Pilot Archive
Thread: Whats YOUR standing on the Bebullab, JSF & Heavy Varients
ProCambarus wrote:
Practical use and whether they fit in timeline/balance are to be separated.
In practical terms and in my opinion
1. The Heavy X is the best PVE ship in the game. I would say it is overpowered as a PVE ship, but I refrain from it, I really enjoy flying it for PVE.
2. The JSF has a clear and significant advantage over any other ships in PVP, but only a slight advantage of a smaller combat box over the B 22. They have the best of the best of all aspects of PVP, except they dont have 3 ordnance slots. Their mass is more than enough to fit everything necessary and a little extra.
In terms of balance I would not nerf the new/old ships but would update the old ships so they get competitive, especially former agile fighters like the A wing and the T/A. Bombers could have a slight upgrade, but they are not rendered obsolete by the new ships.
Firstly, the JSF/BSF have a very great advantage over the Heavy X, in that in a good pilots hands you will take 5-10% of the hits you would in the larger ship, for high end PvE this is a serious bonus.
Secondly, just a quick point about the bit in red there. Think about it a bit, which is easier,
1. Balancing all the ROTW ships with each other, changing and balancing all the old ships with the ROTW, changing and balancing every ship component stat, crafted or looted to fit in this balance system, and finally balancing every NPC ship out there to fit in with the new system
or
2. Taking the 9 ROTW ships and balancing them within the current system.
I think you can guess which would be the quickest and the one SOE are less likely to get wrong.
Im sure they can change things in your datapad, lets say they just lowered the mass on the Heavy X (an 80% increase is mad) to 125k mass. Next time you go to fly you have to strip out your heavy components, its now balancedbut with that bit of an edge that makes it worth the effort to get and you dont lose anything at all. Especially me as ive been bugged from 1-2 hours since ROTW launch hehe. Consider ive bugged it everytime I log in thats a lot of bug reports.
S-1-l2-H-C wrote:
the problem is SOE cant just change the stats on all the ships in everyones datapads.
if they nerfed the JSF it would be for ppl that dont have it yet.
if they make crafted ships better, then anyone can go buy one. they could even make stats update if you deed it and re-generate the ship (giveit a min mass value for instance)
CuchulainnDarklight wrote:
1. Balancing all the ROTW ships with each other, changing and balancing all the old ships with the ROTW, changing and balancing every ship component stat, crafted or looted to fit in this balance system, and finally balancing every NPC ship out there to fit in with the new system.
I think this would be the best. Many of the old ships have been usless for a long time IMO.
I think they need to be more uniformed about the hitboxes on ships. In a twitch game, especially pvp where one hit can win a fight it atomatically becomes the most manuverable smallest hitbox ship that becomes themost used ship.
If they evened out the hitbox more and lowered pvp damaged.IMO it becomes a game where you trade off mass for more firepower at the loss of manuverability and speed. That I think would help bring more ships into being used for pvp battles.
Also I think they need to lower the manuvering tolerances on the larget ships like the B-wing and the POB ships so we could see the more of them out being used. As they are now we hardly ever see them becuase of the low firepower, bad manuvering or both.
Bits in red
Trynian1 wrote:
I think this would be the best. Many of the old ships have been usless for a long time IMO. Can you imagine SOE getting such a major change, a space CU if you will ,right, I cant. And i dont think that any of the old ships were useless before ROTW they just filled different roles, some poeople didnt use some ships because they didnt like them - but you still saw them.
I think they need to be more uniformed about the hitboxes on ships. In a twitch game, especially pvp where one hit can win a fight it atomatically becomes the most manuverable smallest hitbox ship that becomes themost used ship. True hence the idea of balance, before ROTW high manouverability and small hitbox meant low firepower and low mass.
If they evened out the hitbox more and lowered pvp damaged.IMO it becomes a game where you trade off mass for more firepower at the loss of manuverability and speed. That I think would help bring more ships into being used for pvp battles. Cant agree here PvP damage should not be lowered, watch the films and read the books, starfighters are fragile craft that explode when hit a few times, shields are only a momentary respite.
Also I think they need to lower the manuvering tolerances on the larget ships like the B-wing and the POB ships so we could see the more of them out being used. As they are now we hardly ever see them becuase of the low firepower, bad manuvering or both. I use a Ywing which is pretty damn sluggish and have PvPed successfully in both it and the Bwing, just ask Yanus whether you can PvP a POB successfully. A big ship has crap manouverability because it has heavy firepower.
