Jedi Archive
Thread: Experienced Jedi against snare.
Skipperino
Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:47 pm
#66
I have fr1 in my temp but my friend is mls mdef healer 4040 and she just saber kd's them till shes close enough and does sap
Kal_Choedan
Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:51 pm
#67
Well I guess the only thing you can do is try and use line of sight. Walk into a dip and hope it blocks their view. Failing that as it stands there is nothing that can counter 80m paralise.
XenosAllus
Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:53 pm
#68
Saber KD has a 32m range, how would they get that close?
And if they did get that close, the MCM could just stand up paralize them, reapply snare and move off, I've done it on TC2.... killed a melee pike doc twice running without having to stim or heal once, mind you they don't have a 32m kd but I didn't have ranged arms and wouldn't have had any trouble staying 32m away.
-Xenos Allus
tej434
Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:53 pm
#69
Well, it really depends on how "out in the open" you are. The majority of planets do have trees, ridges, other "natural" things that can break line of sight. I would definitly recomend using them as you would in an urban setting. Also, remeber this, if a BH snares you and then is staying 40m away from you he cannot re-apply snare from there. Once you notice his snare about to run out and you notice him comming in closer to reapply it I would root him and let it run out.
Of course the BH has the advantage of suprise and will get the first shots off, but you will be able to survive until that wears off, once he comes in your range to re-apply his debuffs take full advantage by chaining your roots and snares and timing your KDswell. Some well say timming your KDs doesn't make sense because you're probably just spamming saber throw over and over. But more than likley that is doing no good anyways, you're not going to kill a bh with saber throw, or drain his mind if he knows anything about what he's doing. Best bet is to save your force (saber throw does eat force) and wait until you have an upper hand.
Orthell
Thu Oct 13, 2005 12:55 pm
#70
Skipperino wrote:
I have fr1 in my temp but my friend is mls mdef healer 4040 and she just saber kd's them till shes close enough and does sap
When the BH has a 64-80m range and there is NOTHING a Jedi can do over 32m, and the BH keeps the Jedi rooted without ever coming within 32m, then how can that work?
That is the problem, the permasnare is an instant "I Win" button now.
WookieOgre
Thu Oct 13, 2005 1:30 pm
#71
MickGrey wrote:
In the post-ToOW system, will BHs be able to track a Cloaked Jedi or not? (When I say "track" I really mean "any method of identifying exactly where the Jedi is, either by /follow, dorking around with Shadow settings, or Seekers).
The answer to this question determines my choice of tactics. For example:
Scenario 1 (BH cannot track Cloaked Jedi)
1. BH approaches and I forget to /forcerun away from him before he gets to his maximum kiting range (65m without cyber arms, 80m with arms).
2. BH applies a snare.
3. I am now unable to close the distance to counter with my own snare. I am doomed.
4. Instead of curling up on the ground in a fetal position, I Cloak.
5. With patience and luck, I close to my 32m range while Cloaked. The BH cannot track me while cloaked so I walk to him at a snail's pace until the Snare wears off.
6. Once the BH Snare wears off, I close to my saber's 5m range. I decloak and apply a /forcewave snare as my opening move.
7. If the BH replies with a knockdown, allowing him to move beyond my 32m range, once I /knockdownrecover I repeat with step 4.
Scenario 2 (BH can track Cloaked Jedi)
1. BH approaches and I forget to /forcerun away from him before he gets to his maximum kiting range (65m without cyber arms, 80m with arms).
2. BH applies a snare.
3. I am now unable to close the distance to counter with my own snare. I am doomed.
4. Instead of curling up on the ground in a fetal position, I Cloak.
5. The BH uses his tracking ability, points and laughs at me.
6. The BH asks one of his buddies in guildchat to hop on his speeder and go to just under 32m of my location... when his buddy arrives, my Force pool will begin to drain due to the Cloak.
7. The BH and his friend wait until my Force pool runs dry and I automatically decloak.
8. I die.
Now, Scenario 2 isn't quite as bleak as the above until the Ranger revamp. Once the Ranger revamp happens, I will always be snared when I Cloaked, so either escape or closing to 5m saber range would be impossible if the BH can track Cloaked Jedi.
So, to avoid total doom, I propose the Jedi community insists that either the snare on Cloak NOT be implemented, or the Devs guarantee the BHs will have absolutely no way to track a Cloaked Jedi.
Comments?
You will be able to track a Cloaked Jedi as you do now on live (droids included). Nothing is changing cloak until the ranger revamp comes out.
MickGrey
Thu Oct 13, 2005 1:56 pm
#72
OK...
So before the Ranger revamp happens and Cloak becomes an automatic snare, I can just Cloak and /forcerun away until the TEF wears off and I can enter a building. If the BH decides to hop on his bike and pursue me, then its just a matter of finding a building before my Force pool runs out.
In the post Ranger revamp world, I'm pretty much screwed. (I'm assuming /forcerun while Cloaked will have no effect). Cloak was my ace in the hole for survival due to only having post-CU Pearls in my saber.
