Jedi Archive
Thread: BH Ganking Overt Major problem when Knight returns...
chewboywa wrote:
This was a danger since the first knight entered the FRS a year ago, I used to have bounty hunters with overt Jedi or the likes come after me when I was in the FRS. Not that I complain about it, I am a Jedi for a reason.
The FRS will seperate the men from the boys, newer Jedi that cannot handle this kind of PvP will not last very long in the FRS.Message Edited by chewboywa on 09-05-2005 08:38 PM
That was the old system my dear. That was when we could take 2-5 BHs at a time, or more even if we were good, then take time to finish off the Jedi's with the BH.
We also could have people in our group to fight back as well.
This is Post-Cu We are NOT as strong, and even if we were, the gank squad with the Bh is going to be ALL Jedi Knights that are going to be close to your equals no matter how good you are.
I'm NOT a 'newer' Jedi, but I am thinking of how things will be with the new system and the amount of Full Templates running around.
Also remember in the old days, Knights were not predominate, and full template Jedi were not so common either. Now they are a dime a dozen. And even if you are one of hte Best PVP Jedi on the server, 3-4 ok Jedis can take you out, Period. The only exception to this is if you run and can escape without getting a snare or root. Even if you AI yourself, you can't get away, your snare with theirs stacked on it or their root, and you are toast, even if you have FR2 to compensate for the snare somewhat.
(BTW a forced snare for AI is still stupid. If the Jedi or BH you are fighting can't snare or root you to prevent you from escaping, they shouldn't win, period. It would be different if they didn't have these skills.)
Anyway, think about it, and how things have changed, and how big of a mess this could be.
It may be they want all the Jedi that don't have the Prem Pearls like the old timers and the money for the good CA to just quit the game. I don't know. I have an edge here, but still don't think it is fair to the new Jedi either.
Maddog1780 wrote:I am sorry to say that this is not new to the jedi preofession. Being overt has its loses inwhich you know. Th problem isnot the Devs but the people that complain about situations that caused then loss. We know the drawbacks of cewrtain action but yet we decided to defy them and once our decision blows up in our face ; we have a problem with the system. Its funny how we never complain until the problem hits home, never to say anything when things happen to our fellow player. SWG is going down the tubes because of the TEN SINS:
1. A few players decide to take advantage of certain mechanics of the game by using illegal CHEATS
2. A few players figure out hoe yo make the game easier for their gameplay which others players cant do, so they cry exploit.
3. A few players dont have the time to play SWG like others ,so they say no balance for casual players
4.A few players cant pvp as well as others so they cry nerf or make everyone the same
5.A few players discipline gets nerfed because of people complaining , so they complain in spike to nerf the other
6. "THIS IS MY FAVORITE" A few players lose XP,Duels,beat by noobs and Etc.. SO they cry "is this an exploit" on the forums.
7. A few players didnt plan their template properly and want to change it because of some selfish reasons so they find a nitch in the system in order to complain no balance.
8. "This is a too part one". (a) A few playerscantbare the Jedi grind for many reasons EX: I did 20holos andstill got to do the village; I cant change my template to comando to do nades; they cant get anyone to help them do the badges; people started after them and became Jedi; and since they cant or have gave up on getting jedi they say we messed up GCW which is the dumbestever plus "ITs too many JEDI (JEDImakes up less than 20% of the server. Its also funny no one ever cried about it being toomany MTKA, in which everyone and their mother was one. Now everyone,their mama,and daddies are rifleman). (b) A few JEDI suckin PVP, have EGO problems, very selfish, cnat be uber no more,and even have low self image in real life and need the attention so they cry about what time period jedi has the most honor or had it the worst to validate their egotistical acheivments. So they in point cry to eliminate other JEDI's.
9. A few players on the Forums cry as if they represent the 95% of the players that dont post on the forums or dont post in the profession Forum ( i wondered why the new JEDI COOROSPONDENT mostly posted in the Trade forums like alot of others.
10. Because of the 1-9 SINS the DEVS literly Give the JEDI and other profession what they want and think they need. NERF NERF NERF/ REVAMP REVAMP REVAMP/ BUG BUG BUG/ LIES LIES LIES.