Message Edited by CuchulainnDarklight on 08-07-2005 12:47 PM
CuchulainnDarklight wrote:
Bits in red
Trynian1 wrote:
I think this would be the best. Many of the old ships have been usless for a long time IMO. Can you imagine SOE getting such a major change, a space CU if you will ,right, I cant. And i dont think that any of the old ships were useless before ROTW they just filled different roles, some poeople didnt use some ships because they didnt like them - but you still saw them. I disagree, you hardley ever saw other then the main tier 4ships accept those still working their way up. Changes in manuverablilty and hitboxwould be a small code change imo, not even close to a cu type of thing. They were able to adjust stats on theships at will during beta soI don't see why they could not do so now.
I think they need to be more uniformed about the hitboxes on ships. In a twitch game, especially pvp where one hit can win a fight it atomatically becomes the most manuverable smallest hitbox ship that becomes themost used ship. True hence the idea of balance, before ROTW high manouverability and small hitbox meant low firepower and low mass. It should be manuverabilty verses mass only, if you make some ships harder to hit and faster and turn tighter it causes the problem we see today. With the way pvp damage works then you must use one of those ships to compete. That makes it so you only see only certain ships in PVP which = boring.
If they evened out the hitbox more and lowered pvp damaged.IMO it becomes a game where you trade off mass for more firepower at the loss of manuverability and speed. That I think would help bring more ships into being used for pvp battles. Cant agree here PvP damage should not be lowered, watch the films and read the books, starfighters are fragile craft that explode when hit a few times, shields are only a momentary respite. Sorry, this is not a movie or a book. This is a game where the fun is about actually playing. Not getting killed in 2 seconds when in a battle. Everytime I kill someone in one shot all I think is, "that was boring". In case you were not around in the early days that is why they changed pvp damage on the ground as to make battles a bit more interesting and last longer.
Also I think they need to lower the manuvering tolerances on the larget ships like the B-wing and the POB ships so we could see the more of them out being used. As they are now we hardly ever see them becuase of the low firepower, bad manuvering or both. I use a Ywing which is pretty damn sluggish and have PvPed successfully in both it and the Bwing, just ask Yanus whether you can PvP a POB successfully. A big ship has crap manouverability because it has heavy firepower. This isfor the good of the game. I have no doubt that you are so great that you were able to use it sucessfully. But overall you do not see them hardly ever, why, because most people are not as great as you in either one of them.
Sorry but the POB does not have supperior firepower. It only has 2 guns that can only both shoot at a target if it is on the middle plain. Come at it from top or bottom and only 1 gun can be used. Take a krayt and you can have 4 guns (with 1 gunner) with more firepower to bare on a target and better manuverability. Telling me to askYanus means nothing to me, I am sure he is a great pilot also. I have mastered every pilot professions and used every ship. While I do not claim to be the greatest pilot am fairly adept at it.
I am looking for more Star Warsfeel. I want to see more ships like the YT-1300, theNova and the Decimator in large scale pvpbattle. Not just all JSF, B22, RGI and the occasional other ships that get blown first. Try thinking about how you would really like to see a battle unfold and compare it to what you really see today.
Message Edited by CuchulainnDarklight on 08-07-2005 12:47 PM
Message Edited by Trynian1 on 08-08-2005 01:36 AM
1 jsf
1 belb
1 vaksai
1 arcs
1 heaxy x
1 a wing
1 b wing
1 krayt
1 firespray
1 yt-1300
1 nova courier
I will fly which ever ship I feel matches the mission / event I am taking part in, I keep all ships loaded and ready at all times, I spend millions on ship parts, I will not put up with a nerf to the ships I want to fly and have spent months in game tweaking and adjusting just because someone else has a hang-up about it.
Don't nerf the ROTW ships, just increase the stats of the-pre ROTW ships instead. It's all just numbers in a database.
