Jedi Archive
Thread: Some Jedi don't care for PVP
JeetBadwarrior
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:28 pm
#27
not sure why you would choose jedi as a class if you dont like pvp or dont care too..im befuddled, bewildered, and shocked you would make such a move..it doent make any logically sense at all...all i can think of is this
1. you read the bh boards and jedi boards about jedi getting killed by bh...you must think this doesnt apply to you the ole it wont happen to me..ill never be on the terms..
2. you choose a class that in order to gain frs you must be perma overt(SF) and fight other jedi....unless you just want a full temp paddy to show of to your friends in that thecase refer to #1
*shakeshead* /ponder
Gelotri
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:28 pm
#28
Jacella wrote:
What is this person gonna do when the pvp frs comes back? Jedi is PVP. If you want pve, there are better professions out there for that.
blademaster30 wrote:
Jacella wrote:
-Koe- wrote:
Yes i'm a new Jedi and no i don't care for PVP... Figured i'd deal with it some cause i will have to. But Jedi need a benifit for fighting a BH and BH need a detriment for loosing a fight.
Jedi is PVP. They are the quarry of BH's. If the jedi loses, they lose xp. If the BH loses, they don't get paid, their armour is toast and they will need to invest more credits to get replacements. They do not need to lose xp.
If you can't handle the situation as it stands and has stood for 2 years, then you need to stop playing your jedi.
sorry anybody with a BH alt does not count
Actually Jacella, that excuse of "Jedi are and have always been the prey of BH's" just dont cut it. This is Star Wars isnt it? I dont recall any Jedi being hunted by a BH in any of the movies. How many BH missions did you do while traveling up the Investigations tree that were targeting other BH's (NPC's), who failed to do what they were hired to do and had a contract put out on them? I am speaking of the NPC's by the way, for those not familiar with the BH trees and missions. People say Jedi are a PVP class and as such dictates they should be able to be hunted by other players. I feel it boils down to plain 'ol player griefing when they are the only ones that can be hunted. BH is a PvP class, CM is a PvP class, as is Commando. Why not make it so ANY player can find themselves on the terms and lose xp on death? Might make folks learn to be nicer to each other, slow their mastering professions in 2 days, and in effect decrease the so called "Jedi Over-Population explosion". Then when the shoe is on the other foot (to coin a phrase) how much crying will they do? If SOE's reasoning is because it would allow for player griefing, then they are contradicting themselves and are authorizing player griefing of Jedi. The Jedi profession should be a tough role to play, but so should BH and any other "Elite" combat class. I also feel that there should be a way to attack another player without going through the whole \Duel thing. Maybe have an option to be fulltime PvP. The bottom line is that a a single player group should not be forced into a PvP situation unless it is the same across the board for every profession.
Another thing, just because someone says something you dont like or agree with, they have a right to express their views (As Koe did) does not give you the right to tell him to go somewhere else if he dont like it. That is your favorite response. He pays for his right to complain about things he disagrees with. Just like you pay for the right to show what horses arse you are. The funny thing is, there is an old saying that goes something like this: "If it looks like a skunk, and smells like a skunk, it probably is a skunk." What I mean by this is that you support the fact that Jedi are the only ones that should be hunted, you admit you have a BH "Alt", and "say" you have a Jedi toon. To me it sounds as though you dont have as much concern for the rights of Jedi profession as you do for the rights of the BH profession. Why not delete/sell your jedi and play the BH profession full time. since that seems to be where your heart is.
Many would not like to see anything suggested here but I would bet good money they are the same ones who take Jedi missions daily. And yes, I have a Jedi toon and a BH toon. And no...I havent been killed by a BH for quite some time. Just my opinions here whether you agree or not. Everyone has one.
Fugitron
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:31 pm
#29
Yes I have. I dealt with it. So whats your point? Cause if you were trying to make one I surely missed it.
triplejacko wrote:
Fugitron wrote:
MrDecipher wrote:
When you choose to be jedi you know 1 thing for sure. You will be attackable by BHs always has been this was always will be this way. Don't ever expect this to change if you don't want to have to fight BHers play Jedi academy or something. The game is how it is. Jedi has from day one been given the role of a PvP oriented class with forced PvP.