If you figure out why5% of the people in this run and determine the lifestyle and death of the 95% of the world, then you'll realize that YOU ARE YOUR WORST ENEMY.
THE "SENT ONE" HAS SPOKEN.
/agree...
I truly should of made my post more of something like, here is something SOE needs to be considering for the FRS system, as it will be a possible big problem.
I wasn't trying to do the classic whine. I truly thought the death was funny at the time, and talked to the BH and the Jedi's that killed me. It is a game after all.
Diana
Sorry if this comes across as negative, but that is how it was under the old system, it's nothing new.
1) Everyone who was a knight pre CU will remember this, this is one of the things that went with being a rank member. There are certain downfalls to holding a priviledged title/class, this is one of them.
2) Pre CU the best advise was don't enter the ranking system unless you are happy with your template, and accept that you can/will be ganked and you can/will lose both Jedi XP and ranking XP as a result of death.
3) We don't know what the FRS will be like, if/when it comes back, so until then, play as normal and enjoy yourself 
Actually, not at all new... And yes I remember the old days, but I also remember being a bit tougher than average professions, and Jedi of your equal being more uncommon.
Since the CU and the XP rewards, almost everyone has a Full Template Jedi. Things will be different. You won't be fighting a group that you have a chance to survive against if you are perma overt. No more traveling alone, and calling in help when needed.
You also forget we could have groups that could fight back against the BH groups as well. Now the BH will get full focus on killing you, along with the rest of his squad.
They won't be so inclined to take out the other overts until you are dead, then pick off the ones they can.
Just think about this a bit, I don't care if you agree.
It could be a big problem.. And I hope I'm wrong and SOE has already thought this through.
Take Care out there...
DolthranSST wrote:
Stop crying. That's exactly the way it should be. The Jedi population is getting anobseneamount of slack in PvP; no xp loss upon cloning, BH's can't take your mission out of spite. If you had been traveling with a group while overt the way you're SUPPOSED to, to avoid ganking, your friends could've handled the overt jedi and you could've taken the BH on yourself. As for Knights becoming unplayable. GOOD. There are too many Jedi atm anyway. I hope alot more Jedi have your mentality because then I will be able to play mine without having to feel like I'm playing KOTOR.
DianaPrince wrote:
Just had an incident today, was Overt (ya I know).
A factionally Opposed Jedi Caught up to me, Stasised me, waited for their friend, a BH that had my mark catch up.
The BH shot me once, then two other overt Jedis showed up, and I lost the battle. The first Jedi is even the one that DeathBlowed me.
However, the BH, got his full reward of 230+k, and I lost my 450k.
Now I understand that this is PVP and all... But once the BH shot me, None of my friends could heal or help me, but his friends could continue to kill me, while he watched and waited for his reward.
When Knights come back to game and we are permanently overt, all BHs will have to do is what this one did, Get a Gank squad of overt or other Jedi Knights, and not only get the FRS and PVP ranking, but the BH with his one shot will make you lose XP in the process. (Great for Knights wanting the PVP FRS as well, as the BHs will be able to track the Jedis for them to kill.)
Is this the 1 on 1 BH/Jedi that SOE envisions?
I don't think so, and if it is, Knights won't survive unless they run in packs of other Knights all the Time, especially now that Jedi are not even 1.5x a normal profession, and good TKM/Doc can kill most MDefs.
Does anyone else find this wrong? Why wouldn't the BH TEF also work to prevent others from attacking me, just like it prevents others from healing me?
Wouldn't this make more sense? When the BH hits you, you should only be attackable by the BH, not his group of Overt friends.
So if you get your Knight back, and are overt, be on the look out for the Massive BH/Jedi Gank Squads again.
Someone, please let the devs know that this will destroy the GCW. Even now, I don't want to PVP Overt anymore, as The Guild chats go wild to see if anyone in their guild has your mission, and they keep ya alive long enough for the BH to arrive.
It would be different if this was pre-CU, and I could hold my own against 5 people, and use AI or FR to escape a trap.
