Jedi Archive
Thread: Thoughts on the MCM/MBH problem
NoStyleGuy
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:21 pm
#27
in the real SW universe jedi were only killable by the very best of the best. that has no place in an MMO especially one as driven by PvP as SWG. Jedi can't be 20x more powerful (like movies/EU might suggest) But if they are driven down into the realm of normals (not saying they ARE normal just that some normies can kill them) Then it doesn't accurately reflect the jedi from SW.
no alphaclass = balanced game (or closer too it)
no alphaclass = balanced game (or closer too it)
Centra28
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:21 pm
#28
Are the jedi not powerful enough for you? Jedi all ready dominate everything on the ground, someone has to be able to beat you.
i guess avoid incap and cloak arent good enough for you, how about we make the jedi best at everything so they dont have to try at all.
can we say EASYBUTTON?
OhBuggah
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:27 pm
#29
glim3mer wrote:
I disagree. Its much easier to get CM nerfed them Jedi Healer fixed. Im with original poster on this. Nerf CM.
Adapt improve and overcome can and will be said to CM once they get nerfed.
Seriously... imbalanced. One prof gets 3 heals with no timer delays, and another gets 1 with a timer. This game is based on healing.... they need to un-nerf jedi healing or nerf everyother healing prof in-game, that simple.
What a load of crap. In pratical use there are only two heals for CM's: Bacta Toss and Bacta Spray ... anything else is redundant. Also, Jedi don't need to heal as much as a CM because the CM has a much much MUCH lower DPS than Jedi ... i.e, a CM can hit a Jedi for 200 each 1-2 seconds while a Jedi can hit a CM for 500-600 each 1-2 seconds.
Also, a CM/BH's mind regen isn't what these Jedi characterize it to be. If the Jedi deals damage on the BH/CM fast enough he will get stuck in a heal loop and will run out of mind in a couple of minutes.
The real problem is that FotM Jedi like yourselves choose a very top-heavy Jedi template that isn't very well-rounded. You all choose a template that is super super powerful in offense/defense, but only moderately powerful in the healing/enhancing. A Jedi with Force Speed and a good saber will chew up ANY BH and spit him out. A Jedi with Force Speed and Force Sap will wipe the floor with ANY CM/BH.
The real MCM/MBH solution is to fight them with Jedi who know what they're doing. The problem is that there are A LOT of Jedi running around, and thus with any large population of people there is a large amount mediocrity.
The problem is not MCM/BM ... the problem is the large amount of no-skill-having n00b Jedi who think defeating a BH should be about pressing F8 over and over and over and over again and not fight with skill and thought.
Centra28
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:27 pm
#30
Also, do you think everyone who is a combat medic wants that skill? Maybe they just want to be able to enjoy the pvp aspect of the game as well, with out being a jedi. If you want to pvp a lot, you have to have cm to survive, otherwise you get ganked by a bunch of 13 year old jedi crap talkers.
Now im not even a cm ora bh, im a mast rifle/mast carb, i just find it hilarious to hear jedi cry about things being unfair.
NoStyleGuy
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:32 pm
#31
Jacella wrote:
NoStyleGuy wrote:
in the real SW universe jedi were only killable by the very best of the best. that has no place in an MMO especially one as driven by PvP as SWG. Jedi can't be 20x more powerful (like movies/EU might suggest) But if they are driven down into the realm of normals (not saying they ARE normal just that some normies can kill them) Then it doesn't accurately reflect the jedi from SW.
no alphaclass = balanced game (or closer too it)
So...no jedi were ever killed by anything less than the best of the best? So, Stormtroopers never killed a jedi? They couldn't even kill anything but Jawas and ewoks, but they did manage to carry out Order-66. Clone Troopers are the best of the best? Read a book. You people are missiong the point...there is a point where we are balanced...and we are almost there. I am just sick of the whining.
That is true. and i guess ur right. But i think we have to define 'balance'.
If 'balance' means every time i say "hey jedi want to duel? i'll give u a minute to buff up and food-up" i should have a 50-50 chance of winnging (depending on skill/equipment)
in this case i know jedi would be offended that they arn't strong enough.
or does balance mean: "jedi should be portrayed the way they are in the SW universe" which is far and above normal professions. (granted not always)
in which case everbody but jedi would whine because they'd have a terrible unlevel playing field
In either case i say "Get rid of the alpha class". Im not into fairies and dragons. I love starwars and have read dozens of books (most about Han solo, not jedi) And Love the premise of a SW MMO. But an alpha class has no place in one.
Jacella
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:38 pm
#32
I have a MP/MBH anda Jedi...They are both viable. Jedi isn't too powerful right now, but almost at a perfect level.
By definition, MBH is an Alpha class aswell.
Aglardae
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:42 pm
#33
One possible logical answer here:
Why shouldn't the FS heal tree enhance our heals? This Force Sensitive tree became useless to me as soon as I made Jedi. As these trees are requisite to become Jedi, why aren't they useful to us once we are Jedi?
Aglardae
glim3mer
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:44 pm
#34
OhBuggah wrote:
glim3mer wrote:
I disagree. Its much easier to get CM nerfed them Jedi Healer fixed. Im with original poster on this. Nerf CM.
Adapt improve and overcome can and will be said to CM once they get nerfed.
Seriously... imbalanced. One prof gets 3 heals with no timer delays, and another gets 1 with a timer. This game is based on healing.... they need to un-nerf jedi healing or nerf everyother healing prof in-game, that simple.
What a load of crap. In pratical use there are only two heals for CM's: Bacta Toss and Bacta Spray ... anything else is redundant. Also, Jedi don't need to heal as much as a CM because the CM has a much much MUCH lower DPS than Jedi ... i.e, a CM can hit a Jedi for 200 each 1-2 seconds while a Jedi can hit a CM for 500-600 each 1-2 seconds.
