Musician Archive
Thread: So i got into the village and....
fett3041
Wed Sep 08, 2004 11:47 pm
#27
"You must unlearn what you have learned."
It appears they're taking this seriously with us Entertainers, who are probably the most roleplaying of professions (generally speaking). I'm going to look at this as a challenge. A Trial. A test of my patience and resolve.
I will let go of my anger. I will seek peace. I pray I do not regret my decision.
Echinacea
Thu Sep 09, 2004 5:04 am
#28
NewJedi wrote:
Echinacea, I just found this out the hard way myself. I agreed to do the "patrol" quest on the casual assumption that I'd be able to "unaccept" it later, as almost always is the case with other SWG quests. Unbelievably, I'm stuck with it now! I don't need Ranged Accuracy if I'm going to be a Jedi; I'd much rather have a crafting line. (Although I dunno if I could stand the crafting quest anyway.) I'm sorry, I don't understand why we can't undo our choice here -- or at least why we're not warned. It's extremely annoying.
Personally, I don't see taking Novice Medic for one quest as a "slap in the face." A slap in the face hurts much more. Novice Medics relieve pain, remember?
Yeah, I'm still disappointed that Ents don't get their own quest-giver in the village, but in the long run I don't think it'll matter much. The real meat of getting to Jedi Initiate is still in gaining the XP to fill up those trees. And we are talking a TON of XP. *That* XP *can* be filled up, to some extent, with Ent XP. Get to your Musician cap, dump some XP into the fat Rodian at the village, rinse and repeat. To some extent, you can perform to make progress toward Jedi (or at least toward a FS tree).
I don't think we need a new NPC in the Village to get a mission from...just a modification to the one there. Make that tent to belike a scout camp and have the doctor there tell us to play to heal the mind wounds of the patients as the medics tend to their symptoms. (Since we can't heal fatigue in camps and don't have droids like the medics.) Even being required to play "something soothing like Ballad or Waltz" or to dance "something Popular and upbeat to keep their spirits up" so that we're required to be elite performers, and just anyone with Novice Entertainer can't do it...that'd be fine.
'Course, I'd be happier if we got a droid module that let us heal only Battle Fatigue. Then we could do that out there with the medics using droids like they do, and scout camps would still be useful in the field, and we could actually do our jobs out in the field, and we still couldn't camp the starport with the doctors but...anyway, you know how I feel about that.
It's the requirement to grind out Master Medic that really, really annoys me, especially in conjunction with not being able to ditch the quest when I found that out after the fact. Novice Medic is something I can do since I had to relinquish Master Brawler anyway. Master Medic is not. (Man, I miss my Lunge2, Warcry2 and Intimidate2.)
Echinacea
Thu Sep 09, 2004 3:22 pm
#29
Chalame wrote:
I also think this excuse NewJediintroduced- 'well everyone here should have some sort of combat skills or medic' is total BS. I respect what you do NewJedi, but I completely disagree with you on this one. Entertainers are healers too, and we should be treated as such in the Force Village. It is not engouh that I can just become a novice medic to do the quests because it makes them superficial. This means something to me, and I want to be able to help in a way I feel is helpful (ie. entertaining to heal just like medics grind stims to heal). Don't you think if the Force chooses me, it should be for who I am now, not who I can be if I change myself into a medic? Yes, I have some combat skills, and I don't really need the sense tree to unlock, but that is not stopping me from sounding out against our oppressors. They have seriously wronged us in this one. I have no medic skills, nor do I want medic skills. I don't need the senses tree to unlock, but I feel compassion for the people that do. I feel compassion for the people that are full-time entertainers like I want my alt to be. I am not saying they should be able to unlock with only entertaining stuff, but they should at least get the chance to unlock a branch that affects them (AND WITHOUT HAVING TO BECOME A STUPID MEDIC!)
No Jedi can be unlocked with only one force tree, so naturally people are going to have to diversify themselves if they want to go the distance, but I am diversified, I am a combat player and a master musician, and i should be able toapplyALL of my skills in my path to padawan. So should everyone else.
Don't roll over and die, fight for our right to be a legitimate profession!
