Jedi Archive
Thread: Why has the Jedi profession come to this point!?
I would argue that the producers of this game care too much about whatplayers think they want. Most players have no idea what they want. Thats why the majority of complaints on these forums are vague cries of "WHY DONT TEH DEVZ FIX US?!". I hope one day the producers have a vision for what the game is and work towards that vision.Relying on the whines and cries of players that can't even formulate what it is exactly they are upset about hasn't been making the game better.
frequence wrote:
we were promised and told so many things since launch. countless things. to many to list here. devs dont give a f**k. they tell us something we go cool and then the act like it was never talked about.
one thing i have learned in the last years is
DONT TRUST THE DEVS.
they play with us.
whats left of the swg i started in?
my char name is the only thing they didnt touch.......yet
Tanks wrote:
Interesting, the correspondents have been having a discussion about this very thing. Here are my thoughts on this subject.:
IMHO, all the non-PvP Jedi have hurt the profession immensely. They have wanted faster and quicker access to Jedi (the village, and easy experience). They have wanted faster and quicker way of leveling their Jedi (no visibility in groups, and group exp. ease in spin groups). They have wanted the BH missions to be less effective (Move Jedi missions to MBH, no names, and no bounty amount tied to Jedi's levelon terminals). They wanted it to be less risky to be a Jedi (no Saber TEF, no skill loss etc.).
They have gotten all that. As a result the profession itself has gotten nerfed to hell and back, and it is no longer an elite-elite profession that is hard to get, hard to level, and risky to boot. Therefore, the power of the profession has been curtailed to fall in line with other elite professions.
I gotta disagree with you Tanks. The 'I Owned You' jedi are the ones who got the profession in the spot its in today. The ones how all gravitate to one power, abuse the crap out of it, then subsequently get it nerfed.
I also don't think the village was at all a part of the problem. The village slowed the process down if you ask me, cause you had wait on the phase shifts as opposed to just grinding professions. 12 weeks for the village? I know many who knocked the holo grind out in a lot less time.
LostCause21 wrote:
/frowns
What you say is so truthful it hurts to read it due to the fact it curses the way things are now. I loath what we have become. I dispise how things are. I'm a die hard starwars gamer and seeing how this has turned out is far more than an insult. I can't even describe the words I feel when I think of how this game is from what it was ...or what it should be. If it wasn't for the few freinds I have left in this game I'd be gone. For those that like the way things are and continue to break down the Jedi from what they should be. The only respect you'd get from me in this game is a /ignore /ban from city response. If I would of known how Jedi would of turned out I would of gladly given my jedi permadeath in an honorable fashion. We are but decaying shadows of our former selves. (Thinks about when yoda went into exile/hiding). Guess he knew something we didn't.
I can feel your pain bro.......we all love STAR WARS and this game was more fun to play pre-cu . Sure it was a frickin hassle to get mind buffs all the time ..but you have to admit that it was unique!
My view is that there are not too many of anything on any server......the SOE staff has made poor decision after poor decision!
Stop nerfing anything because you percieve someone to have an advantage.
Life is not equal ...nor should this game be!
Make jedi much stronger again and then stop making stupid changes!
KRAKEN666 wrote:
we think of this game as a game, the devs, producers, and soe think of it as a business....thats why nothing will ever work the way its supposed to. we have the spirit of the game at heart, they just have the money at heart.
The developers aren't that stupid. They know that they can make more money if they keep the game running over a long period of time, and while they may lose a percentage at first due to some changes people don't like, they'd keep more long term thanks to fixes that actually are better for the game.
What happened to the Jedi profession?
I'll tell you - YOU DID. (And that's a generic "you").
You ruined this profession when you threatened to SUE because you couldn't be a Jedi out of the box. You ruined this profession when you screamed and cried and wailed that perma-death was unfair, that experienceloss wastoo high and on and on and on.
Once upon a time, a Jedi character WAS powerful. Could they take on an entire city? NO - but then how many times have we ever seen that happen in cannoical references anyway? The point is that they WERE powerful. Very powerful compared to a standard character.
