Jedi Archive
Thread: [Proposal] Lightsaber: Redefining an Art
slippinghalo
Sun Jul 17, 2005 6:35 am
#66
BDragon wrote:
I have always been a MLS, since converting to it when Pub9 went live. For me nothing about Jedi matches the grace and prowess of a true Saber Master. With this said, I have always wanted something more from the LS tree, even more so since CU hit. I find LS to be somewhat disappointing from both a RP and from a balance perceptive. Here is what I would like to see LS become (please no power Jedi flames, this is one mans dream for his favoured mastery, nothing is stopping you from creating your own).
N.B. I will only list changes to skill boxes, to make life easier. Anything not listed will remain the same.
Novice Lightsaber:
Title granted: Apprentice Lightsaber Duelist
Skills granted: Saber Armourbreak
Lightsaber form Shii-Cho (no bonuses or penalty, can be used with all sabers)
SaberMelee block +10 – This mod works on the same diminishing returns formula as armour. It determines your chance to block an incoming melee attack. A successfully blocked attack will have its damage reduced by 20%. If a block is successfully made, there is another roll made to determine if a lock is forced with the attacker. If a lock occurs, both players will get a bar with a sliding marker and a hit-zone. The objective being to stop the marker in the middle of the hitzone before the timer runs out. The player who comes closest will win the lock and perform a follow-up attack.
Knockdown follow-up attack – This proceeds a successful win in a lock and ignores the KD timer. Can be performed with all sabers
One-Handed Lightsaber 1:
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +1
One-Handed Lightsaber 2:
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +2
One-Handed Lightsaber 3:
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +4
One-Handed Lightsaber 4:
Title granted: Makashi Saber Master
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +6
Lightsaber form Makashi - This form focuses on lightsaber to lightsaber combat (+15 1 handed LS accuracy, +15 1 handed LS speed, - 15 Saberblock)
Disarm follow-up move – This move slices the hand of the attacker, preventing them from making another attack for 5 seconds. Can only be performed with 1 handed LS
Two-Handed Lightsaber 1:
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +1
Two-Handed Lightsaber 2:
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +2
Criple strike – This attack lowers the defence of the target by 80
Two-Handed Lightsaber 3:
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +4
Two-Handed Lightsaber 4:
Title granted: Shien Saber Master
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +6
ImprovedCriple strike – This attack lowers the defence of the target by 250
Lightsaber form Shien - This is a more aggressive variation of form III (+10 SaberMelee block, +15 Lightsaber Reflect, +15 2 handed LS acc)
Crushing strike follow-up move – This powerful attack is performed after deflecting the enemies attack. Can only be performed with a 2 handed saber.
Double-Bladed Lightsaber 1:
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +1
Double-Bladed Lightsaber 2:
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +2
Double-Bladed Lightsaber 3:
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +4
Double-Bladed Lightsaber 4:
Title granted: Ataru Saber Master
Skills granted: SaberMelee block +6
Lightsaber form Ataru - This flamboyant style uses the force to enhances all movements (+15 General melee accuracy, +15 general melee speed)
Startling Strike follow-up move – This flurry of strikes leave the target stunned, blinded and dizzied, while dealing moderate damage. Can only be performed with a Double-Bladed saber.
Lightsaber Techniques 4:
Title granted: Soresu Saber Master
Skills granted: Lightsaber form Soresu - This is an ultra defensive form and cannot be used with a polearm saber ( +15 SaberMelee block, +15 Lightsaber block, +25 melee and ranged defence, -15% damage)
Lightsaber Duelist stance – This stance increases the defence of the Jedi ( + 150 melee and ranged defence)
Master Lightsaber:
Titles granted: Juyo Saber Master, Lightsaber/Darksaber Master
Skills granted: Lightsaber form Juyo – A combination of each form before it, blending them into one true form ( +15 SaberMelee block, +15 general melee speed, +15 general melee accuracy)
Improved Saber armourbreak
Improved Lightsaber Duelist stance – This stance increases the defence of the Jedi further (+250 melee and randged defence, +15 Lightsaber reflect)
Deathstrike follow-up move – If target is at 15% health or below, they are reduced to 0
Conclusion
As you can see, I have removed break from 2 handed to reduce the imbalance it creates by being there. The replacement move will still insure a 2 handed user hits for more damage than any other (due to lower targets defence and power attack) and all Jedi now have the first break.
A 1 line LS dabbler would have +23 Meleeblock without the use of stances, giving them 20% chance to block an incoming melee attack and reduce its damage, this number reaches 50% at MLS. This creates a situation where every box is of benefit.