So before the Ranger revamp happens and Cloak becomes an automatic snare, I can just Cloak and /forcerun away until the TEF wears off and I can enter a building. If the BH decides to hop on his bike and pursue me, then its just a matter of finding a building before my Force pool runs out.
In the post Ranger revamp world, I'm pretty much screwed. (I'm assuming /forcerun while Cloaked will have no effect). Cloak was my ace in the hole for survival due to only having post-CU Pearls in my saber.
WookieOgre
Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:01 pm
#73
MickGrey wrote:
OK...
So before the Ranger revamp happens and Cloak becomes an automatic snare, I can just Cloak and /forcerun away until the TEF wears off and I can enter a building. If the BH decides to hop on his bike and pursue me, then its just a matter of finding a building before my Force pool runs out.
In the post Ranger revamp world, I'm pretty much screwed. (I'm assuming /forcerun while Cloaked will have no effect). Cloak was my ace in the hole for survival due to only having post-CU Pearls in my saber.
Yep, Cloak atm will be the escape tactic to use. That is until the Ranger revamp (rumored to come Dec or Jan)
Bunklung
Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:17 pm
#74
WookieOgre wrote:
MickGrey wrote:
OK...
So before the Ranger revamp happens and Cloak becomes an automatic snare, I can just Cloak and /forcerun away until the TEF wears off and I can enter a building. If the BH decides to hop on his bike and pursue me, then its just a matter of finding a building before my Force pool runs out.
In the post Ranger revamp world, I'm pretty much screwed. (I'm assuming /forcerun while Cloaked will have no effect). Cloak was my ace in the hole for survival due to only having post-CU Pearls in my saber.
Yep, Cloak atm will be the escape tactic to use. That is until the Ranger revamp (rumored to come Dec or Jan)
What happens when you stack two snares together? Every tried to stack two AI's? It's a self root. When you are snared and you cloak (after the ranger revamp) you will be self rooted, snare+snare=root. The BH doesn't have to guess or track you. He knows exactly where you are for the next two minutes, because you never left. I Guess you could ALPHA strike the BH if he's withing 32m once E Drain goes away. I myself will use nades, stasis, and cloak from now on until I can use FR3 as INTENDED.
MickGrey
Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:29 pm
#75
Bunklung wrote:
What happens when you stack two snares together? Every tried to stack two AI's? It's a self root. When you are snared and you cloak (after the ranger revamp) you will be self rooted, snare+snare=root. The BH doesn't have to guess or track you. He knows exactly where you are for the next two minutes, because you never left. I Guess you could ALPHA strike the BH if he's withing 32m once E Drain goes away. I myself will use nades, stasis, and cloak from now on until I can use FR3 as INTENDED.
If the BH snared you and then you Cloaked, and in the post Ranger revamp era you're rooted as you say, then when the BH Snare goes away and you can move again (although at a snail's pace), the chances are slim to nill that the BH will be within our 32m "Alpha Strike" range. As soon as we're rooted, the BH will certainly move outside our 32m range since he can track us.
If the BH is really smart, he'd have a pair of cyber arms on and would move to 66m-80m away to remove the chances of us pulling out a rifle when we decloak.
I suppose if you're not too partial to your robes or wearing a jacket, you could get a pair of cyber arms too and even the odds a bit (although you won't have the ranged skill mods your opponent will likely have). But then that'll go away in the following nerf when Jedi abilities won't work if we're not holding a lightsaber.
/is suddenly reminded of the South Park episode where George Lucas is protected by a bunch of squad of goons wielding... walkie talkies.
XenosAllus
Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:35 pm
#76
The "Rancor Aid" def to EDrain
Chef made on TC2
14 Filling
1 min duartion
+0 speed bonus
Heh, yeah
-Xenos Allus
Message Edited by XenosAllus on 10-13-2005 02:36 PM
TrogdorrtheBurninator
Thu Oct 13, 2005 2:57 pm
#77
you guys do realize that force wave is getting this bonus aswell as supression... u can pretty much STOP a BH from even moving, ur cool down for supression is less than the root timer.... WHEN u get him close, keep him rooted
MickGrey
Thu Oct 13, 2005 3:07 pm
#78
TrogdorrtheBurninator wrote:
you guys do realize that force wave is getting this bonus aswell as supression... u can pretty much STOP a BH from even moving, ur cool down for supression is less than the root timer.... WHEN u get him close, keep him rooted
Understood. The question is: CAN we close to /forcewave's 32m range or not? If the BH can snare us from 80m out, then the 48m "range gap" between our 32m and his 80m will be a big problem. This "range gap" exists today, but presently a Jedi can close this gap via /forcerun or /burstrun, which will not be possible after ToOW.
I just saw the post about a new food or drink (I don't remember which) on the Beta server that resists Electrolite Drain. That's a step in the right direction, but I'm concerned about the 14 filling and in light of the 1 minute duration. Sooner or later my stomach will fill up and then it is back to "Scenario 2". Plus, it isn't clear to me if the food/drink resists the CM E Drain only, or if it also resists Carb/Rifle snares.
Message Edited by MickGrey on 10-13-2005 05:09 PM