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Thread: The Petition For an Alternative to Forced PvP for Mastery
DaMidge
Thu Oct 21, 2004 6:39 pm
#27
Just for clarification for a few people 
There are only a few people that reached 4444 pilot and got to master missions in beta. There was a consensus formed among those that made it (a vast majority) that this is a bad idea.
If you want to master (and i know some of you posting that this is ok think you will) you will have to kill 30 rebel high level ships or 30 high level ties to pass misson 1. If you die or leave for repairs you WILL fail and have tro restart at 0. To kill 30 ships takes at least 3 hours if you are disconected or if the server crashes you WILL restart at 0.
Now on to the PvP part. Targeting is still a work in progress as is situational awareness it will take 1 hit from an opposing player to cripple you enough to restart your mission.
The reason so many of us are wanting a change is that you are doing a PvE mission in a PvP environment were a fraction of a second error over a 3 hour tour kills all work you do.
Now let me answer the solutions offered:
group up: Wont matter u get hit you are done you cant repair in kessel AT ALL.
Be aware: You cant at least not yet you can watch the radar but it doesnt stop that 1 hit when you dont see it coming.
Ask your self this do you know any griefers on your respective servers? Well you can garuntee they will be sitting in kessel waiting to shoot you not because it gets them anything but because it prevents you from getting anywhere. So you kill them, they dont care they will repair and return in minutes to do it again. What if there is a group of them.
Would you enjoy killing 30 enhanced klikniks to master any combat profession if the Geo caves werew a PvP arena??
Sadly this will take you seeing it for yourself as we have. Wait till you kill 29 ships have one left and a missle hits you (because after 3 hours you have no counter measures left and no way to reload) I garuntee after the first time you will be screaming on the forums for something to change. I will watch the boards in about 3 weeks to see how many of you have truely seen it for yourselves and had a change of heart.
Oh and lastly I guess that lvl 8 9 10 equipment and multiplayer ships arent whats being paid for by the vast majority? Last time i checked PvP was in the minority not PvE.
Kelko
Thu Oct 21, 2004 7:11 pm
#28
I understand the fustrations of those in this situation, however my choice is not to master and be put in that situation. It's not a debate as to whether or not the system sucks (which clearly it does), It is a debate as to whether or not it is "forced" PvP and the fact that we all have a choice to pursue master or not negates any argument that this is forced PvP. And as for the analogy of the combat profession there is a distinct difference in that and the pilot; pilot doesn't actually cost any skill points to advanced where as all other professions do.
DaMidge wrote:
Just for clarification for a few people
There are only a few people that reached 4444 pilot and got to master missions in beta. There was a consensus formed among those that made it (a vast majority) that this is a bad idea.
If you want to master (and i know some of you posting that this is ok think you will) you will have to kill 30 rebel high level ships or 30 high level ties to pass misson 1. If you die or leave for repairs you WILL fail and have tro restart at 0. To kill 30 ships takes at least 3 hours if you are disconected or if the server crashes you WILL restart at 0.
Now on to the PvP part. Targeting is still a work in progress as is situational awareness it will take 1 hit from an opposing player to cripple you enough to restart your mission.
The reason so many of us are wanting a change is that you are doing a PvE mission in a PvP environment were a fraction of a second error over a 3 hour tour kills all work you do.
Now let me answer the solutions offered:
group up: Wont matter u get hit you are done you cant repair in kessel AT ALL.
Be aware: You cant at least not yet you can watch the radar but it doesnt stop that 1 hit when you dont see it coming.
Ask your self this do you know any griefers on your respective servers? Well you can garuntee they will be sitting in kessel waiting to shoot you not because it gets them anything but because it prevents you from getting anywhere. So you kill them, they dont care they will repair and return in minutes to do it again. What if there is a group of them.
Would you enjoy killing 30 enhanced klikniks to master any combat profession if the Geo caves werew a PvP arena??
Sadly this will take you seeing it for yourself as we have. Wait till you kill 29 ships have one left and a missle hits you (because after 3 hours you have no counter measures left and no way to reload) I garuntee after the first time you will be screaming on the forums for something to change. I will watch the boards in about 3 weeks to see how many of you have truely seen it for yourselves and had a change of heart.
Oh and lastly I guess that lvl 8 9 10 equipment and multiplayer ships arent whats being paid for by the vast majority? Last time i checked PvP was in the minority not PvE.
Rashyaak
Thu Oct 21, 2004 7:56 pm
#29
There is no forced PvP in JTL. Like this other guy keeps saying, you make the choice whether or not to master in your chosen pilot field. Personally, I'm happy with reaching a high level pilot, not master, then using my twitch skills, not stupid skills granted because you killed 50 billion Ties. If you are honestly a good pilot, then you don't need huge ships to have fun. TBH, if some of my friends played SWG, they could probably figure out a way to fly around in an uber souped up Z-95, and be able to take down Corvettes. That's what's so cool about JTL. Even the novice player with a somewhat good ship can beat a master pilot, if they have the twitch skills.
Anyway, back on subject. The PvP isn't forced because you ARE making the decision to try to become a master pilot.
Thank you, and goodnight!
