIE, Heavy hut fighter. Yeah, there alright. But, reduce there manuverability by 30% atleast on all stats. They are heavy ships with greater inertia therefore should suffer a penalty.

Y-8 outmanuvers my B-wing!?!?! OK, lower the Y-8's YPR by 10% and improve the B-wing by lets say 25%. This would make the Y feel more like a mining vessel and the B would become much more fun to use.

Tractor beems go around 850 meters?!?!

So, make all Master level blaster type weapons have a rangeof atleast 750meters then with lower weapons hitting 700 meters. Make missle locks take hold at 850 meters. Of course improve NPC craft to the same levels.

This would improve the feel of space combat A LOT because you could engage in fights at enough range to where the everlasting loops may never happen. And, missles/countermeasures would become much more important to the game.

I love space, but changes LIKE these could add a lot to the feel and fun of the game.

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Ilyrana wrote:

In Short there are tuns of ships from the EU that could be added some better and some worse than current ships but the ships they added are 20+ years old and they made them better then the newest ships in any of the 3 factions? Why? This just does not seam right to me. I am not saying that imps should be second rate in their ships (although history of the Starwars universe points out that the empire had their Strengthen in the fact they out numbered the rebels not that they had superior equipment just the opposite the imperial Ties where junk. the light tie didn’t even have shields or hyperdrive, and the Rebel ships wile State of the art they where also in Disrepair and they where short good pilots

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I dunno about E-wings man. While TIE Defender comes into existence in the next couple years(comes into existance between the battles of Hoth and Endor), so there could be prototypes, the E-Wing doesn't exist for like another 15 years.

I definatly agree that none of the "players" are regular pilots. We're all a kind of conscripted special forces. We pay for our own ships, thats why all imp players TIEs have shields and hyperdrives. Cause, we buy our ships ourselves, and unlike the Imperial Navy, we CARE weither we survive or not.

My problem is I don't see a way to balance out the JSF looking at the tools the Devs have. Less mass, fewer guns, no armor, no shiels, ect... are not going to be retroative. So any changes made to teh JSF are not goignt o fix the problem. We will ahve Pre nerf JSFs that will still be as good as they are now. Increasing the A wing is possible but all A wings that are currently in the game would become obselte also and the owner would ahve to buy a new one.

Personaly from a BALANCE stand point I wish the JSF, ARC 170 and the Bel-22 were worse then the JTL ships. The RED Intcs and Vas being where they are and the heavy X wing and the heavy light fighters being slower and less nimble.

Does this break the game no. DO I like the way it is no. Does it mean I will change tactics and develope new ways to fight, YES! It is going to force us all to adapt. Those that can't adapt die. That is simple evolution.

As a freelance I could have complaned that we have the largest profile in space combat. Only a few are as nimble as some TIEs. We don't have a missle boat like the Op to deal the massive damage in a short time like the Imperials get. Sure we get the KSE and the Krayte. The KSE is a joke in my opinion. The krayte is my favorite fighter but has less guns controlled by the pilot then the B wing and the B wing is a LOT smaller profile to be hit and the krayte doesn't have a concentrated gun pattern.

But I will adapt and kill people. I would love to see the faces of the A wing pilots I have killed in my krayte. Especialy the ones that saw me coming.

Hunter. You're probably right that it would be impossible to locate and destroy all ship production. But you sure would be able to slow it to the point that the other side can't make Capitol ship. Light gunboats and such I would expect. But a crusier is a lot of resources and people. harder to hide some thing liek that. Especialy with the secret police the Empereor had. But I guese it would be possible.

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Yalton wrote:
First:
I stress that the technological and cultural evolution of a society that has been standing for that long, is much faster than that of our own.

Wrong. What new technolgy has come about? The cultural "evolution" might be better said to devole. Wonder ifthat is even a word.

One of two things have happend:
1) Peace meaning there was little work on weapons platforms since thee was no need to push the development forward. You can't use the US durring the cold war or even now because for the US there are still hostile nations to struggle against. The Empire has NO enemies if there isn't a civil war going on.

2) There has been war the entire time. In that case see my points on the affects of attrition on the sides of war in my first post.

Second:
Thats your inertial compensator, I have mine turned to .95, I dont want to end up like Jek "Piggy" Porkins after all!

