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Thread: An attempt at reasonable pricing JerGo Spacecraft Sales Ship Pricing/Resource Info. NDA Lifted
Obemi wrote:
Ok then, makes sense,but what exactly makes these resources worth 5-20 (or possibly even more)times the cost of grinding stuff? You still have to survey for a good spot of grinding stuffright?Surely the prices on shuttles hasn't gone up that much recently, and you can't be telling me thats all labour costs.
Zelos1 wrote:
No, Obemi, but it does require an awful lot more time committed to the task, as you have to be one of the first people to find the spawn and get your harvs on it before the rest of the server does. There's a lot less competition for 0-star or 1-star resources.
Of course, shipwrights won't be able to mine all their own resources anyhow, they'll eventually be buying. A 50-lot mining operationwould be able to keep up with a SW's demand for the first month, but it certainly can't be done with an 8-lot operation. While many have stocked millions of resources in preparation, the bottom line is those resources are a finite supply and will eventually be used. At that point,they will need to be able to recover market costs of resources if they want to stay in business.
Ok, so they'll be buying. But why would a mining operation charge SO much more than anormal resource? If mining is all they do then time doesnt come into it because the dont have anything else to do. Shuttle cost aretiny anyway. You dont need anything other than Artisan x-x-x-4 or Master to survey sothey can pick up a combat profession to help out on those nasty planets. Cost for harvs maybe? But they only cost .75cpu max to run from what I've heard. Power? Surely they can mine their own power if they are a mining corp.
I understand your point about having to buy the resources, but I cant see why anyone would need to charge that much for them.
Obemi wrote:
Ok then, makes sense,but what exactly makes these resources worth 5-20 (or possibly even more)times the cost of grinding stuff? You still have to survey for a good spot of grinding stuffright?Surely the prices on shuttles hasn't gone up that much recently, and you can't be telling me thats all labour costs.
Yes and no on that.
In theory, you can put just as much work into finding the best grind spot as possible. In practice, that's not generally done. People pick a convenient spot, put down their harvestors and just mine any resource that spawns underneath the harvesters. You can do this if you don't really care what you are getting, type, quality, etc. It's all resources and you turn around and sell them at 2-3 cpu. Very, very little effort and very practical for cross-server lot trades (the owners never have to log in to move the harvies) - which in many minds is sort of like cheating.
Also, for crafters, remember that they can't just take whatever happens to be spawned at the moment. They have to stock their good resources to ensure they always have "Kiirium Steel" or whatever, even if it isn't currently minable. Since there's no absolute way to predict when this stuff will spawn, there's no real limit to how much a crafter wants to stockpile. They may have to go 1 week without mining a certain resource ... or they may have to go 3 months if the market demands that it be a 2-3 star resource. So when these 3-5 star resources do spawn, it's natural for the crafters to want to get a 3 month supply out of a 1 week spawn. THIS is what drives the price up.
pneumonic81 wrote:
i want to add as a blanket statement, if shipwrights got factories like every other crafting profession prices might not be this bad. at leats not for standard items. the fact i have to hand craft each and every time that i put on my vendor means i have to spend all the time in front of a crafting station. beleive it or not that time is worth alot more then the resources we dump into it.
dont beleive me? try shipwright for yourself
But the difference is, I wont be producing on a large scale commercailly. Only personal craft and anything a guildy wants.
) on a much larger scale.Message Edited by pneumonic81 on 10-26-2004 07:35 AM
Not being a miner, I can only speculate, but I assume its just a matter of supply vs. demand. If harvesting quality resources was less dull, more people would do it and prices would drop. The trouble is that its even MORE annoying than grinding solo group missions. As you noted, the skill point investment to survey is fairly small - a Novice Artisan surveys as well as a Master Artisan, just over a smaller range so they have to stop to scan more frequently. Any new player can pick up 6 personal harvesters and a pair of wind generators and launch their own business for 15 skill points - but it feels more like work than a game to do (after the first week or so, when it's still pretty cool).
Obemi wrote:
Ok, so they'll be buying. But why would a mining operation charge SO much more than anormal resource? If mining is all they do then time doesnt come into it because the dont have anything else to do. Shuttle cost aretiny anyway. You dont need anything other than Artisan x-x-x-4 or Master to survey sothey can pick up a combat profession to help out on those nasty planets. Cost for harvs maybe? But they only cost .75cpu max to run from what I've heard. Power? Surely they can mine their own power if they are a mining corp.
I understand your point about having to buy the resources, but I cant see why anyone would need to charge that much for them.
Zelos1 wrote:
Yes and no on that.
In theory, you can put just as much work into finding the best grind spot as possible. In practice, that's not generally done. People pick a convenient spot, put down their harvestors and just mine any resource that spawns underneath the harvesters. You can do this if you don't really care what you are getting, type, quality, etc. It's all resources and you turn around and sell them at 2-3 cpu. Very, very little effort and very practical for cross-server lot trades (the owners never have to log in to move the harvies) - which in many minds is sort of like cheating.
Also, for crafters, remember that they can't just take whatever happens to be spawned at the moment. They have to stock their good resources to ensure they always have "Kiirium Steel" or whatever, even if it isn't currently minable. Since there's no absolute way to predict when this stuff will spawn, there's no real limit to how much a crafter wants to stockpile. They may have to go 1 week without mining a certain resource ... or they may have to go 3 months if the market demands that it be a 2-3 star resource. So when these 3-5 star resources do spawn, it's natural for the crafters to want to get a 3 month supply out of a 1 week spawn. THIS is what drives the price up.
DingoBoi wrote:
with a shortage of resources in the galaxies... ie: tried buying steel lately?... these higher 5cpu price is realistic. I'll be charging that at a minimum. You can't afford that? Fine, bring mesome raw resources.. harvest them yourself and I'll be happy to make you a discounted ship.
I'm thinking I'll be offering that model as well. Back towards the start of the game several architects took pity on me and offered those terms. Time to "pass it on", I think. Shipwright is more "hands on" with the customers than archi, I think it makes a lot of sense.