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Thread: JTL won't save SWG
Awon
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:03 pm
#40
Yeah this game will be a grind but aren't all games grinds to different people and for the that matter isnt life just a huge grind to the end. Its's what you make it out to be in your mind that will determine how fun a game is. I personally think jtl will be a good game but i am moving on to eq2. I found out that I'm more of a fantasy middle ages kind of guy. When playing swg i found most of the players i knew who stuck around are roleplayers. You gotta make it fun in your mind if your gonna enjoy any game at all.
ultakiller
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:14 pm
#41
Well, here is input from a new player... about a month into SWG... I love it... Some folks get bored and Jaded very very quick... I am a powergamer always have, but I have always tryed to spend half of my game time powergaming, and the other half just fooling around and exploring. I visited my friend in austin last night half heartedly suggested SWG to me after I finally became bored with 7 years of Ultima onlines 2d graphics. He has a Dark Jedi knight (minimum ranking possible) and had the JTL invite... he was glued to his seat flying some of the harder missions, and it was me who pointed out to him, " Dude, I think you are still having fun with SWG, regardless of what you might tell me on the phone"... He smiled, "Yeah, I guess all those endless nights of grinding to get back lost Jedi xp kinda took something out of the game for me"...
Now he is happy that when the game goes live, he can pvp on the ground with his Jedi, and when he wants a little break from gank squads and constant pvp, he can get in his ship and just run a few mid level missions as a privateer... he also told me just how cheap it would be for a normal player to get a newbie ship just to stop wasting money on shuttles...
No more shuttles is enough of a reason for me towanna buy it.
Anything is going to get boring if you keep repeating it. I got tired of the FS grind, and was ahead on xp, so I started the hero of tatooine quest, and visited the mos espa race track for the first time.
I wasnt aware the SWG needed saving, dont we have like 500,000 subscribers from all over the world? or at least 250,000 ... at 15$ a month and only one year in, I think thats a big success...
I hope players leave for EQ2 and WOW to be honest with you, I hope the DEVS go into overtime to make SWG even better to get those customers back when they get tired of that grind. But I wanted to play a good space game since day one and as far as I am concerned SWG is it. There is no substitute for Playing a Jedi, standing in front of Jabba the Hutt, of bobba fett... Seeing Darth Vader... And now we get to pilot ships as well.
I hope they have the Deathstar as an IMP base for us to attack and them to defend... and then give REBS the planet of Hoth to defend from space...
I cant be the only one who isnt missing the sheer beauty of this game!
Now he is happy that when the game goes live, he can pvp on the ground with his Jedi, and when he wants a little break from gank squads and constant pvp, he can get in his ship and just run a few mid level missions as a privateer... he also told me just how cheap it would be for a normal player to get a newbie ship just to stop wasting money on shuttles...
No more shuttles is enough of a reason for me towanna buy it.
Anything is going to get boring if you keep repeating it. I got tired of the FS grind, and was ahead on xp, so I started the hero of tatooine quest, and visited the mos espa race track for the first time.
I wasnt aware the SWG needed saving, dont we have like 500,000 subscribers from all over the world? or at least 250,000 ... at 15$ a month and only one year in, I think thats a big success...
I hope players leave for EQ2 and WOW to be honest with you, I hope the DEVS go into overtime to make SWG even better to get those customers back when they get tired of that grind. But I wanted to play a good space game since day one and as far as I am concerned SWG is it. There is no substitute for Playing a Jedi, standing in front of Jabba the Hutt, of bobba fett... Seeing Darth Vader... And now we get to pilot ships as well.
I hope they have the Deathstar as an IMP base for us to attack and them to defend... and then give REBS the planet of Hoth to defend from space...
I cant be the only one who isnt missing the sheer beauty of this game!
TheRealXur
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:36 pm
#42
Xodus316 wrote:
I played the beta for JTL for a week, and pretty much stopped playing it. In my opinion, JTL is a really crappy version of freelancer. Freelancer wasn't a great space sim, it was good, but not great like X-wing series or Wing Commander III and IV.
Joysticks really aren't needed in the game. I found it easier to use the mouse than a joystick. I got a good joystick, Saitek X45, used it for the first couple space missions, then discovered that there is no real benefit. With the mouse you can maneuver your ship just as well as with a joystick, due to the odd physics system JTL uses.
