Jedi Archive
Thread: Fixing the FRS
Benpimpin
Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:12 am
#40
I don't think FRS mods should help every template, keep it so the light and dark get specific mods for certain skills, if they choose to do something different then so be it, they'll still see bonuses just not as much as certain templates.
RedDragon133
Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:13 am
#41
one matter still remains due to the changes in TEF system, which is to come:
gang squads still remain within the FRS. one BH will lead a group of overt players to the target. he will not attack. 20 overt players gang any smaller group. Where is the fun of this???????? what real benefits do I might possibly gain?
and now, though it is within the system and working as supposed, farming FRS XP on roofs, need to bribe in order to stay within the rank...
come on this is a game and gaming is supposed to be fun. SOE started to make this game fun, but seems to stop at the endgame. If I ever need any sort of bullying, bribing and corruption, all I need to do is take a look at my newspaper. thank you very much, I do not like it in game.
I must admit, the FRS seemes do be fun at first. The guy who developed this was seriously thinking about this and the idea was good. I supported this system in P9 testing very hard. the problem is what certain players have done out of this. it seems to draw in scum of the galaxy as nightinsects to a lamp.
gang squads still remain within the FRS. one BH will lead a group of overt players to the target. he will not attack. 20 overt players gang any smaller group. Where is the fun of this???????? what real benefits do I might possibly gain?
and now, though it is within the system and working as supposed, farming FRS XP on roofs, need to bribe in order to stay within the rank...
come on this is a game and gaming is supposed to be fun. SOE started to make this game fun, but seems to stop at the endgame. If I ever need any sort of bullying, bribing and corruption, all I need to do is take a look at my newspaper. thank you very much, I do not like it in game.
I must admit, the FRS seemes do be fun at first. The guy who developed this was seriously thinking about this and the idea was good. I supported this system in P9 testing very hard. the problem is what certain players have done out of this. it seems to draw in scum of the galaxy as nightinsects to a lamp.
Damon123
Sat Feb 12, 2005 5:18 am
#42
Dear SonGouki,
while I can second most of your ideas, they have several shortcomings:
1. Your idea of FRS-Kill-List would severely hamper the Jedi on low-populated servers. Having a timer of three days, and a list with 100 spots, while there are basically only 1-2 JKs of opposing faction that are onlkine at a regular basis, is reducing me to zero FRS XP again (at your suggestion, I am rank 4=2400 XP maintenance in 3 days, so I could get 2400 FRS XP in 3 days if I can kill ONE AT ALL). And, btw, PvP is DEAD, so advancing in it is IMPOSSIBLE.
2. WHY IN HEAVEN do I have to kill as a light Jedi at all for any other purpose than to DEFEND? I am a killing machine by now and I am sick of it.
3. QUESTS -WE WANT QUESTS. Give us some content, some stuff to keep us busy AND that throws out FRS XP.
4. Force mods are broken. Enough said.
5. Advancement to highest rank should take at least 180 days.
6. Some reward for every rank would be nice as well (like a special color crystal, maybe one of those antidecay-kits or whatever. Maybe even robes with mods on them?
D.
P.S.: BTW, Master Defender and Master Powers are only gimped against Master Enhancers, and only if those know what to do. They rip master healers quite easy.
JemyM
Sat Feb 12, 2005 6:15 am
#43
Ok, im going to get a 1-star here, but I do not care. I speak up for a large portion of ignoredplayers in SWG when I speak, and I am willing to take the fall.
First of all, the content of your posts are great SonGouki. FRS in its current state needs to change, alot.
but...
but...
Since when did Gruntslead the Jedi Knights?
I am not a Grunt. My template is a pure assist template, extreme in its ability to defend and make others stay alive. To assist/support is my role in SWG.
Why should I not be able to gain ranks after I become Jedi Knight, just becouse I cannot kill? Why would the top-ranks of the Light Jedi host a bunch of blood-thirsty barbarians instead of peaceful defenders?
Ido not play this game to be aQuenker to other players
As an easy target, the proposed changes would make me a grinding creature for half of the server.
I want to explore PvE with friends, and forced-PvP of this scale would completely ruin my game.
Why is the FRS exclusive to the PvP club?
