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Thread: Master level missions: a SOLUTION to make everyone happy.
Slarus
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:14 am
#274
Why shall i still play JTL if they take out Kessel? Sure, there is still one PVP zone, but that isn't enough in my view. Declaring faction and going ouvert sucks! After i turned Master Pilot there is nothing left to do for me but PVP. PVE gets pretty boring then, coz it is always the same. It is more interessting to match your skills with other players. And i dont want to declare a faction for it. IfIam a smuggler andneutral i would hate it to be forced to choose a side. And that would be the only possibilety for me if they turn Kessel into a PVE System.
DEVS: LEAVE US OUR PVP KESSEL SYSTEM! PLEASE! WE HAVE ENOUGH PVE SYSTEMS!
Being forced Overt sucks, but that's ok right? I dont give a rat's @$$ about being challenged by some hotbox punk with the need to boost his ego, I dont care, I dont want it, but you want prey not a challenge. PvE excites me, I love it. Declare Overt it is simple and easy it gives you 10 PvP zones not 2, more PvP for you, PvP that is willing.
Zhiv
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:18 am
#275
Thunderheart wrote:On Tuesday, we will be seeing some changes here:
Re: Master level missions: a SOLUTION to make everyone happy.Kessel becomes a PvE zone Master Pilot Boxes can be attained without PvP Message Edited by Thunderheart on 11-09-2004 05:11 PM
Well, hope you folks are happy.
I think that the ACE title should be aquired in a PvP zone only.
So now we are gonna have a bunch of whining crybabies because they can't be Ace unless they nerf the PvP zone.
Grow up. Life is full of things you can't have. Deal with it. I was looking forward to having a dozen npc's and even more players trying to shoot me down while I attain the uber title of 'Ace Pilot'. But now you whining crybabies got your way.
So be happy.
Losers.
Deadlyblue3
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:20 am
#276
Re: Master level missions: a SOLUTION to make everyone happy.
On Tuesday, we will be seeing some changes here:
Kessel becomes a PvE zone
Master Pilot Boxes can be attained without PvP
On Tuesday, we will be seeing some changes here:
Kessel becomes a PvE zone
Master Pilot Boxes can be attained without PvP
Thanks for listening to the community again in making the game weaker. It was nice to have challenges.
/kudos
Cutedge
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:20 am
#277
Zhiv, you hadn't tried it so you didn't know how it was. I was in favor of it until we tried it and I realized that there was no way we'd complete it unless we retried it again when no other players were around.
It's a solid idea in concept. Heck, it's an awesome idea in concept, but in practice it allows a handful of players to keep practically everyone else on the server from getting their master box.
Slarus
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:21 am
#278
No proof that PvP is more or less difficult? Yeah, that's why people are shouting for a damage reduction. The same ships that take a pounding from the NPCs crumple in far fewer shots from a player. No proof that PvP is more or less difficult? Yeah, that why the AI you find so challenging will sit there attempting the impossible: outturning a ship that has yet to be outmaneuvered for the last 10 shots. While it's hyper-intelligent allies 1.5k away sit there turning in circles, waiting for the next player to come shoot them.
That just proves PvP is a matter of simple placement and luck not skill. You still have shown no proof, just conjecture. PvP as is right now is simple, much easier then PvE. You get the first shot you win, end of story that is not hard in 3-d space.
Slarus, you're nothing but a closed minded bigot. You don't like shooting your fellow players. Fine and dandy. That's a preference.
I'm a bigot cause I want everyone to be able to choose PvP, that's a new one I thought a Bigot was someone who discriminated against one group, I want all to choose not one to be forced. Ok well thank you for showing me the new meaning of bigot.
But no AI can come close to the ingenuity, adaptibility and even sheer ruthlessness of another player.
Basides being your opinion, I dont care that has nothing to do with being forced to PvP in a consentual PvP game, nothing.
