Pilot Archive
Thread: Jedi Pilots Deserve to use force powers IMO...
Manna wrote:
I mean you tell me why a jedi can't use those said powers in space? And you jackasses that keep saying that Bounty Hunters, Rangers, any melee prof, pretty much any prof that requires weapons, environments, special settings or LAND should be able to use their skills are out of your minds. Exactly how would that work? NO please don't tell me, I can't take anymore of your intelligence.
Ummm, I don't believe any of us have said that an ACTUAL Jedi wouldn't be able to use their skills in space. What we're saying is that it's unfeasible to expect that in this game. Again, JTL was intended to be separate from the ground game, thus allowing those people with a CL of 0 to be as effective as someone who's CL is 80. What you are proposing undermines that concept and completely ignores that fact that there's NO such thing as an actual, real-life Jedi. Much as you seem to wish it were different.
Bounty Hunters and ANY other profession should INDEED be able to use their learned skills in space assuming that Jedi were offered the same. Just because the grind you chose for your profession was a bit longer than almost any other grants you no special status over any other player. Concerning the recent changes to your profession's attributes you can no longer utilize the 'Risk v/s Reward' argument either. Jedi is simply another elite combat profession, and to that end deserves no more special treatment than any other.
Exactly how would what work? Precognition in a twitch based game environment? Enhanced reflexive responses to a real-time combat simulation? Why don't YOU explain to us exactly how that would work. I'm sure it would tax your infinitely superior mind not a whit to explain things on a level sufficient for us to comprehend.
Manna wrote:
Alas, I can say that because my self-worth isn't based off of being a fly-boy of a collection of polygons and pixels.
No, your self-worth is quite OBVIOUSLY based at least in part on being a pseudo-mystical shaman/warrior of a collection of polygons and pixels. That's ok, you're a Jedi and we're quite used to that mentality and sense of entitlement that your kind spew on the forums like so much bile.
Manna wrote:
So on to me, due to my work schedule I haven't made Master Pilot yet, but that is a no brainer.
No one's surprised at all. In fact, speaking about precognition, I believe this was in fact discussed earlier today. I DO however look forward to the next excuse, I'm sure there'll be one, if not many.
Manna wrote:
I mean you dont see "Master Pilots" for sale on Ebay because no one would pay more than the cost of the SWG software to play one cause they are so easy to grind compared to Jedi.
Someone else replied to this quite eloquently, I believe with references to the pride we take in our accomplishments (even if in a virtual environment, some things take true skill or at the very least excellent hand/eye coordination). There was a mention I believe, of the lack of 'automated' methods of Pilot advancement. I believe however as another mentioned, that anyone who actively WANTED, and truly had the desire to be a GOOD Pilot, one who was active and participated in the game not merely for a badge wouldn't be interested in purchasing that character, they'd prefer to reach that goal themselves. You see dear Manna, unlike many Jedi, a large number of us seem to understand the axiom, 'It's not the destination, but the journey.'
Manna wrote:
Everytime you all compare your "pilot" importance to the importance of Jedi in the world of Star Wars you show how truely out of touch you have become.
And sadly, every time you argue the overshadowing importance of Jedi, how they eclipse every other profession and all should bask in your radiant glory, you show yours.
There's another equation for you, smartarse.
This is just getting rediculous now. Everyone needs to stop arguing about canon... obviously SOE threw that out right after they wrote down a few names. There is also no point in arguing about what anyone is entitled to since SOE doesn't care what we think. Lastly if anything pilot should be the ones "entitled" to something since all jedi requires is "F1... F2...F1... F2... TAB... F1... F2..." pilot actually requires some real life skill.
Damn... I think I am actually getting tired of flamming these idiots.
I've had enough of reading this troll's stupidity.
Manna, JtL is a twitch based game. Forget everything else, no one, and I mean no one, has any 'special powers' in space. IF, and this is a huge IF, any type of modifiers were to be added to JtL to represent Force Powers, it would have NOTHING to do with what you have asked for. Any possible mods would be based on manuverability, and thus be based on the Vehicle control FS line. Do you even have that FS line? I didn't think so. This would translate to a slight YPR acceleration and ship acceleration boost, and maybe in some wet-dream a hit box reduction modifier and a blaster bolt hit size increase (but that is a really wet wet-dream). That's it, and I don't reasonably believe we will see that in the game. If you were just arguing for that, I don't think the flames here would be half as hot (although they would still be here)... BUT...
But you ask for ground game specials in space: Force Heal, AI, roots (examples taken from your posts). For the sake of your tiny intellegence, I will go through each of the Jedi trees and prove (well, not to you since I don't think you will comprehend) why this will not work.
Lightsaber: All of these specials require a that the weilder use a lightsaber to perform. You are not using a lightsaber in space combat, you are using a ship. Use of a lightsaber while piloting will have the unfortunately affect of slicing a hole in your own ship, thus these specials are not an option. Well, I suppose you could stand on the hull of your ship, but then you are just a stationary target for your enemy.
Force Defender:
- Jedi Innate Armor: Does not work with armor, the plating on a ship can be definated as Armor. Jedi Innate Armor protects the user, it does not protect his vehicle (swoop, speeder, starship) thus would provide no protection in space.
- Jedi State Defense: There are no states in space.
