Jedi Archive
Thread: Jedi Have Sabers, Right? Why Aren't they Effective? Can Do More with Pistol Balance Pls
Thanks for the open mindedness. What's funny, read the post above yours and argue with the ramblings if you please, is that the end result of what you are describing is very much the same thing that I'm describing. Funny thing happens when you read, comprehend, and give people some consideration of ideas.
Nox_SWG wrote:
Nox_SWG wrote:
There are no 'non-ls' tree jedi.
In fact, you are wrong. Any tree other than Sabers is a non-LS tree. Healer, Wielder, Defender, to be exact.
And regardless of your mage BS, I could very much see (and have seen actually,) players who would want to Master Healer and Defender, and guess what?
A) Since they're a Jedi, they made a lightsaber, AND
B) Since they have a lightsaber, they should be f'in lethal.
Okay how about 'there are no generally effective non-ls jedi in the current system' ?
That's because there's no efficient way to deliver damage without lightsabers. I'm not saying that's how it should be, I'm just observing that this is how it is today.
Message Edited by jimcabtv on 07-15-2005 01:31 PM
Crizis wrote:
U can't discuss a topic if you don't know what the subject is. MLS = Master Lightsaber, or master sabers. The term is used interchangeably around here. Now, how you can attempt to discuss something without knowing what the subject is? That's something subject to sarcasm.
mindspat wrote:
Crizis wrote:
MFW and MLS offense are nowhere near comparable as they exist today. There is no credible, effective area attack by MFW to anywhere compare with the MLS Dervish. It's like comparing a blowdart with a tank canon. This is likewise true for single attacks. There is a huge gap that needs addressing such that there is some reasonable, plausible offensive ability by non-LightSaber (LS) tree Jedi that makes them viable as an EFFECTIVE offensive template. Maybe not comparable to MLS, but viable.
Today, we are not viable offensively if not LS Tree.
Rather than tweak up the non-LS Tree's specials, and since LS are supposed to cut through flesh and metal like butter, the answer may be that since all Jedi make sabers, all can cut through things like butter. So that the balancing that needs to happen is to tweak up LS damage and special abilities by non-LS Tree Jedi, such that a saber does as saber is, and thus all templates get a lift in offense, and the LS Tree itself is more of an increased lift indamage and some specific tree-granted specials, but not all LS specials are limited to the LS tree.
I'm going to have fun with this post. (I'm in one of those moods today and my sacrcasm is going to hit the forums.)
How in the heck can someone make a claim when listing something that doesn't exist. What that hell is MLS, that some sort of disease? I'm worried, I have LM and I have no clue what players are thinking is MLS...some new magical ability?
As for lightsabers, get off your whinny little sit downs and get out there and loot crystals and pearls. Oh yeah, I forgot...you don't want to do the work to gain the advantage. I bet you're one of th eones who used the respec to "alter mytemplate" more then 10 times. Yeah, like that's legit. Now you want more? Give me a break!
If you want to do better and have a saber that's comparable to those who've been a Jedi since before the CU you'll need to do the work. I have to add, lightsabers are just fine and the crystals are perfect. There's NO reason to add anything in loot that gives better possibillities to gaining an "uber" saber.
Good luck.
Chewing on lead ships again are you? Can you locate a skill called "master lightsaber" or "master sabers"? I dare you, no, I double dog dare you.
Just an fyi, the closet thing I can find is "Lightsaber Master" aka "lightsaber mastery". Do your homework if your'e going to be citing facts.
umm no, you want saber specials take master ls like the rest of us.
All jedi had basic knowledge of the force aswell. So why dont we give every jedi force run, meditate, etc.
All jedi had basic defense knowledge aswell, so lets get rid of the defender prof and give all jedi defenses.
I vote yes to the above.
To stop all the hating and envy on the jedi forums, they should just go back to the way it was pre pub 9 and give all jedi every jedi skill. Even then, there would prob still be whining and complaining against jedi from other jedi about something.
You're not making sense again. 44 year old bank CFO here, btw.
mindspat wrote:
Chewing on lead ships again are you? Can you locate a skill called "master lightsaber" or "master sabers"? I dare you, no, I double dog dare you.