RebalMarine Hunter > You are tring to set up a balance and that is good. No offence but you're agruments just don't seem to hold enough logic or balance or are some thing that we have seen the Devs can "fix" with out breaking some thing else. Given the fact there are so many bugs that rank higher on the list I don't think we will see anything that will restore balance for a while. What is going to happen is people are goign to adapt and make new tactics to deal with it. Most Imp pilots used the Op with missles to overcome the A wings. Now it is time for Rebels to use that same tactic against the JSF or develop some new tactics. They might not have a nice missle boat but there is enough to manage. You could even go freelance and fight for both sides. Lots more fun to join the underdogs and pummel the winning side in DS.
What ever you call it it does the same thing. If they can compenstae for a human they can compenstate for some metal that is a lot less fragile. End result is mass should have no affect on how fast some thing can move. The only thngs that would affect it would be opposing force. Since the "wind resistance," if you will of space is so small there really isn't much force affecting any of the craft that travel in space. Hence a small craft will be able to turn better then a large one because it doesn't have such a large force pushing against it. But that force is going to be so small for space that it isn't going to make enough diffrence to fighter craft. Now a SSD will turn a little slower then a Syk because of the diffrence in profile size.

Do I think that this would be fun? NO.
If there is no bennifit for take a small lower mass fighter of a big tank style fighter then most people would take the bigger fighter and the more mass. The only thing thta would affect the fighters people choose would be weapon and ordance slots and what look they are going for.

On the same note the Dev have said they delibratly made it atmospheric flight to help people fly in space. If they didn't I could fly backwards and a whole lot of other tricks that would really make a diffrence in PvP.
Speaking of PvP, added another name to my list of people that sits at a station overt and has no situational awarnes. He/She didn't survive making that mistake.

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DarthEnderX wrote:

I dunno about E-wings man. While TIE Defender comes into existence in the next couple years(comes into existance between the battles of Hoth and Endor), so there could be prototypes, the E-Wing doesn't exist for like another 15 years.

I definatly agree that none of the "players" are regular pilots. We're all a kind of conscripted special forces. We pay for our own ships, thats why all imp players TIEs have shields and hyperdrives. Cause, we buy our ships ourselves, and unlike the Imperial Navy, we CARE weither we survive or not.

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Just a reminder that it has almost been 15 in-game years since launch date

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JediNg wrote:

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DarthEnderX wrote:

I dunno about E-wings man. While TIE Defender comes into existence in the next couple years(comes into existance between the battles of Hoth and Endor), so there could be prototypes, the E-Wing doesn't exist for like another 15 years.

I definatly agree that none of the "players" are regular pilots. We're all a kind of conscripted special forces. We pay for our own ships, thats why all imp players TIEs have shields and hyperdrives. Cause, we buy our ships ourselves, and unlike the Imperial Navy, we CARE weither we survive or not.

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Just a reminder that it has almost been 15 in-game years since launch date

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15 in-game years? I thought that time froze in place and were all just running around still? We haven't moved forward in the so called time line since when? I can't remember it.

But this is a great thread. Good discussion going on here. I'll add my 2 cents to it all when I get a little more time.

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JediNg wrote:

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Yalton wrote:
First:
I stress that the technological and cultural evolution of a society that has been standing for that long, is much faster than that of our own.

Wrong. What new technolgy has come about? The cultural "evolution" might be better said to devole. Wonder ifthat is even a word.

One of two things have happend:
1) Peace meaning there was little work on weapons platforms since thee was no need to push the development forward. You can't use the US durring the cold war or even now because for the US there are still hostile nations to struggle against. The Empire has NO enemies if there isn't a civil war going on.

2) There has been war the entire time. In that case see my points on the affects of attrition on the sides of war in my first post.

Second:
Thats your inertial compensator, I have mine turned to .95, I dont want to end up like Jek "Piggy" Porkins after all!