I have played this game as long as the PvP Jedi, why should all thiscontent be exclusive for them, inaccessible for us that simply do not want to PvP? Even as a PvE Jedi without intention to NEVER attack another Player, should eventually have the chance to become a Jedi Master, to have a goal to aim for after the Jedi Knight trials.
Lastly, the connection Jedi =PvP must go
I have no interest in PvP whatsoever and I will never freely participate in any hostility against other players. I also feels it to be unethic to attack other players that have not declared that they want to participate in PvP. To become a Jedi is for many a flavorbased choice, a way to pursue their dream character, not a way to reveal themselves as a PvP player. Many Jedi are simply in this game to explore PvE with friends, and PvP is very unnappealing to us. There are plenty of competitive games out there to play, but very few games where co-operation against computer generated opponents is in focus.
For all thoose gamers that started to play this game to avoid the massive hoard of Counter-Strike games that dominate the PC market, all Forced PvP in this game MUST GO.
I have played this game as long as the PvP Jedi, why should all thiscontent be exclusive for them, inaccessible for us that simply do not want to PvP? Even as a PvE Jedi without intention to NEVER attack another Player, should eventually have the chance to become a Jedi Master, to have a goal to aim for after the Jedi Knight trials.
Lastly, the connection Jedi =PvP must go
I have no interest in PvP whatsoever and I will never freely participate in any hostility against other players. I also feels it to be unethic to attack other players that have not declared that they want to participate in PvP. To become a Jedi is for many a flavorbased choice, a way to pursue their dream character, not a way to reveal themselves as a PvP player. Many Jedi are simply in this game to explore PvE with friends, and PvP is very unnappealing to us. There are plenty of competitive games out there to play, but very few games where co-operation against computer generated opponents is in focus.
For all thoose gamers that started to play this game to avoid the massive hoard of Counter-Strike games that dominate the PC market, all Forced PvP in this game MUST GO.
Message Edited by JemyM on 02-12-2005 02:18 PM
yourshepherd
Sat Feb 12, 2005 7:11 am
#44
Fondler wrote:
SonGouki -
Great Ideas, though I'm not sure how possible the proposed factioning system is.
darkhawk1138 -
I'm sorry to see that you feel that it is necessary to discount a player's explination of their situation without any qualification for your statements.
Let me explain it to you in this manner - "Fight Clubs" are a symptom of a messed up FRS System. If you go to the doctor with a bacterial infection of the upper respiratory system, the doctor may prescribe you some cold medicine to make you feel better, but that does not deal with the infection itself as an anti-biotic would.
What you need to understand is that, in this instance, the FRS system is hurting Jedi, and the way in which they are dealing with it is percieved to be hurting everyone else. This percieved impact is what is causing the severe reaction of some members of the community. However, this is only a percieved impact because it is somehow based on the assumption that some unfair or unintended advantage is being bestowed upon individuals. This is not however the case, as players are using the means intentionally made available to them to achieve an option which was intentionally presented to them. If the Devs never intended for their to be Jedi Masters and Council Members in the game, these positions and mechanics would not have been included in the game.
What many people are asking for, a treatment of the symptom - cracking down on the fight clubs - would only serve to hurt the players that have jedi, without providing a real benefit to the community. This is because 1) Jedi that choose not to participate are subsequently denied benefits they would have gained by proxy, and 2) Jedi that do participate are being punished for using the fastest legitimate means to achieve their objective of reaching higher level content.
Certainly some people find the leveling experience to be the fun part... but sometimes we have to step out of the bounds of our own mindset, and accept that not everyone shares our view of what is enjoyable. We are all mingling in a limitlessly diverse environment here, and it should be expected that our views will differ. In order to make the most of our gaming experience, it is vital that we all open up to the situations of others.
In closing, I am not a Jedi, but many of my friends are. Some of my friends, both Jedi and non-Jedi, are vehmently opposed to "Fight Clubs" while the others are the originators of them (I think... was Lowca the first?). I have seen both sides of the argument, and I think that in the end, both have their points. I think that this post presents some great ideas for the treatment of the "disease" rather than for the symptom, and we should focus not on the conflict between us, but the resolution ahead of us.
Explaination: Greed and disregard for honest players works.
(1) 
REZ, REPEAT.
P__Day
Sat Feb 12, 2005 7:25 am
#45
What i would like to see is a system where FRS is gained from killing opposing knights, but this is impossible due to the fact that whenever i see 2 jedi fight once one gets low on force its Forcerun2 or forcerun3 into a body of water and either LD or call backup.