-Cian Thurio
Master Musician-Ahazi
I di'n't want to say it 'cause I love NJ. But...yeah. What Cian said! I am diversified, I am a healer...now would one of the **edited** developers realize what they actually created and act appropriate?
I'm tired of being patted on the fanny and told go back into the Cantina and "git me a beer." That's what this sort of regard has always felt like, to me.
NewJedi
Thu Sep 09, 2004 3:36 pm
#30
As I said earlier, Chalame, I agree that it would be better if there were entertainer missions at the village. The other Correspondents and I have all registered objections about this with the devs. They already know we're unhappy about it. The devs have replied to our complaints and given us no reason to believe they plan to change things.There is only so muchI can do. But one thing I can do is ask Musicians how important this is to them, and why, and that's why I'm glad to have this dialog here. I don't see the Village on the top-five lists of more than 3 or 4 players over in my top-five thread.
Personally, I'm not sure that a fifth NPC (or an existing NPC with new Ent-oriented missions) would make our lives as entertainers appreciably better. First, what would such missions look like? They'd require us to visit 150,000 waypoints and play Rock for 10 hours at each without stopping. I don't see entertaining as something to grind. I never did. I leveled up my Musician as a byproduct of playing music, not grinding for grinding's sake. I play, socialize, hang out. To me, that kind of "quest" would suck the fun out of entertaining. I'd rather heal or patrol waypoints. Sure, I'd enjoy doing complex, intellectually challenging missions that mix Musicianship with espionage. But if the devs didn't have the time or resources to develop those kind of quests for the existing types of missions at the Village, it's not reasonable to suppose they'd have done any better for us.
Moreover, insofar as Musicians are visiting the Village to become Jedi, I agree with the poster who says it's reasonable to ask such people to develop some combat or healing skills. In SWG, the Jedi is a combat profession. I played a "Defense" Jedi on TC2, one ofthe least combat-like of them, and it was still all about combat. I'm no expert on continuity, but I've read my share of EU books and seen all the movies twenty times, and Jedi are almost always presented as a combat profession. I have no problem with that conception of Jedi. Your Jedi won't be playing music; it will be wielding a light saber. To retain Music skills and refuse to take Jedi skills is to gimp yourself in PvP and PvE alike: Jedi need every skill point they can get. In any case, Jedi unlocks an alt; *that* person can be the Musician. (That's Aleyo's plan, I think he said.)
The only unfairness to me is to those Musicians who simply want to visit the Village to get the FS skills -- not Jedi. I haven't met any people in the Village who fall into this category, but I imagine there are a few. The trouble is, the FS skills currently grant only ent healing bonuses, right? That to me is the injustice here: why should you grind any kind of mission (ent or otherwise) to get a little more useless wound healing? (You might even argue thatcurrently we heal wounds and BFtoo *fast*, not too slow.) Now, if the skill in question were buffing, then I could understand why people might want to grind it. In that case, then the case for an entertainer-oriented mission would be even stronger.
Finally, I emphasize again the point I made earlier: unless I'm mistaken, the lion's share of time grinding the FS trees is not in doing the quests to unlock trees. It's in gathering the huge enormous piles of XP to fill up the trees once they're unlocked. And you can fill up four trees with entertaining XP. So the majority of your time is grinding away at entertaining, if that's what you want to do.
Banthabutcher
Thu Sep 09, 2004 3:58 pm
#31
Food For Thought:
You can only fill up 16 boxes with Musician/Dancer/Ent Healing/ID XP.
So if you want Jedi, you need to pick up either a Combat or Crafting profession to get the other 8 boxes. They have quests for those.
If you want Jedi, you're going to have to pick up something besides Musician no matter what.
Might be why there's so little Entertainer content in the Village.
Aleyo
Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:06 pm
#32
NewJedi wrote:In any case, Jedi unlocks an alt; *that* person can be the Musician. (That's Aleyo's plan, I think he said.)