Also, a CM/BH's mind regen isn't what these Jedi characterize it to be. If the Jedi deals damage on the BH/CM fast enough he will get stuck in a heal loop and will run out of mind in a couple of minutes.
The real problem is that FotM Jedi like yourselves choose a very top-heavy Jedi template that isn't very well-rounded. You all choose a template that is super super powerful in offense/defense, but only moderately powerful in the healing/enhancing. A Jedi with Force Speed and a good saber will chew up ANY BH and spit him out. A Jedi with Force Speed and Force Sap will wipe the floor with ANY CM/BH.
The real MCM/MBH solution is to fight them with Jedi who know what they're doing. The problem is that there are A LOT of Jedi running around, and thus with any large population of people there is a large amount mediocrity.
The problem is not MCM/BM ... the problem is the large amount of no-skill-having n00b Jedi who think defeating a BH should be about pressing F8 over and over and over and over again and not fight with skill and thought.
Your on crack.
First off you assume we are all FOTM Jedi. Second off you assume that most Jedi are noobs with no skills.
Now... First thing is first... Your off topic. We are not talking about someone ability to play here, we are talking about CM having the ability to heal 3 times in 6 seconds vs Jedi healing once every 6 seconds.
So back to the point.... as CM's you either support us in getting Jedi Heals Un-Nerfed OR we nerf your profession. Its that simple. Jedi needs healing balance for PvP and PvE. Yes most of us can beat a BH/Cm but thats not the point here. Get on topic please.
NoStyleGuy
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:46 pm
#35
Jacella wrote:
I have a MP/MBH anda Jedi...They are both viable. Jedi isn't too powerful right now, but almost at a perfect level.By definition, MBH is an Alpha class aswell.
heh im not crying nerf on anything. I agree with you. (except i dont think anybody should be able to go invisible in an MMO either). If they took MBH, and jedi out of this game i could care less. MCM/MP Looks like a fun PvP template.
Chris-DaMan
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:46 pm
#36
Centra28 wrote:
Are the jedi not powerful enough for you? Jedi all ready dominate everything on the ground, someone has to be able to beat you.
i guess avoid incap and cloak arent good enough for you, how about we make the jedi best at everything so they dont have to try at all.
can we say EASYBUTTON?
lol, i know what youre trying to say but you really shouldnt have put avoid incap in there.
Jacella
Mon Sep 12, 2005 2:47 pm
#37
glim3mer wrote:
Your on crack.
First off you assume we are all FOTM Jedi. Second off you assume that most Jedi are noobs with no skills.
Now... First thing is first... Your off topic. We are not talking about someone ability to play here, we are talking about CM having the ability to heal 3 times in 6 seconds vs Jedi healing once every 6 seconds.
So back to the point.... as CM's you either support us in getting Jedi Heals Un-Nerfed OR we nerf your profession. Its that simple. Jedi needs healing balance for PvP and PvE. Yes most of us can beat a BH/Cm but thats not the point here. Get on topic please.
Speaking of Crack..You are a n00b. The CM's healing has nothing to do with our healing. This isn't a one for one swap of who's is bigger. Jedi have a whole bag of tricks to choose from, MBH/MCM's don't. If you are getting beat, you brought the wrong bag with you. Since you say you aren't a n00b, FOTM, or respec type, the I can only assume that your have no clue about the nature of PVP. If you are losing, it's because you are playing poorly, and no ammount of heals is gonna save you.
glim3mer
Mon Sep 12, 2005 6:55 pm
#38
Jacella wrote:
glim3mer wrote:
Your on crack.
First off you assume we are all FOTM Jedi. Second off you assume that most Jedi are noobs with no skills.
Now... First thing is first... Your off topic. We are not talking about someone ability to play here, we are talking about CM having the ability to heal 3 times in 6 seconds vs Jedi healing once every 6 seconds.
So back to the point.... as CM's you either support us in getting Jedi Heals Un-Nerfed OR we nerf your profession. Its that simple. Jedi needs healing balance for PvP and PvE. Yes most of us can beat a BH/Cm but thats not the point here. Get on topic please.
Speaking of Crack..You are a n00b. The CM's healing has nothing to do with our healing. This isn't a one for one swap of who's is bigger. Jedi have a whole bag of tricks to choose from, MBH/MCM's don't. If you are getting beat, you brought the wrong bag with you. Since you say you aren't a n00b, FOTM, or respec type, the I can only assume that your have no clue about the nature of PVP. If you are losing, it's because you are playing poorly, and no ammount of heals is gonna save you.
Im not going to explain jack to you tards beyond this point. We are talking about healing, thats it. We are not discussing if jedi have other options vs CM's options.
Healing for Healing. Jedi Heals 1500 in 6 seconds vs CM heals 1200+ 3times in 6 seconds.
Total Jedi 1500 < CM 3000+ ..... in 6 seconds.
If you dint go to school its your parents fault.
Either un-nerf healer from Jedi by removing 6 second timer and making 2 seconds OR nerf CM and add all 3 heals on the same timer AND put a 6 second cooldown.
At this point... I realise a bounch of scared CM's are going to throw themselves to try and protect there precious heals. Dont bother... The point is clear and CM needs adjusting. Either help Jedi, or get nerf CAUSE of jedi.
And you dumb tard I have a CM as well. Ive played both sides of the fence.
School is something you cant replace...
StrayS8
Mon Sep 12, 2005 7:20 pm
#39
cms dont need heals nerfd just the 75% armor break slicing... ab hitting a 8000 eff recon energy set...for 1300 and only doing 600 damage is sick since a mdef ab will get hit for 300% more and forced to ai will kill all our force and snare us