Rashyaak
TheRealXur
Thu Oct 21, 2004 8:48 pm
#30
I begged in beta, I'll beg here. Please guys do something about this.
Valancey
Thu Oct 21, 2004 8:51 pm
#31
Rashyaak wrote:
There is no forced PvP in JTL. Like this other guy keeps saying, you make the choice whether or not to master in your chosen pilot field. Personally, I'm happy with reaching a high level pilot, not master, then using my twitch skills, not stupid skills granted because you killed 50 billion Ties. If you are honestly a good pilot, then you don't need huge ships to have fun. TBH, if some of my friends played SWG, they could probably figure out a way to fly around in an uber souped up Z-95, and be able to take down Corvettes. That's what's so cool about JTL. Even the novice player with a somewhat good ship can beat a master pilot, if they have the twitch skills.
Anyway, back on subject. The PvP isn't forced because you ARE making the decision to try to become a master pilot.
Thank you, and goodnight!
Rashyaak
Oh really? It isn't forced PvP? So you're saying the game isn't forcing me to PvP to become a master pilot? Master pilot opens up multiplayer ships, not just deep space. Also, as a dev, do you really want people QUITTING because they're getting griefed trying to do master missions?
TheRealXur
Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:04 pm
#32
Valancey wrote:
Rashyaak wrote:
There is no forced PvP in JTL. Like this other guy keeps saying, you make the choice whether or not to master in your chosen pilot field. Personally, I'm happy with reaching a high level pilot, not master, then using my twitch skills, not stupid skills granted because you killed 50 billion Ties. If you are honestly a good pilot, then you don't need huge ships to have fun. TBH, if some of my friends played SWG, they could probably figure out a way to fly around in an uber souped up Z-95, and be able to take down Corvettes. That's what's so cool about JTL. Even the novice player with a somewhat good ship can beat a master pilot, if they have the twitch skills.
Anyway, back on subject. The PvP isn't forced because you ARE making the decision to try to become a master pilot.
Thank you, and goodnight!
Rashyaak
Oh really? It isn't forced PvP? So you're saying the game isn't forcing me to PvP to become a master pilot? Master pilot opens up multiplayer ships, not just deep space. Also, as a dev, do you really want people QUITTING because they're getting griefed trying to do master missions?
It's useless to argue with people, might as well use this threed to simply state "Yes I agree" or "No I do not". The people that are telling you to not worry about it are the very same people that will master the first week and camp kessel so they can kill every pilot that doesn't have near the skills or equipment they have.
And even if you manage to kill them, they'll be back less than 5 minutes later to stop you from doing your missions and playing the game you paid for yet again, because that's why they bought the game. So they can beat up on people at a disadvantage.
drolhtis
Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:28 pm
#33
pvp in space is fun......very fun!
that being said...i can see this being "griefing" central for all those 12 year old aces thall be out there soon enough...just wanting to be little punks.And thats not to say there arent moron adults either...
For thefirst fewpeople maybe even first 50-100 people itll be ok...then you gonna have these people that think its fun to ruin others missions...and prolly live there doing it...
you know who i mean..the guys that hang around mission terms in bestine or Just outside AH..."to be fair to rebel scum"
thats where its goin..ill post this in beta too....
Vicotnik
Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:39 pm
#34
If you honestly believe that people are going to settle to stop at 4-4-4-4 with ABSOLUTELY NO content to do, then you are delusional. It's forced in the sense that it IS part of the only professions that does give you access to JTL space basedcontent. And I do not at ALL understand why people are arguing against this. What do people have to gain by seeing loads of PVE only players in a PVP zone? Easy targets?
Rashyaak wrote:
Anyway, back on subject. The PvP isn't forced because you ARE making the decision to try to become a master pilot.
Vicotnik
Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:49 pm
#36
LordVader27 wrote:
Since when has the NDA been lifted?
Go ahead and flame me.
Since today!
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=lightspeed&message.id=110467#M110467
Too lazy to do a clicky...
Message Edited by Vicotnik on 10-22-2004 06:51 AM
Einarr99
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:39 pm
#37
/SIGN
For all those people who say they dont care.
Hows about in the combat revamp they made it so ALL master professions were only unlockable by pvp?
Your not FORCED to pvp if you want to be a master weaponsmith you can choose not to be?
See the point the original poster is trying to make?
Forced pvp is bad.
Vital missions in greif zones are bad.
Trashawn
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:41 pm
#38
There are noTEFs in space, the only way for players to PVP in space is tobe overt or /duel. if you are covert you can do your missions without having to deal overt players shooting you down even if your shooting down your opposing NPC faction. NO PVP is forced on you.
Message Edited by Trashawn on 10-22-2004 02:43 AM
Vicotnik
Thu Oct 21, 2004 11:48 pm
#39
Trashawn wrote:
There are noTEFs in space, the only way for players to PVP in space is tobe overt or /duel. if you are covert you can do your missions without having to deal overt players shooting you down even if your shooting down your opposing NPC faction. NO PVP is forced on you.
Message Edited by Trashawn on 10-22-2004 02:43 AM
Wrong. There is another way: Enter Kessel.
You can't do the master missions without entering Kessel, so you will have to deal with players attacking you.
Message Edited by Vicotnik on 10-22-2004 08:48 AM