Regarding the saberlocks. The greater your number for saberlock skill, the slower the cursor for your target will move. This means that a 2line LS player would have a cursor that moves faster than a MLS. Both players have equal chance to win, but the master would have an advantage in this situation, due to not needing as fast reaction speed. Twitch gaming will now come into LS combat.
The Lightsaber Duelist stance would allow MLS without defender to reach the defensive benefits of the basic Aura. This is a number great enough to allow a pure damage dealing template to have some viable defence within the sphere of melee combat, without becoming overpowered in anyway. This stance will serve to compliment the Meleeblock feature of LS and provide all LS users with limited damage reduction on incoming melee attacks, as all melee sets should include if they are to be viable within close combat.
These changes are all intended to make LS combat more interesting and involving, as well as giving the set more balance and bring it closer to what we know and love of Star Wars. As a side note, Powers will gain a balancing advantage when facing LS, because their damage cannot be effected by Meleeblock and therefore they avoid both the damage reduction for a successful block, but also the possibility or a lock and follow-up attack.
Message Edited by BDragon on 07-07-2005 06:14 PM
saber is fine the way it is worst idea ever jedi finally do not need mls to be worth a damn and people like you cry enough we will be gimped without master saber sry i got beetr templates to play without wasting skill points to get mls
BDragon
Sun Jul 17, 2005 11:24 am
#67
slippinghalo wrote:
saber is fine the way it is worst idea ever jedi finally do not need mls to be worth a damn and people like you cry enough we will be gimped without master saber sry i got beetr templates to play without wasting skill points to get mls
Ok, that really made me laugh. Saber is fine the way it is? You mean *4** is fine, where you can have that 1 line and remove a mastery of defender armour while also having the strongest attacks, right? You're a joke. What part of this proposal gimped anyone who isnt MLS? All LS users now get damage reduction, all Jedi got follow-up moves, a master has more chance to block melee yes, but all Jedi still get to react to a lock. The only difference is no improved break for dabbles and if you feel that is a nerf and gimping you, then you're on crack and im glad you think its the worst idea ever.
Go and ask a master power Jedi if he feels 1 line countering his entire 89sp is balanced. *4** LS is no different and i dont care how many 0404 LS users try to defend it, anyone with eyes can see that 28sp to cancel 89 is not balance. You have the nerve to say im crying? When i propose changes that improve the whole of LS and make it more in line with Star Wars? Crying sounds like "i got better templates to play without wasting skill points to get mls" because MLS might actaully end up better than your 0404 LS + speed FotM dabble.
Anyway, at least i got to laugh at you for a few minutes...
KiIIgore
Sun Jul 17, 2005 6:10 pm
#69
I have read Ep 3 as well, good book.
However I think your Idea has too much emhasis on making master sabers equal to a defender and making it so that if you want to dump points elsewhere you can.
I also wish we had different styles, but I disagree with armor break being moved.
this is like TKM and Fencer crying that swords should loose AB and they should get it.
Basically it is like this:
1 handed sabers = ellegance / finesse ... hence DOTS etc.
2 Handed sabers = Power hence ability to break armor, and have a wound up hit. (power attack)
polearm = style, 2 areas of attack hence Area Attack
Master = all three, so you get all 3 plus bonuses.
I am fed up with people complaining about stuff they don't get cause they chose something else.
I am 2 handed sabers, and I wanted area, so I got dualbladed and lost SAP and Meditate in turn.
People need to quit complaining because their template they chose is not better than the other one.
Jedi varied in strength, abilities, styles etc. A master healer is just that, a HEALER, NOT A DAMAGE DEALER !
ENHANCER is to counter FORCE POWERS
POWERS is to control the force
Lightsabers varied per style.
GET OVER IT.
We need more styles, but not more nerfs. Thats it.
Lockly
Sun Jul 17, 2005 8:00 pm
#71
Thats by far the best, most thought out, and rewarding system I have seen on these forums regarding the "lost" art of a saber weilder.
Good job mate, extremely well done....you listening biacca??Devs?? anyone??
Redbull111
Fri Jul 22, 2005 7:42 pm
#73
best Idea I've ever seen, lightsabers are meant to be defensive weapons especially for light jedi, our current tree lacks the defense it should. jedi should all around be more about the lightsaber than it currently is. it is only 1 5th of jedi, there are all these crazy skill trees for enhancing and powers and basicly our combat system is whoever has the most minor enhancements wins (foods, buffs, jedi enhancements) oh and lets not forget macros, this tree would make macros almost useless in jedi vs. jedi...this lightsaber tree would put the skill back in skill tree and perhaps the one with the best strategy would win rather than the most buffed. you have my sig and you are a wise man 
RedbBull -- Novice Jedi
BDragon
Sun Jul 31, 2005 9:50 am
#77
Ok, seeing as somebody mentioned this in their post, here it is for everyone to read