AI wise, the AI is rather stupid. 2 AI ships, they fly past you, and turn, and stay in formation. All you have to do is turn around, and start shooting and you'll kill both. 3 AI ships 1 will tend to break off from the other 2, and try to circle behind you. The only difficult part in the game is when you are chasing ace pilots and the AI manages to get behind you with say a Y-Wing and it starts shooting off missiles like crazy.
Graphics are a lot worse than I expected. Space itself is rather beautiful, the nebulas are especially nice, but that is pretty much the only impressive things. Ships themselves are fine, though Star Wars ships aren't exactly flashy to begin with. Laser fire looks terrible, shooting from say a tie fighter, the 2 lasers come out looking like a chunk of 3 connected lasers, really aweful.
Overall I feel this is just another boring grind. It takes all of 2 minutes to figure out how to lead a target properly, and after that it is just holding down the fire button, turning, holding down the fire button again, going to a waypoint, firing, turning, firing, on and on and on.
If you like flight sims, and quality space sims, chances are you are going to be very disappointed in this game. There is little challenge against AI opponents, combat requires little tactics, and frankly it gets boring very quickly.
I think the only thing that *might* save SWG is a working GCW and balanced combat. If they can pull at least one if not both of these off before new years, the game might bounce back. But I doubt they'll even get one of them done. JTL is only going to distract people for so long.
TheRealXur
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:42 pm
#43
neinnunb wrote:
I agree with "JTL won't save SWG" but in a different sence. The original poster bashed JTL but I dissagree 100% in his comments.
JTL in itself is a wonderful add-on to swg. It is a great foundation for more things to come in space. We now will live in a "complete" game where we finally havethe STAR in Star Wars. The sence I am agreeing tois that JTL does not fix any of the ground problems and unbalances to the combat professions, so it does not "save" swg in that way. The fabled Combat Revamp and GCW Revamps are what will save (or not) the game.
As I said, we now have the STAR... we just need the WARS.
Exactly.
Couldn't have said it better.
Message Edited by TheRealXur on 10-21-2004 11:43 PM
CyberData4
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:42 pm
#44
No, JtL won't save this game. But it can't honestly hurt it. I think the games in good enough shape to ship.
Let's be honest people.....the game isn't dying, but the ground game is in horrid shape. The only real thing that can help the game is the combat revamp. That's the only thing that will hold players in long term.
TheRealXur
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:46 pm
#45
CyberData4 wrote:
No, JtL won't save this game. But it can't honestly hurt it. I think the games in good enough shape to ship.
Let's be honest people.....the game isn't dying, but the ground game is in horrid shape. The only real thing that can help the game is the combat revamp. That's the only thing that will hold players in long term.
Population, at least on Scylla has never been this low. You can wander countless player and static cities and they are all ghost towns. Only place you are still sure to see people is Coronet and Theed pretty much. Frequently people in Tyrena I guess too, since it's the default on the travel terminal. The game my night be "dying" but it's not in great shape either.
/crossfingers
I hope we see a Combat and/or GCW Revamp for Christmas!
fatgato
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:50 pm
#46
I gotta agree........
People that might want to be ship wright........... millions of units of resources to grind, lack of being able to mass produce things, having to hand grind majority of hte componets necessary.
Space was well empty and devoid of any real content.
Same old thing go here shoot that , escort this guy, scan that ship.
While very pretty , I will give the art Dept that for sure.
The overal game play was boring and tiresome, the grouping is ridiculous with broken formations, unable to see members, exploits that HAVENT been addressed and has existed for over a month at least. That have been /bugged and even Pm to devs, and I even included how to do it step by step, and it still exists.
JTL is a Half azzed attempt at trying to make Star wars happen, for those who are big continutiy freaks, well get readyt to scream even mroe. So many thing out of place it will make your head spin and you will spit green pea soup.
The so called indestructable yacht can be destroyed, the ejecting and getting caught in the cut scene still there, I have had all my ships bugged so that ship would go through process to launch and CTD. I have been able to duplicate the bug and again /bugged it and well still there.
The game is going to be released into the populace and will infect the ground game and cause many more bugs. Then the devs will focus on fixing the space game , because this is a new expansion and with all new expansion they want to at least make it for for hte first couple weeks.
So my suggestion ,dont waste your money at least not yet.
Vicotnik
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:51 pm
#47
It's not dying, but it's bleeding profusely. The bleeding being people leaving the game.
The questions are: How many people just stayed with SWGin anticipation of JTL? How many of these people will leave when they find out JTL is not the big Messiah of SWG?