- Dominate Mind: This one could actually be feasible, if you could get within the close range required for the power. Go ahead, get 15m from the gunship and convince the captain he wants you dead to the point that he will chase you.
- Force Aura: Defensive mods have no affect in space, there is no point to this one as it is coded. Second, this protect the Jedi, not his vehicle (see Jedi Innate Armor).
- Force Valor: Requires the use of a lightsaber, please see Lightsaber tree.
- Avoid Incapacitation: This power prevents the Jedi from becoming incapacitated. No where does it prevent the destruction of his vehicle. Umm, ok, so your ship has been destroyed and you are now happy floating in space refusing to re-spawn. More power to ya!
Force Enhancement:
- Force Absorb: There are no blasters that fire concentrated Force, so this would have no affect in space.
- Force Speed: Allows user to perform all combat actions faster in space. Attack speed on the ground is based on equipment and user speed. All attacks in space are based on the mechanical properties of a pilots equipment, how faster a weapon can recharge or a missile launcher can reload. Unless you can somehow prove Force Speed lowers the Base Speed of a weapon, this ability would have no affect in space.
- Force Run: Increases your RUN speed, does not increase your vehicle (swoop, starship) speed.
- Force Suppression: A 'Root' ability, causes a target to not be able to move from a location. Does not prevent a target from attacking. Ground specials such as Roll-shot, Dive-shot, and Charge-shot will allow the target to move slightly. As a root, it 'roots' the target to a location relative to the ground below it. Use in this in space would if anything lock the target pilot to his seat. Locking a targets movement relative to the emptiness of space would appear to beyond to capability of this special. If it was possible, it would be at a painful cost (say 6000 force or more).
- Force Feedback: See Force Absorb.
- Force Armor: See Jedi Innate Armor
- Force Resist Bleeding: You don't bleed in space, well at least not until after your ship has exploded.
- Force Resist Disease: I've heard Space Herpies is nasty, we might want to find a way to get this one to work.
- Force Wave: Slows a target. Does this have any affect on a vehicle? If not, then it is not relevent.
- Force Transfer: I suppose you could transfer Force to your gunner.
- Channel Force: Transfers Health to Force pool. Again, I suppose this one could be doable, but it would pull from your Health and not your Armor or Shields.
- Force Shield: See Force Absorb
- Force Drain: And the point in space would be? You haven't damage your oppenents ship.
- Force Meditate: Requires sitting on the GROUND.
- Regain Consciousness: You do not get incapped in space, you explode. See Avoid Incap.
- Stasis: Unlike Force Suppression, this one could be nasty and do-able. Dazes an oppenent, preventing them from attacking or moving. Has no affect on Vehicles, correct? If it worked in space, it would affectively prevent the pilot from moving inside the ship, thusstopping himfrom changing his heading for the duration: he would continue on his present course and speed, and be unable to pull the trigger to attack, but his ship would still be moving.
Force Healing: These ability all revolve around healing a person's life force and Health. Unless a Force Repair armor or Force Recharge Personal Shield Generator has been added, Force Healing is worthless in starfighter, same as any other healing abilities.
Force Wielder:
- Force Hit / Force Strike / Force Lightning: Due to the powerful nature of the Force, these attack would probably have devisating affects on your ship. Also please note the short range of these attacks.
- Mind Blast: States would have no affect in space, note the short range of the attack.
- Force Cloak: Ok, I'll admit, this one is scary. Question: Does cloak work on your vehicle, if not then please see Jedi Innate Armor. If it does, I would expect a HUGE Force cost.
- Force Intimidate / Force Weaken: States, Space. Got it yet?
- Force Throw: Potential Ability. Note the short range. Note that on the ground there is plenty of stuff to throw. Unless you are parked on an Asteroid, what are you going to throw in space? Also note the State.
- Force Knockdown: State. Space. Only possible affect would be additional G-Forces to the target pilot, but seeing as JtL does not take G-Forces into count, this doesn't matter.
- Force Breach: See Force Absorb.
- Force Choke: Note the short range. Note that health doesn't matter in space, only shields and armor. Now, if you had Force Engine Choke, that would be interesting.
Now, can we please let this thread die?
Manna wrote:
Jedi are to Star Wars as Pilots are to Top Gun
Sorry, it's science.
Message Edited by Thomen on 07-27-2005 02:04 AM
I believe this would greatly reduce the number of Jedi craving powers in the space game
Why did they remove permadeath? I was on a break from game when that happened.
I don't see any problems with letting Jedi's have force powers in space and I think the OP is right that if it's been in the films then it should be in the game. Let's look at the examples shall we:
Episode 1 - Obi-Wan and Qui-Gonn inthe queen's ship (POB?) - pwned by a Trade Federation ship.
Episode 2 - Obi-Wan in his JSF - pwned by Jango Fett in Slave 1
Episode 3 - Anakin in his JSF - pwned by little robots or something - I just remember his ship being disabled but found it hard to be interested or care at the time. Then that jedi master (?) got pwned by clones.
Episode 4 - Darth Vader in his TIE/Adv - pwned by Han Solo in the Falcon (and let's not forget that Luke nearly got shot down by a TIE pilot)
Episode 5 - Luke in his snowspeeder - pwned by an AT-AT.
Episode 6 - Jedi had given up flying because they'd obviously come to the realisation that their powers meant squat in space.
Message Edited by DraconianOne on 07-27-2005 10:47 AM