RebalMarine Hunter > You are tring to set up a balance and that is good. No offence but you're agruments just don't seem to hold enough logic or balance or are some thing that we have seen the Devs can "fix" with out breaking some thing else. Given the fact there are so many bugs that rank higher on the list I don't think we will see anything that will restore balance for a while. What is going to happen is people are goign to adapt and make new tactics to deal with it. Most Imp pilots used the Op with missles to overcome the A wings. Now it is time for Rebels to use that same tactic against the JSF or develop some new tactics. They might not have a nice missle boat but there is enough to manage. You could even go freelance and fight for both sides. Lots more fun to join the underdogs and pummel the winning side in DS.
What ever you call it it does the same thing. If they can compenstae for a human they can compenstate for some metal that is a lot less fragile. End result is mass should have no affect on how fast some thing can move. The only thngs that would affect it would be opposing force. Since the "wind resistance," if you will of space is so small there really isn't much force affecting any of the craft that travel in space. Hence a small craft will be able to turn better then a large one because it doesn't have such a large force pushing against it. But that force is going to be so small for space that it isn't going to make enough diffrence to fighter craft. Now a SSD will turn a little slower then a Syk because of the diffrence in profile size.

Do I think that this would be fun? NO.
If there is no bennifit for take a small lower mass fighter of a big tank style fighter then most people would take the bigger fighter and the more mass. The only thing thta would affect the fighters people choose would be weapon and ordance slots and what look they are going for.

On the same note the Dev have said they delibratly made it atmospheric flight to help people fly in space. If they didn't I could fly backwards and a whole lot of other tricks that would really make a diffrence in PvP.
Speaking of PvP, added another name to my list of people that sits at a station overt and has no situational awarnes. He/She didn't survive making that mistake.

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moron. It took thousands of yours to make the transition from stone to some sort of metal. took a little less time to refine metal making to turn it into the aircraft grade alloys we have today. it took thousands of years for mankind to finally devolop the steam engine from it's humble times in the stone ages, less than a century later, the internal combustion engine, even shorter still, the gas turbine engine, and even shorter, the rocket. Technological evolution only speeds up. I don't care about your personal opinion. This is objective.

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The Moron is you. Why? In fact we went to the moon how many years ago? We have been traveling in space for how long? We ahve had how many revolutionary devepolments in the last decade? Last 2 Decades?

There are two type of tech improvements. Incremental some times refered to as evolutional, and Jumps also refered to as Revelutional. Examples of evolutional is the fact that computers are getting fast, smaller, more memory etc... a revolutionary improvment was the trasistor. Also flight and many other things go under revolutionary improvements.

I have seen NO REVOLUTIONARY iprovments in the Star Wars tech. In fact all I have seen is evolutionary chages.

Also there is no driving force to develope new weapons if there is no war. Sad to say we humans don't do things with out some benefit. We could ahve a colony on the moon but we don't. Why? The benifit isn't there and the drive that we had from competition isnt' there also.

Now add in the fact there are limits to how far we can go. For example an electron can only move so fast and is only so small. One fo the problems facing future computer design is the fact that an Electron is so big...

Will we over come it. Probably. Will it happen over night? No. Will it happen if there is no drive for it? No. In the case of computers for most people they could use a 486 for most of the work they do. They don't need the heavy processors that we gamers use. Not every one needs to ahve the latest and greatest. But because they only make the latest and greatest that is what people buy. What drives the computer development is the fact people want better. But are we willing to spen a lot of money making new fighters when there are very few countries that can compete in the air with us? NO.

Congress is trying to cut back on defence spending because we aren't percieved as being in a war. Sure teh F-22 and F-35 are great fighters but are they needed today? are the needed tomorrow or the day after that? No. Will they be needed in a few years? Possibly.

So look at this from the perspective of an Empire that controls the galaxy. They don't have an enemy to fight untill the Rebelion. They made new designs and probably update there equipment often. Does that mean thet they are making new fighter designs every year? No. That is waste of money.

What I'm suprised at is that clone war era equipment isn't more common. There should ahve been a HUGE surplus of equipment left over after that war. Sure the avionics aren't teh best but you can upgrade all that stuff and switch out engines and such. In fact I can switch out the engine on my Krayte in a few seconds. Why wouldn't they upgrade there fighters in a similr way?

As for you're cares and calling me a Moron that is you're opinion. It does show you lack the ability to have a discusion and debate beyond the level I passed when I graduated from the First Grade or if your'e not a USA citizen then by the time I was 7 years old.