Just an fyi, the closet thing I can find is "Lightsaber Master" aka "lightsaber mastery". Do your homework if your'e going to be citing facts.
stoofid kids
Seloth wrote:
per your request
http://swg.stratics.com/content/news/archive/arc3-2005.php
"Keldarin - It is true that Jedi will require defensive and offensive abilities. We've been doing a lot of work to make Defender and Enhancer viable options for those defensive abilities as well as making Powers and Lightsaber viable options for offensive abilities. The Jedi skills should be more balanced and allow for more flexibility of template setup. "
cheese tactics? saber throw in a melee profession? why not just limit saber throw to 12 meters?
come one get serious we are not asking for the same dps, what we are askiugn for is the above. but i guess that is beyond you. as for gear investment, sorry cry me a river about credits and such when i can see ebaying for credits, selling things like resources for 25 cpu and up from lots that a a jedi you really do not use, etc. Yes i buy pearls, but more so my guild hunts dragons for the loot.
Making sabers the lethal weapons they should be, instead of the ineffective practice swords they are today for everyone not in the Sabers line, would be a step in the right direction.
Crizis wrote:MFW and MLS offense are nowhere near comparable as they exist today. There is no credible, effective area attack by MFW to anywhere compare with the MLS Dervish. It's like comparing a blowdart with a tank canon. This is likewise true for single attacks. There is a huge gap that needs addressing such that there is some reasonable, plausible offensive ability by non-LightSaber (LS) tree Jedi that makes them viable as an EFFECTIVE offensive template. Maybe not comparable to MLS, but viable.Today, we are not viable offensively if not LS Tree.
Rather than tweak up the non-LS Tree's specials, and since LS are supposed to cut through flesh and metal like butter, the answer may be that since all Jedi make sabers, all can cut through things like butter. So that the balancing that needs to happen is to tweak up LS damage and special abilities by non-LS Tree Jedi, such that a saber does as saber is, and thus all templates get a lift in offense, and the LS Tree itself is more of an increased lift in damage and some specific tree-granted specials, but not all LS specials are limited to the LS tree.
I am not sure of the examples you use to get your opinions on sabers, but as a MLS myself, I can attest that when it comes to damage dealing, sabers are now only in the mid-range in comparison to other weapons in this game. While we can see rifles, powerhammers and some pikes with 1k + max damage, a Saber's max will never (not that I have seen at least) be over 800. When it comes to fighting the high level elite mobs, I can tank fairly well, but unless there is someone else behind me with a rifle to issue the damage, I am not really effective at all. These days the "sabers can cut through flesh and metal like butter" idea only applies if the flesh is on a dead nuna and the butter has been sitting near a cooking stove for a few hours.
Message Edited by Crizis on 07-15-2005 02:35 PM
HanzoShinobi wrote:
Crizis wrote:
DoddsySnach wrote:
I dunno if its just me, but i dont have a single clue what your going on about
LOL
Facts:
- All Jedi make sabers
- Sabers, by nature, kick a55... cutting through even metal
Therefore:
- All Jedi should be kicking a55 when holding a saber, not just those who take the LS Tree
Therefore, to recognize this, and to improve the offensive capability of all Jedi who are not LS Tree, and are comparatively and overly weak to the LS Tree's offensiveness:
- Move some of the specials from the LS Tree to the other trees, so that all Jedi are able to have some basic level of saber specials, with improved damage, and thus balancing out the offensive nature of all templates.
- The most powerful and effective saber specials are still the benefit of the LS Tree exclusively, or
- The LS Tree grants a bonus to damage that still exceeds the other Tree's equivalent specials
Bottom line, the other Jedi templates need a boost in their saber specials and correspondingly, the amount of damage they deliver, to make them more offensively viable.
Get it? I'm saying that if you want to improve the viability of the other templates, you don't necessarily have to look any farther than the saber in your hands to accomplish it.
Message Edited by Crizis on 07-14-2005 05:39 PM
umm no, you want saber specials take master ls like the rest of us.
All jedi had basic knowledge of the force aswell. So why dont we give every jedi force run, meditate, etc.
All jedi had basic defense knowledge aswell, so lets get rid of the defender prof and give all jedi defenses.
To stop all the hating and envy on the jedi forums, they should just go back to the way it was pre pub 9 and give all jedi every jedi skill. Even then, there would prob still be whining and complaining against jedi from other jedi about something.
Hmm, as master lightsaber, I don't have good cloaking skills. Can I have cloak, avoid incap, sap, total heal and advanced aura in my MLS box?
Already covered that. Look up.
Iawalein wrote:
Hmm, as master lightsaber, I don't have good cloaking skills. Can I have cloak, avoid incap, sap, total heal and advanced aura in my MLS box?
True, but sabers as a weapon shouldbe lethal, and not a damage-equivalent of a "wooden stick" that we pummel things with.
Nox_SWG wrote:
Okay how about 'there are no generally effective non-ls jedi in the current system' ?
That's because there's no efficient way to deliver damage without lightsabers. I'm not saying that's how it should be, I'm just observing that this is how it is today.