Which would make you more happy at the end of the day, as a customer in general:-
A. Log on after patch day to find your ship has an overloaded mass and you have to rip everything out and start again.
or
B. Log on after patch day to find your trusty a-wing you've had since launch day suddenly has 50k spare space to use up.
in the either ship, i could use the following loadout:
my engine: 70s ypr, 82 speed, 9k mass
re'd l8 blastersx2: 22-25k mass each
shield: 1.9 f/r 16k mass
ir2/conc3 launcher(depending on what im doing) 6k mass
capacitor: 1k mass, 750 charge, 33 recharge
booster: 1k mass 28 acel 30 speed
chaff: 1k mass
di: 7k mass, 14 speed
now, here we have a monster of a ship, will go toe to to wiht just about any ship in terms of manuverability, has not one, but two l8 blasters, with missiles, countermeasures and a mkIV shield. personally i see this to be a problem.
as for the heavy z/scyk/tie-f, if any balancing need be done, move them to tier 2 or 3
and well, heavy x/vaskai, dont really mind, igi, needs to have the hitbox fixed.
The B22 is like spring wine in a sea of porridge. Itssheer elegance and performance make it the pinnacle of current SWG ship design. Down with those fat bloaters who have room for lead coffee tables in their cabins. Down with ships that fire weapons the weight of jupiter.
I loved my interceptor which could not bettered, then I got the crimson guard one which was betterer and bettererer still is the B22.
Loads of fun gettting parts to fit still (this is called emersion). And, I found an exploit!!!!!!!!! I can creep up behind firesprays at full dooberry and shoot them in the bun over and over and over.
If you want to suffer (self abusers) just run weapons overload 4 all the time and this will relieve your guilt for flying ships that are too nice for people who need to be punished by low mass.
Hern
meninus wrote:The B22 is like spring wine in a sea of porridge. Its sheer elegance and performance make it the pinnacle of current SWG ship design. Down with those fat bloaters who have room for lead coffee tables in their cabins. Down with ships that fire weapons the weight of jupiter.
I loved my interceptor which could not bettered, then I got the crimson guard one which was betterer and bettererer still is the B22.
Loads of fun gettting parts to fit still (this is called emersion). And, I found an exploit!!!!!!!!! I can creep up behind firesprays at full dooberry and shoot them in the bun over and over and over.
If you want to suffer (self abusers) just run weapons overload 4 all the time and this will relieve your guilt for flying ships that are too nice for people who need to be punished by low mass.
Hern
Mostly agree
Most nerfs happen in this game because one profession gets access to an unbalancing item or skill that another profession does not have access to.
Yet in this case "Everyone" has access to these ships, you dont even have to own ROTW to own the belb because you pick it up on the bazaar for the price of 15 minutes of loot farming in kessel, it's just pride and pig-headedness in my opinion.
Isamu-alva wrote:
Mostly agree
Most nerfs happen in this game because one profession gets access to an unbalancing item or skill that another profession does not have access to.
Yet in this case "Everyone" has access to these ships, you dont even have to own ROTW to own the belb because you pick it up on the bazaar for the price of 15 minutes of loot farming in kessel, it's just pride and pig-headedness in my opinion.
Exactly, everyone flys pretty much the same ship (composite armour), with the same droid programs (stun weapon), so what happened when that happened on the ground? The CU.
And anyone who says you can JUST increase the preROTW ships isnt thinking straight. If you increase them you also have to rebalance every ship component in game, crafted or looted, as well as every NPC ship and mission in game as they wont be balanced anymore.
Isamu-alva wrote:
Spread over my 2 characters I have:-
1 jsf
1 belb
1 vaksai
1 arcs
1 heaxy x
1 a wing
1 b wing
1 krayt
1 firespray
1 yt-1300
1 nova courier
I will fly which ever ship I feel matches the mission / event I am taking part in, I keep all ships loaded and ready at all times, I spend millions on ship parts, I will not put up with a nerf to the ships I want to fly and have spent months in game tweaking and adjusting just because someone else has a hang-up about it.
Don't nerf the ROTW ships, just increase the stats of the-pre ROTW ships instead. It's all just numbers in a database.
Which would make you more happy at the end of the day, as a customer in general:-
A. Log on after patch day to find your ship has an overloaded mass and you have to rip everything out and start again.
or
B. Log on after patch day to find your trusty a-wing you've had since launch day suddenly has 50k spare space to use up.
I'll keep my 66k mass JSF killing A-Wing and listen to the poonfighter punks whine like spanked b*tches.