And no, I'm not whining, as I was XP capped, so it didn't mean much to me at this point, but seriously got me thinking.
Knights will become unplayable and BH/Jedi Ganks will rule once again.
Message Edited by DianaPrince on 09-05-2005 05:48 PM
Pre-CU I did this all the time with Jedi Knights. Had 2 buddy Jedi Knights attack my mark and I would help. I get the db and the cash. I look forward to using these sort of tactics if/when the FRS returns. I sure hope Knights are perma-overt again, oh the fun I will have.....
After reading this thread, I agree that the current BH system, pending FRS, is broken.
That said, I think the first issue is how the BH tef is working. Based upon the very little documentation, once a BH tef is applied, it is supposed to limit all combat to 1 vs 1, regardless of GCW status.
IE, even when combatant or SF, once the BH tef is applied, the other tefs should become negated.
Even with always overt status for FRS, this type of application for BH tef would prevent gank squads all around.
As for comments regarding PreCU Jedi vs PostCU Jedi, the reality is that with a combat lvl system, lvl 80 is lvl 80 regardless of class. The only difference then becomes armor and damage. Since Jedi cannot wear armor and PostCU glow sticks don't come close to the common place 1200 max damage weapons, it is clear that Jedi are weaker by comparison all around.
PreCU, I used to watch Knights, single handed, take on 3 to 5 BHs and win. Obviously SOE has even realized their own nerf to jedi when they at least try to make a 1 vs 1 system.
As for XP loss, I think it should be removed from the game, and for several reasons.
1) Jedi, pending FRS implementation, is weaker than other double elites. This is especially true considering the stats for glow sticks.
2) The volume of Jedi XP needed for mastering a tree or earning a branch is already high enough that we do not need penalties. Loosing FRS standing is penalty enough for any ambitious Jedi.
3) This is a game and as such is supposed to be fun. Loosing XP is not fun, especially when considering item 2.
4) Removing the penaly will eliminate allot of crying and make more peeps comfortable with PVP, thus making the game more enjoyable for more players.
Where should FRS go?
Bottom line, to make Jedi worth the work and worth having, FRS should simply raise combat level. IE, a knight should be like lvl 82, etc. Max lvl like 85 at top.
/peaceout
man can we complain about anything else? ...
I have done it many times with a BH and in turn it has also been done to me ... we used BH's as dogs to track our specific target they could get the DB its no biggie ... do what you got to do to get the job done ...
Thorkahn wrote:
After reading this thread, I agree that the current BH system, pending FRS, is broken.
That said, I think the first issue is how the BH tef is working. Based upon the very little documentation, once a BH tef is applied, it is supposed to limit all combat to 1 vs 1, regardless of GCW status.
IE, even when combatant or SF, once the BH tef is applied, the other tefs should become negated.
Even with always overt status for FRS, this type of application for BH tef would prevent gank squads all around.
As for comments regarding PreCU Jedi vs PostCU Jedi, the reality is that with a combat lvl system, lvl 80 is lvl 80 regardless of class. The only difference then becomes armor and damage. Since Jedi cannot wear armor and PostCU glow sticks don't come close to the common place 1200 max damage weapons, it is clear that Jedi are weaker by comparison all around.
PreCU, I used to watch Knights, single handed, take on 3 to 5 BHs and win. Obviously SOE has even realized their own nerf to jedi when they at least try to make a 1 vs 1 system.
As for XP loss, I think it should be removed from the game, and for several reasons.
1) Jedi, pending FRS implementation, is weaker than other double elites. This is especially true considering the stats for glow sticks.
2) The volume of Jedi XP needed for mastering a tree or earning a branch is already high enough that we do not need penalties. Loosing FRS standing is penalty enough for any ambitious Jedi.
3) This is a game and as such is supposed to be fun. Loosing XP is not fun, especially when considering item 2.
4) Removing the penaly will eliminate allot of crying and make more peeps comfortable with PVP, thus making the game more enjoyable for more players.
Where should FRS go?
Bottom line, to make Jedi worth the work and worth having, FRS should simply raise combat level. IE, a knight should be like lvl 82, etc. Max lvl like 85 at top.
/peaceout