When the first jedi appeared the BH system didn't exist. What I mean is that no player could hunt another at that time. As soon as more started to unlock the ability to hunt jedi was added in. So, please don't give us the whole "it has always been this way" and "you knew what to expect" rebuttles. Cause it wasn't ever stated in the manual OR in the game until they implemented BH v Jedi that they would be hunted. Yes they said the road was hard and yadda yadaa, but the grind in itself takes 4 months minimum just to get jedi. I think thats more than enough of an excuse for jedi to have more power. I personally think they should take out xp loss, because jedi are not what there were and are seriously lacking in power.
HAHAHAHHAH! Ever heard of the saber TEF? You could be attacked by everyone on the entire server! Boy, people really are naive about how easy they have it now.
JeetBadwarrior
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:32 pm
#30
you just didnt use the movies as a reference to game play did you....
for all those in the cheap seats YOU CANT NOT USE THE MOVIES AS A REFERENCE TO GAME PLAY IN SWG
and I remember what RPG means in a MMO but hey you new the breaks when you came in it wasnt soe dirty little trick on you..YOU CHOOSE to become a JEDI knowing full aware of the price...so do your whining on some other place..or did you think that they were going to hand out JEDI to every carebear that got a 6 monthes subcription
oh wait i stand corrected they did with that freakin village now we got deal with the whine threads every day..lucky us
Message Edited by JeetBadwarrior on 09-20-2005 01:36 PM
Crash752
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:32 pm
#31
Fugitron wrote:
MrDecipher wrote:
When you choose to be jedi you know 1 thing for sure. You will be attackable by BHs always has been this was always will be this way. Don't ever expect this to change if you don't want to have to fight BHers play Jedi academy or something. The game is how it is. Jedi has from day one been given the role of a PvP oriented class with forced PvP.
When the first jedi appeared the BH system didn't exist. What I mean is that no player could hunt another at that time. As soon as more started to unlock the ability to hunt jedi was added in. So, please don't give us the whole "it has always been this way" and "you knew what to expect" rebuttles. Cause it wasn't ever stated in the manual OR in the game until they implemented BH v Jedi that they would be hunted. Yes they said the road was hard and yadda yadaa, but the grind in itself takes 4 months minimum just to get jedi. I think thats more than enough of an excuse for jedi to have more power. I personally think they should take out xp loss, because jedi are not what there were and are seriously lacking in power.
That is completely false.
As soon as the first Jedi unlocked on each server the visibility system existed that placed them on the bounty hunter terminals. Many of the new Jedi immediately got on the terminals for showing off.
As soon as the first Jedi unlocked on each server a system message was sent to every player stating that Darth Vader wanted you to attack all Jedi on sight.
Every Jedi was given a TEF (temporary enemy flag)whenever they used their lightsaber or force powers. This meant opposing faction players could attack any Jedi they saw at will.
Fugitron
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:33 pm
#32
Lemme put it this way, when I chose to go jedi it was different whenI got there, and then it changed some more, and then again and then the CU. No one knew "what to expect" when they got there. For me, I saw the power and said "I gots to get me some of that," and that was it. Too bad when I finished the power just was not what it was when I decided to go jedi. Make sense?
Auraveda wrote:
That's only really a valid argument if you happen to be one of those first folks to unlock Jedi. So yeah, if you're one of those first few, then by all means scream till you're blue in the face about how this isn't what it was like when you unlocked, that you never expected to have to PVP or be hunted.
And using the argument that it isn't in the manual is just laughable. Is ANYTHING in the original manual right anymore? The game has changed so much that the only constants now are change and bugs.
Fugitron
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:36 pm
#33
Crash752 wrote:
Fugitron wrote:
MrDecipher wrote:
When you choose to be jedi you know 1 thing for sure. You will be attackable by BHs always has been this was always will be this way. Don't ever expect this to change if you don't want to have to fight BHers play Jedi academy or something. The game is how it is. Jedi has from day one been given the role of a PvP oriented class with forced PvP.