It's a very simple equation kids: ultimate RISK = ultimate REWARD.
It was stated that some would like to see perma death come back (along with the power), while others think it should only apply to Jedi vs Jedi deaths.
You OBVIOUSLY weren't around to see the original Jedi, because you have no freaking clue what you're talking about. If you had one of the "old school" Jedi and died to a Bounty Hunter, you deserved it. You didn't die because he "owned" you, you died becaus you ****** up - you died of yourown stupidity.
But then, there we go - everyone wants the "ultimate reward" without the "ultimate risk", truth be told. And god FORBID anyone be forced to play their character intelligently, but that's a whole 'nother rant.
What's more, you wouldn't even HAVE to hard cap Jedi numbers. Just re-instate the 3 death (perma death) system and boost Jedi power. Fact is, you'd see the numbers of 'higher than padawan' Jedi thinned out so quickly it'd make your head spin... and that would go a loooong way to fixing the whole problem.
Why won't this happen? Because after you lost your Jedi character you'd scream and cry and stomp your feet at the idea of having to start from scratch- and then cancel your account.
That's right... you subscription = $. So what happened to Jedi? You did.
/rant off.
Message Edited by BadKarma777 on 09-27-2005 04:24 PM
Message Edited by LandonRyuu on 09-27-2005 02:32 PM
Actually, under the vision of the original system, you were going to be allotted one death.
The other two were comensation for deaths incurred beyond your control, such as lag.
~ And you though 3 deaths was harsh. You should have read the original proposals on the pre-beta boards then...
again though it'srisk vs. reward not grind vs. reward.
Message Edited by LandonRyuu on 09-27-2005 02:39 PM
Message Edited by LandonRyuu on 09-27-2005 02:40 PM
No, instead, there were talks of Jedi being difficult. Difficult to get, difficult to level and difficult to maintian.
Ironically, it's one of the few promises SOE delivered on... originally.
At any rate, my rant is off my chest and the rest of this discussion is fated to devlove further, so I'll take my exit now before they reach that state.
~ Peace
Tactical_Dave wrote:
Padawans are not meant to be the alpha class any more (and shouldn't be, by definition IMHO). The alpha class will be a small, controlled number of players, a.k.a. Knights and above. The alpha, 1.5x, uber players will be in-game again someday (soon?)
If you look at the evolution of the Jedi class in the game, the FRS was designed to limit the uberness of Jedi from the get-go, yet still make it possible for a select few. That's why padawans have been nerfed so much. The devs realized a lot of people wanted to be Jedi, so they make it possible. But they also make it more difficult to achieve, and they still aren't much stronger than a standard template elite player. When Knights return, I am confident that all the lost skills/abilities will be returned to those who work hard for it and gain it through competition (PVP).
I am sure this will lead to a lot of bitterness and envy, because the power-grinders always seem to get the best stuff in the game. That's not the devs' fault, though. They have to set up a balanced game-mechanic. It's up to the players to figure out who become the top bananas in the game.
And as far as 'DEMANDING THEY DO WHAT THEY PROMISED', you should re-read the disclaimer on the game box, website, logon screen, etc. Gameplay will change. And NOTHING is guaranteed. Just like real life.
i dont mind the idea that padawans will be more on par with regular players and that knights and masters will be the real alpha class, but if they make it based on pvp then they are going to have to balance the jedi professions amongst themselves. if they dont, then the jedi council will be populated by mls/mdef templates and maybe an occaisional fluke something else. powers will be extremely gimped by the commonness of force-redirection attacks in the lower enhancer boxes. defenderless temps are seriously gimped. healer, mostly unnecessary aside from 4/0/0/0. if its jedi against jedi to fight for superiority, then we will see very little variety amongst jedi templates. that is, assuming that they do nothing to resolve the current imbalances.
im not saying that there arent any good pvp jedi templates other than mls/mdef templates, just that there are inherent imbalances in the skillsystem that gives a massive edge to a few skill sets and a singular playstyle. and of course, it all comes down to player skill ultimately. yet in a highly competitive environment, youre going to discourage the use of a less than ideal template. its unavoidable.
unless something is done.