Stick with your preference because I can guarantee whatever skill you may think you posses, they're woefully inadequate against someone who learned flying against someone that has the capacity to figure out "Well maybe flying in a big circle constantlywon't lose that A-Wing on my tail".
Thanks I will and so will everyone else now, because we ALL have the power to choose.
Scoooter
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:22 am
#279
Personally I think that 90% of people would be happy with Kessel the exact way it is when a pvp reduction is in place.
The real issue people have is the disparity between NPC and player combat and PVE and PVP in that zone
The gank squads did this.
Combat witha tier 5 NPC should be relative to the player as far as damage results. Since you cannot kill a tir 5 NPC in one shopt you should not be able to kill a plyer in one shot.
If you poll most people I bet you would see that PVP in kessel is not the real issue its the disparity in damage. Which is causeing little kiddie gank squads to deliberaly find people engaged with tier 5 NPC's so they can gank in one shot so they can give there infamous /tell of "pwned joo".
Unlike filght sims we have shoelds and armor that should mean something but they do not mean anything in pvp at the moment.
truewildman
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:23 am
#280
Cutedge wrote:
Zhiv, you hadn't tried it so you didn't know how it was. I was in favor of it until we tried it and I realized that there was no way we'd complete it unless we retried it again when no other players were around.
It's a solid idea in concept. Heck, it's an awesome idea in concept, but in practice it allows a handful of players to keep practically everyone else on the server from getting their master box.
Did you take 10 or more with you? Spend about an hour on the ground prior to plan and strategize? Did you spend any time doing what a Mater Pilot would have done?
If you did, great. But, I have yet to see a bigger group than 3 or 4 in Kessel.
Cutedge
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:28 am
#281
truewildman wrote:
Did you take 10 or more with you? Spend about an hour on the ground prior to plan and strategize? Did you spend any time doing what a Mater Pilot would have done?
If you did, great. But, I have yet to see a bigger group than 3 or 4 in Kessel.
Wetook 15. How would strategizing for an hour help? We assigned who was doing what. I, for example, was on the gunboats. We were calling out names of the enemy players in group chat and people were on it. I have to admit, it was pretty fun for the first few minutes. I was thinking "wow, you know this is pretty cool". I expect something similar to happen on the ISD runs. However, after 5 or 10 or 15 minutes it became clear that we had no chance. We kept killing the people (and to be honest, CU put up a good fight) but they kept coming back and we were so occupied on that that we couldn't even graze any of the targets we needed to.
15 people were kept from doing the mission by a group of 4 or 5. When you can come back in a minute completely repaired, that's the result.
Message Edited by Cutedge on 11-10-2004 12:30 PM
xtxShifter
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:45 am
#282
Cutedge wrote:
Zhiv, you hadn't tried it so you didn't know how it was. I was in favor of it until we tried it and I realized that there was no way we'd complete it unless we retried it again when no other players were around.
It's a solid idea in concept. Heck, it's an awesome idea in concept, but in practice it allows a handful of players to keep practically everyone else on the server from getting their master box.
Would it have been better if player damage was similar to that of a Tier5 NPC?
Cutedge
Wed Nov 10, 2004 11:56 am
#283
xtxShifter wrote:
Would it have been better if player damage was similar to that of a Tier5 NPC?
In a word, yes.
Rhysen
Wed Nov 10, 2004 12:03 pm
#284
Slarus wrote:
No proof that PvP is more or less difficult? Yeah, that's why people are shouting for a damage reduction. The same ships that take a pounding from the NPCs crumple in far fewer shots from a player. No proof that PvP is more or less difficult? Yeah, that why the AI you find so challenging will sit there attempting the impossible: outturning a ship that has yet to be outmaneuvered for the last 10 shots. While it's hyper-intelligent allies 1.5k away sit there turning in circles, waiting for the next player to come shoot them.
That just proves PvP is a matter of simple placement and luck not skill. You still have shown no proof, just conjecture. PvP as is right now is simple, much easier then PvE. You get the first shot you win, end of story that is not hard in 3-d space.