When the first jedi appeared the BH system didn't exist. What I mean is that no player could hunt another at that time. As soon as more started to unlock the ability to hunt jedi was added in. So, please don't give us the whole "it has always been this way" and "you knew what to expect" rebuttles. Cause it wasn't ever stated in the manual OR in the game until they implemented BH v Jedi that they would be hunted. Yes they said the road was hard and yadda yadaa, but the grind in itself takes 4 months minimum just to get jedi. I think thats more than enough of an excuse for jedi to have more power. I personally think they should take out xp loss, because jedi are not what there were and are seriously lacking in power.
That is completely false.
As soon as the first Jedi unlocked on each server the visibility system existed that placed them on the bounty hunter terminals. Many of the new Jedi immediately got on the terminals for showing off.
As soon as the first Jedi unlocked on each server a system message was sent to every player stating that Darth Vader wanted you to attack all Jedi on sight.
Every Jedi was given a TEF (temporary enemy flag)whenever they used their lightsaber or force powers. This meant opposing faction players could attack any Jedi they saw at will.
Incorrect. I remember when they were SUPPOSED to be on the boards (after it was announced that jedi would be on the terminals)but like many things they did not work. As such there was 2-4 weeks where there was no bounties. Yes, Saber TEF existed, but that was not what I was talking about. Also this was a time where a single jedi could completely dismantle 6+ players at once.
iskareot
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:37 pm
#34
Lol Look in my sigs clicky -- lol weeeeeeeeeeeeeeee for old Jedi weeeeeeeeeeeee lol
Auraveda wrote:
Fugitron wrote:
MrDecipher wrote:
When you choose to be jedi you know 1 thing for sure. You will be attackable by BHs always has been this was always will be this way. Don't ever expect this to change if you don't want to have to fight BHers play Jedi academy or something. The game is how it is. Jedi has from day one been given the role of a PvP oriented class with forced PvP.
When the first jedi appeared the BH system didn't exist. What I mean is that no player could hunt another at that time. As soon as more started to unlock the ability to hunt jedi was added in. So, please don't give us the whole "it has always been this way" and "you knew what to expect" rebuttles. Cause it wasn't ever stated in the manual OR in the game until they implemented BH v Jedi that they would be hunted. Yes they said the road was hard and yadda yadaa, but the grind in itself takes 4 months minimum just to get jedi. I think thats more than enough of an excuse for jedi to have more power. I personally think they should take out xp loss, because jedi are not what there were and are seriously lacking in power.
That's only really a valid argument if you happen to be one of those first folks to unlock Jedi. So yeah, if you're one of those first few, then by all means scream till you're blue in the face about how this isn't what it was like when you unlocked, that you never expected to have to PVP or be hunted.
And using the argument that it isn't in the manual is just laughable. Is ANYTHING in the original manual right anymore? The game has changed so much that the only constants now are change and bugs.
Man do I miss being able to kill 2 or 3 that came at me...lol.. tefed and all.
Message Edited by iskareot on 09-20-2005 03:40 PM
Crash752
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:39 pm
#35
The reason you aren't satisfied with Jedi is because you are exactly the type of player that should never have been able to become a Jedi let alone stay a Jedi for longer than a few days. Everytime the Jedi game is made easier it is made less rewarding.
Fugitron wrote:
Lemme put it this way, when I chose to go jedi it was different whenI got there, and then it changed some more, and then again and then the CU. No one knew "what to expect" when they got there. For me, I saw the power and said "I gots to get me some of that," and that was it. Too bad when I finished the power just was not what it was when I decided to go jedi. Make sense?
Auraveda wrote:
That's only really a valid argument if you happen to be one of those first folks to unlock Jedi. So yeah, if you're one of those first few, then by all means scream till you're blue in the face about how this isn't what it was like when you unlocked, that you never expected to have to PVP or be hunted.
And using the argument that it isn't in the manual is just laughable. Is ANYTHING in the original manual right anymore? The game has changed so much that the only constants now are change and bugs.