No no no no no
.My plan is to unlock the slot, and use the alt to become a jedi, while Scip becomes a pure entertainer (MM/ME/MD, instead of holding on to TKM for money and the occasional hunting fun as I now do). It's perhaps a much more painful plan than the way you propose it, but Scip has his reputation as an entertainer, and I'm not going to give that up
.
NewJedi
Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:22 pm
#33
Aleyo: Erp, now I get it. Gee, you really *are* crazy. 
Bantha: Yep, if you want to be a Jedi, you can in theory grind out 2/3 of your trees by playing Music -- once you've unlocked those trees. You can also grind out the remaining 1/3 by crafting. But let's face it, are those the six branches you want to take with you into Jedi-hood? I played Jedi of various levels on TC2, and over and over again the same skills seemed most useful: melee defense; ranged defense; melee accuracy; assembly; crafting experimentation; and most certainly not musical wound healing. Jedi is a combat profession -- indeed, a PvP combat profession. You get jumped all the time as a Jedi.
Cian's complaint is that unlocking those trees does *not* involve an Ent quest. That's a valid complaint. Believe me, I wish the devs had included such quests. But my sense is that unlocking is just a small percentage of the task. Does anyone yet have a better sense of the numbers? My impression is that you'll spend 10-20% of your time unlocking and 80-90% grinding out Ent XP once you've unlocked. Maybe my estimate is off?
Banthabutcher
Thu Sep 09, 2004 4:46 pm
#34
Heh, and my rebuttal is such: if you have to pick up a non-Ent profession anyways, why devote so much content to it?
If there was a way to unlock soley with Musician XP, as in all 24 boxes, then yes: there should be more content.
But as it is right now, that's impossible. Instead, you have to pick up (A) Combat (B) Crafting.
If you picked...
Combat
You can now do 8 different quests and easily unlock through combat entirely. There's no longer a need to unlock through Musician.
Crafting
You can now do 6 (if the Luck quest is still crafting-related) different quests and unlock through crafting entirely. There's no longer a need to unlock through Musician.
You see what I'm trying to say? The devs probably saw this and decided not to include Entertainer content.
NewJedi
Thu Sep 09, 2004 5:46 pm
#35
Ah, I see your point now. I suppose they made the same calculations about Politicians.
fett3041
Thu Sep 09, 2004 7:44 pm
#36
Politicians already have too much power *rolls eyes at Palpatine* 
I agree with Scip, though... Mo has a rep as a Musician. That's all I ever wanted for him. I always looked forward to unlocking a second character, with which to make a combatant/Jedi. To explore the things that Mo generally would not. I'll probably end up still doing that.
*feels Scip's pain, looking atall that grinding all over again*
Message Edited by fett3041 on 09-09-2004 07:49 PM
Echinacea
Thu Sep 09, 2004 9:18 pm
#37
NewJedi wrote:
The only unfairness to me is to those Musicians who simply want to visit the Village to get the FS skills -- not Jedi. I haven't met any people in the Village who fall into this category, but I imagine there are a few.
/sigh Yeah, this would be me. I have minimal to no interest in actually being a Jedi, either with my main or an alt. I want the second character slot so I can have a pure Entertainer for fun and to help my friends with a non buffbot, and one on the same server so I can go out hunting/PvPing with the same friends without being a complete gimp anymore.
I've had lots of friends who had Jedi. It sounds awful and completely not worth the requisite investment of time.
NewJedi
Sat Sep 11, 2004 2:43 pm
#38
Hey Esharra, I played A Tale in the Desert as well, and I have a character on a trial account in ATITD2. His name is Nefer, and he's hanging out in Cradle of the Sun. Unfortunately, he doesn't get much playtime because of my obsession with SWG...
Back to Jedi: I guess there are more people than I thought in the "just doing it to unlock an alt" category. I talked to a couple more in-game today. Me, I can't imagine doing all that grinding just to get an alt. I'd rather just pay for a second account.
IndySWG
Sat Sep 11, 2004 10:36 pm
#39
Why in the world does musican exp convert to senses if a musican can take those quests.
The DEVs really need to pay attention to what they are doing.
DEVs PLEASE let us start these quests even if we have to group w/ a Doc and have them do our crafting for us... PLEASE.