Slarus, you're nothing but a closed minded bigot. You don't like shooting your fellow players. Fine and dandy. That's a preference.
I'm a bigot cause I want everyone to be able to choose PvP, that's a new one I thought a Bigot was someone who discriminated against one group, I want all to choose not one to be forced. Ok well thank you for showing me the new meaning of bigot.
But no AI can come close to the ingenuity, adaptibility and even sheer ruthlessness of another player.
Basides being your opinion, I dont care that has nothing to do with being forced to PvP in a consentual PvP game, nothing.
Stick with your preference because I can guarantee whatever skill you may think you posses, they're woefully inadequate against someone who learned flying against someone that has the capacity to figure out "Well maybe flying in a big circle constantlywon't lose that A-Wing on my tail".
Thanks I will and so will everyone else now, because we ALL have the power to choose.
"PvP is just a matter of simple placement and luck not skill"? Last time I checked, the autopilot only flew me from Point A to Point B. I've yet to program it to maintain a chase position so I can make deflection shots. And the AI target's entire evasive maneuver package consists of "Keep turning in this circle...maybe he'll get lost". Whereas a player will actually do strange things like...oh, change direction? Change velocity? Lead you into the sights of his buddy who is not ignoring the dogfight taking place 1.5k from him?
That's why you're a closedminded bigot, Slarus. Your hatred of PvP fully distorts the facts. Need another example? The Master Pilot mission isn't a PvP mission under the current implementation, yet your hatred coloring your perceptions makes you see it as one. There's no guarantee that when entering the Kessel system that
- Another player will even be there
- Another player will actually engage you in combat
It's closeminded "I paid my $29.95 and that entitles me to everything in this game and if it's too hard to get I'll whine on the forums till the developers make it easier" that pooched Jedi and combat in general. You don't want a challenge. You want someone to reassure your flagging ego by giving you challengeless goalsto achievesimply by paying them a flat rate per month and wasting hours doing the exact same, unchanging routine. Because the AI doesn't change. It doesn't improvise. It doesn't adapt. It just turns in the same circle till it gets blasted to dust.
Now you can pretend that your monthly subscription means you actually have some skill in a game where player skill is supposed to matter.
Cutedge
Wed Nov 10, 2004 12:11 pm
#285
The idea that if there's other players there, they'll attack you and continue to come back to attack you and therefore if there is another player is there, the best solution is to leave and try the mission again to see if there's no one there is a clear indicator of the problem.
You know what would make the mission doable (besides damage reduction)? A timer that doesn't allow you to re-enter Kessel for 2 or 3 minutes after you are killed. It's not a matter of not having the skill to fight off the enemey. It's a matter (for me) of the impossibility of fighting off captiol ships which an enemy who can kill me in one hit comes back every minute. With the quick respawn that the Imperials get since they can get fast repairs, it faces the Rebellion pilots with an impossible challenge. If they came back in a group every 5 or 10 minutes, it wouldn't have been as bad. However, it was a matter where when we took out the last enemy player pilot, the first one we killed was already back.
Having to fight off enemy players during master missions: A good idea in concept, but an utter aggravation in implementation.
Naquiel
Wed Nov 10, 2004 12:12 pm
#286
Cutedge wrote:
xtxShifter wrote:
Would it have been better if player damage was similar to that of a Tier5 NPC?
In a word, yes.
Yes that is one of the big things the devs really havent addressed right in pvp in this game. The devs have not even tried to adjust pvp combat to make it worth wile, on the ground or in space, and to push out jtl without adjusting pvp in space is a big oversite, now if the devs say that there waiting for the combat balance on the ground i would like to piont out that space is a different system than on the ground and could of been done right befor jtl launched.
I like to pvp every once in a wile, but getting killed in 1-2 shots is not fun. Now if getting killed or killing someone in a heated battle that lasts as long as fighting a tier 5 npc, then im all for it to. And if pvp is adjusted right, then ppl would not mind having pvp as a option and having a mission in a pvp area woud not be an issue.