EcadMistflier
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:42 pm
#36
JeetBadwarrior wrote:
not sure why you would choose jedi as a class if you dont like pvp or dont care too..im befuddled, bewildered, and shocked you would make such a move..it doent make any logically sense at all...all i can think of is this
1. you read the bh boards and jedi boards about jedi getting killed by bh...you must think this doesnt apply to you the ole it wont happen to me..ill never be on the terms..
2. you choose a class that in order to gain frs you must be perma overt(SF) and fight other jedi....unless you just want a full temp paddy to show of to your friends in that thecase refer to #1
*shakeshead* /ponder
Well as one who has never shunned the pvp nor craved the "uberd00d" spotlight let me see if I can help you with that.
To answer your question as to why, as a post cu jedi, one may not desire to participate in "forced" pvp. I rather suspect it has to do with proptional benefit vs. risk. In the early day the Jedi experienced a grind equal to or greater in some/all respects to the post cu jedi but their proportional power ( benefit ) was much, much greater. Thus when the full template Jedi encountered the best MBH of the day ( all those trees they had to have that they no longer need to master BH now diluting their effectiveness ) the Jedi ( clad in the best composite armor available and Godlike stims ) felt that their sacrifice was worthwhile. They were truly the alpha class.
Now the MBH in it's various hybrid combinations coupled with the greatly diluted stature and power of the Jedi ( given the bread crumbs of no group vis and spin groups ) find that they are mere shadows of their older siblings although their required xp grind is still significant and vastly more difficult then any benefit would warrant. Thus, the risk/benefit of simply becoming a much improved/improving MBH templates preyis not appealing to half of the equation in the Jedi / MBH game dynamic.
Hope that helps.
Fugitron
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:42 pm
#37
Crash752 wrote:
The reason you aren't satisfied with Jedi is because you are exactly the type of player that should never have been able to become a Jedi let alone stay a Jedi for longer than a few days. Everytime the Jedi game is made easier it is made less rewarding.
Fugitron wrote:
Lemme put it this way, when I chose to go jedi it was different whenI got there, and then it changed some more, and then again and then the CU. No one knew "what to expect" when they got there. For me, I saw the power and said "I gots to get me some of that," and that was it. Too bad when I finished the power just was not what it was when I decided to go jedi. Make sense?
Auraveda wrote:
That's only really a valid argument if you happen to be one of those first folks to unlock Jedi. So yeah, if you're one of those first few, then by all means scream till you're blue in the face about how this isn't what it was like when you unlocked, that you never expected to have to PVP or be hunted.
And using the argument that it isn't in the manual is just laughable. Is ANYTHING in the original manual right anymore? The game has changed so much that the only constants now are change and bugs.
What makes your $15 worth more than mine. Its people like you who make the forums and the game a bad place in general. Go play WoW if you can't handle suggestions or criticism, they will baby you like you want to be.
.... oh and btw, Sometimes being jedi means more than killing other people. Think about it.
Jacella
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:43 pm
#38
Fugitron wrote:
Ever heard of the term, the first generation plants the seeds and the next enjoy the shade? Cause I'm not sure you do. I realize you want jedi to be more powerful, but its not gonna happen.... MAYBE via the FRS it may, but I highly doubt it.
As for you inreasing the difficulty, that is prolly the most ridiculous logic. Unless they said "ok jedi you have an option, we can make you uber and increase your pain and suffering OR we can leave you how it is and take away xp loss, we know you had a longer grind so you deserve some extra benefits for it" .... which would you choose? I have a feeling you would go for the first one, whereas I for the second.
You need to realize that back when we unlocked they were all primarily power gamers who loved PvP and loved the power they got for the work. Well, like it or not before these new jedi even became glowy they began to slowly make jedi less effective to the watered down version of jedi that we have today.
My suggestion instead of complaining and saying that everyone needs to work as hard as we did in order for jedi to be "uber" again you can instead support and understand the ideas of these new jedi. They don't wanna lose any power either, however as it stands they are seriously GIMPED in terms of saber damage which unless you played your jedi with only 3 of your pearls in it for a day you might not realize how hard it is.