I would like to see that when 2 jedi initiate combat with eachother they are locked in combat with no outside help alowed except from other knights. and Force run needs a counter move somewhere to keep it from being the "i dont lose" button. FRS should be about jedi vs jedi combat, not about who can LD in water or roll with the biggest ganksquad.
Metalsaber
Sat Feb 12, 2005 7:41 am
#46
well if they just made Jedi their own faction then there would be no outside help. Plus would bring back the PVP for regular profs as well.
Arconis_Runicblade
Sat Feb 12, 2005 8:07 am
#47
I still think that light and dark should be determined by actions like in KOTOR....
but then again maybe i'm just a little crazy =P
Jarrec_Sadow
Sat Feb 12, 2005 9:17 am
#48
5 star. but it seems pointless kinda. We the players have been talking about these same problems for a long a$$ time. /shrug
cirE20
Sat Feb 12, 2005 9:46 am
#49
SonGouki wrote:LIGHT / DARK FRS FACTIONSo, as the diagram illustrates, FRS Jedi would exist above the PvP Enabled status layer in the factional hierarchy, as Light/Dark. FRS Jedi would additionally be able to enlist as either PvP Enabled or Disabled, but their underlying alignment would always be as a Light/Dark. Special functionality would have to be developed to allow a FRS Jedi to withdraw completely from PvP Enabled/Disabled status back to being exclusively Light/Dark.
I'm not sure what this actually means..
FRS Jedi could still enlist as PVP Enabled? So, this doesn't remove them from the GCW.. they can still enlist, if they choose..
Is that what you meant to say? What would an FRS Jedi lose if he died to someone while enlisted as PVP Enabled?
I'm not understanding this particular part.. I belive it would be better to completely seperate FRS Jedi from normal PVP activities.
Possibly a better way of implimenting this would be to make all Jedi Knights PvE Enabled for the cooresponding faction, then add code to be able to be attacked / attack opposing Jedi Knights.
KyleKnox
Sat Feb 12, 2005 9:50 am
#50
JemyM wrote:
Lastly, the connection Jedi =PvP must go
I have no interest in PvP whatsoever and I will never freely participate in any hostility against other players. I also feels it to be unethic to attack other players that have not declared that they want to participate in PvP. To become a Jedi is for many a flavorbased choice, a way to pursue their dream character, not a way to reveal themselves as a PvP player. Many Jedi are simply in this game to explore PvE with friends, and PvP is very unnappealing to us. There are plenty of competitive games out there to play, but very few games where co-operation against computer generated opponents is in focus.
For all thoose gamers that started to play this game to avoid the massive hoard of Counter-Strike games that dominate the PC market, all Forced PvP in this game MUST GO.
Message Edited by JemyM on 02-12-2005 02:18 PM
QFE
A lot of players feel this way. PvP should always be optional. And SOE saying the option is not to become a Knight, is the same kind of @sshat SOE dev thinking that insured so many of your players are playingOTHER games atm. This is especially true for us prepatchnerf 9, 4444 Guardians, that enjoyed OPTIONAL pvp. Stripping skill boxes from us, our titles from us, AND LYING TO US about the ability to gain the jedi master title that wewere denied b/c of you terrible programming (the app point bug) is COMPLETELY UNACCEPTABLE. And no, I dont consider the "Working as Intended" fight club crap a viable method for gaining the Master title, b/c that turns that title into a PURE joke, not the achievement it should be.
ThePhilosopher
Sat Feb 12, 2005 10:09 am
#51
Was my idea. Click my sig.
777jb777 wrote:
The solution, which I've only seen proposed once in an excellent post by a fellow whose name I forget, is *differential frs xp reward ratios*. That means that the ratio of FRS xp gained changes based upon the location the kill takes place. Currently, the 'winner' of a fight gains more xp than the 'loser' loses, and THAT is the root cause of this issue.
Gaffacas
Sat Feb 12, 2005 10:37 am
#52
Nice Post!!!
Very Nice!
But SonGouki - what did the Devs say about this?
Are the willing to change the FRS ?
Do you think the FRS will ever be changed?
People have been talking about a new FRS for months now - and I havent seen the Devs comment of it even once.....