CyberData4
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:54 pm
#48
Population, at least on Scylla has never been this low. You can wander countless player and static cities and they are all ghost towns. Only place you are still sure to see people is Coronet and Theed pretty much. Frequently people in Tyrena I guess too, since it's the default on the travel terminal. The game my night be "dying" but it's not in great shape either.
/crossfingers
I hope we see a Combat and/or GCW Revamp for Christmas!
Perhaps I should re-phrase that. I use the term "dying" in the sense that SOE/Lucasarts would shut down the servers. An MMO doesn't need many people to turn a profit each month. Not with each player paying $15 a pop. With that said, the game is in a current state of decline. I don't think anyone can deny that. Players are fed up and down right bored with the simplistic nature of combat. I give crafting in this game much respect, it's an amazing system. But the current combat system has thrown everything off. From group PvE to the economy, the combat system has let this game down a spiral of exploits and blatant design flaws.
Jump to Lightspeed will be a breath of fresh air for many subscribers that are gasping for new content. But JtL won't be near enough.
CyberData4
Fri Oct 22, 2004 1:47 am
#49
Seriously, I'm not saying it's a better game, but City of Heroes had the perfect launch. The Beta of City of Heroes ran smoother than SWG does now. The only problem with City of Heroes is how repetetive it gets. With 1 character here in SWG, I can build droids, tame creatures, play music, hunt, and run a vendor. It's that kind of stuff that made me come back after I cancelled my account.
I play CoH casually, when I get angry with SWg, lol. And I can say this, what is lacks in broadness, it makes up for in polish. The combat system in that game is so simple yet so vastly more complex than this games system. It's nice when grouping give an xp bonus, or to have instanced content.
rubella13
Fri Oct 22, 2004 2:11 am
#50
And in response to another poster... putting the STAR in Star Wars is pretty much almost all I needed. Now I have the choice to play the ground game, or go up in space and blow things up. It's like 2 games in 1, and that kicks @$$. I am definatley anticipating it, even if I don't get it the first day it comes out.
JTL is not ready for release........
This is not the ground game, some pilot trainer missions can not be completed thus forcing players to resign and start fresh with new trainer.
Some ships can not be damaged except from the front or rear only even though hits on shields show.
The attitude that is can be fixed in live to meet a deadline will be the final straw for many.
Planetside another SOE game did something simular with thier first expansion, know what happened?
A month later they had to consolodate the servers because so many people quit the game.
People really like the idea's in the game, but borked ground combat, Extream amounts of exp and time to gain Jedi, a system that forces players to become defense stackers to compete ect......
I simply see a consolodation happening before the end of the year.
Nacoa
Fri Oct 22, 2004 2:17 am
#51
rubella13 wrote:
some pilot trainer missions can not be completed thus forcing players to resign and start fresh with new trainer.
Then /bug it. They're fixing missions every patch. Oh, a mission being too hard to solo is not a bug.
Some ships can not be damaged except from the front or rear only even though hits on shields show.
This has always been incorrect. There was a bug in the target rectile where it was too far behind because of lag. They've adjusted it and it's far better. Since it isn't an invunlerability bug, you could always kill ships from the top/bottom, you just had to know where to aim.
The attitude that is can be fixed in live to meet a deadline will be the final straw for many.
These "many" have obviously not been paying attention to the rate at which the devs are fixing things. There's no bug I'm aware of that can't be fixed in a couple days, much less a week.
Message Edited by Nacoa on 10-22-2004 05:17 AM
fatgato
Fri Oct 22, 2004 2:23 am
#52
The sad part is SWG has so much potential , but it always falls short of delivering. I was in SWG beta and didnt like it one bit, so I didnt start playing SWG till april of this year. There were major improvements for sure , but still the game lacks real meaningful content. Now JTL will be released bug ridden like the main game. The system will be flawed, and people will get upset. My accounts go up for renewal in nov and I dont think i will , JTL and the Mythic Combat Balance was only thing I could think of that could possible save the game.
JTL falls short, and we havent seen or heard anything about CB, sad part is we will have master pilots in about 1 week to maybe 2 weeks. the system isnt that hard to get up in levels. I tested for month and half , and well let just say game is not anywhere near ready.
Look at what the pub 11 patch did to the servers, look at the problem with the launchpad.... We have to run in compatiblity mode just ot make it work, why cannot they make something that works?? Windows xp has been out for How long?? Do you honestly think that if they cannot get a launch pad to work correctly , that they can make a full expansion pack work ?