I can COMPLETELY understand why the new jedi are getting VERY aggitated against these BHs who have the good armor and weaponry. They are prolly the alts of those early jedi.
I know it seems like I am kinda ranting, but Jacella you are one of the most outspoken voices in this forum, but I have seen NOTHING in the past weeks from you actually "helping" anyone. All you do is try to prove people wrong and shoot down ideas such as this one instead of maybe taking a step back and realizing they are seeing things from an entirely different perspective. I don't want to sound insulting, but it frustrates me to hear older jedi wanting things to be so much harder... and for what? The POSSIBILITY of being more powerful.... sorry that ended with the CU.
Firstly, the length of grind is the worst of all possible reasons for increased power. So, you ground for 8 months...and now you are done and have nothing that can hurt you..yadda yadda yadda....the kindling is set, the fire would insue.
The reason that jedi need to maintain a higher level is because of consistant dangers. This needs to be amplified to account for an increase of power. Finished templates will have that with the FRS. Padawans need to have it with BH's knocking at their door.
The pearl/crystal drops are part of the problem, yes. The easy fix would be to make good and quality tune like Prem and flawless...but that makes too much sense.
My personal viewpoint is that they should have never removed hologrinding. It ensured that the people who attained padawan were fully versed in the game. I feel it's retarded that a Padawan has to ask how to craft a saber because they never did a crafting profession. I am amazed that there are so many jedi that are completely clueless about 50% of the professions. There are people that started in May that have completed templates...they only did 1 elite profession (prolly a combat prof) and never did pvp prior to donning their robes. Is it any wonder that they think that jedi is gimped?
Yes, a longer grind is required and needed...yes, padawans need to be hunted...yes, xp loss from cloning needs to return...yes, gank squads should be allowed....yes, starport pvpers should be shot on sight...yes, I want the risk factor in this game to increase for jedi. And yes, BH's that fail numerous missions consecutively should be hunted by other BH's....that's called fun!
Crash752
Tue Sep 20, 2005 1:44 pm
#39
I hunted Jedi on the first day players unlocked on my server. Jedi were never able to dismantle 6+ players at once. Saber TEF existed as did many other risks and set backsand this fact alone disproves your entire arguement.
Fugitron wrote:
Crash752 wrote:
Fugitron wrote:
MrDecipher wrote:
When you choose to be jedi you know 1 thing for sure. You will be attackable by BHs always has been this was always will be this way. Don't ever expect this to change if you don't want to have to fight BHers play Jedi academy or something. The game is how it is. Jedi has from day one been given the role of a PvP oriented class with forced PvP.
When the first jedi appeared the BH system didn't exist. What I mean is that no player could hunt another at that time. As soon as more started to unlock the ability to hunt jedi was added in. So, please don't give us the whole "it has always been this way" and "you knew what to expect" rebuttles. Cause it wasn't ever stated in the manual OR in the game until they implemented BH v Jedi that they would be hunted. Yes they said the road was hard and yadda yadaa, but the grind in itself takes 4 months minimum just to get jedi. I think thats more than enough of an excuse for jedi to have more power. I personally think they should take out xp loss, because jedi are not what there were and are seriously lacking in power.
That is completely false.
As soon as the first Jedi unlocked on each server the visibility system existed that placed them on the bounty hunter terminals. Many of the new Jedi immediately got on the terminals for showing off.
As soon as the first Jedi unlocked on each server a system message was sent to every player stating that Darth Vader wanted you to attack all Jedi on sight.
Every Jedi was given a TEF (temporary enemy flag)whenever they used their lightsaber or force powers. This meant opposing faction players could attack any Jedi they saw at will.
Incorrect. I remember when they were SUPPOSED to be on the boards (after it was announced that jedi would be on the terminals)but like many things they did not work. As such there was 2-4 weeks where there was no bounties. Yes, Saber TEF existed, but that was not what I was talking about. Also this was a time where a single jedi could completely dismantle 6+ players at once.