Jedi Archive
Thread: Changes that SWG needs to survive
Darkvenegence wrote:
all valid points and well thought out for sure my friend,however this game threw star wars continuity out the window when the first jedi unlocked,people seem to care more about what equals enjoyable gameplay and is money well spent for their online gaming experience than thinking that they really shouldnt be able to dosolo something likenecrosisbecause they arent one of the best 3 jedi ever in the star wars galaxies,besides,necrosis is dead,i wanna solo his clone not him
Message Edited by Darkvenegence on 09-08-2005 04:08 AM
Message Edited by gera on 09-08-2005 04:31 AM
KingoftheGrind wrote:
/agree on everything except the first and last . Pearls should never be flawless again , it will definatly unbalance the game, an occasional premuim from krayte ancients would be ok though .
" DO NOT bring back the FRS untill it is fully designed to be the coolest thing ever. I am hoping for fun and content as i make my way to master jedi " .
Well, since the FRS would definitely be unbalanced with a few of the pre-Good-only-dropping krayt hunters and rich boys having flawless premiums locked safely away in their anti-decay kits, perhaps we should consider suggesting that ALL pearls and crystals above Good be retroactively converted to an untuned Good state. Come to think of it, maybe we should suggest they eliminate ADK's entirely, so that the players rich enough to afford ten or more ADK's and complete suits of health-enhanced RIS armor and the best T-21 (or Necrosis, or whatever) rifle possible aren't permanently locked into their most-favored-nation status. Or would that be too much of a good thing?
About the only thing on the list in this thread that doesn't sound like a personal pet peeve of the original poster is the one asking for removal of the combat-level-based damage multiplier. On that one, I agree wholeheartedly. I bought a game that once contained nine expansive, adventure-filled worlds, where every step was a hazard and a challenge. I now pay for the maintenance on ten worlds, nine of which are now either complete cakewalks or instant death depending on the level of my toons. The tenth is more of a super-theme park than a world, and while pockets of it are fun and challenging, those pockets are a mere sliver of what the whole game once contained.
All the rest of the original post can be summarized as the ranting of yet another PvP snob. Bring back all the TEF's?? Yeah, riiiight....
SOE knows, as do all the other publishers of MMORPGs -- including Blizzard, who went so far on this issue as to publish WoW without a PvP system at all at first -- that the #1 thing that drives people away from their games is NOT the quality of the game, or the way the game is set up or balanced, but a few sour apples in the PvP community who consider it their rare privilege to drive less-well-equipped victims (as in, not equipped with the latest exploited items?) thoroughly into the ground.
Muse on your own attitudes the next time you see someone farming the NPCs in your back yard. The shoe may well fit, though hopefully it will not.
gera wrote:
Darkvenegence wrote:
all valid points and well thought out for sure my friend,however this game threw star wars continuity out the window when the first jedi unlocked,people seem to care more about what equals enjoyable gameplay and is money well spent for their online gaming experience than thinking that they really shouldnt be able to dosolo something likenecrosisbecause they arent one of the best 3 jedi ever in the star wars galaxies,besides,necrosis is dead,i wanna solo his clone not him
Message Edited by Darkvenegence on 09-08-2005 04:08 AM
*cough* it was Gravious who is dead, not Necrosis..
I suggest to better watch movies before talking about continunity.
And on the main subject, first & last, rest is "I-win, I-want-to-grief" options.
Message Edited by gera on 09-08-2005 04:31 AM
RogueLeader05 wrote:
gera wrote:
Darkvenegence wrote:
all valid points and well thought out for sure my friend,however this game threw star wars continuity out the window when the first jedi unlocked,people seem to care more about what equals enjoyable gameplay and is money well spent for their online gaming experience than thinking that they really shouldnt be able to dosolo something likenecrosisbecause they arent one of the best 3 jedi ever in the star wars galaxies,besides,necrosis is dead,i wanna solo his clone not him
Message Edited by Darkvenegence on 09-08-2005 04:08 AM
*cough* it was Gravious who is dead, not Necrosis..
I suggest to better watch movies before talking about continunity.
And on the main subject, first & last, rest is "I-win, I-want-to-grief" options.
Message Edited by gera on 09-08-2005 04:31 AM
A small mistake on the posters part,but no big deal because if you want to get technical,"Necrosis" is already dead as well and whenever we face him we are in fact fighting another "clone" anyhow........Unless you fought this enemy 1st in all the galaxies & defeated him before anyone else
thank you,my thoughts exactly,im sure i can be forgiven for being more interested in actually enjoying the game than getting my star wars knowledge up to par..lol
i politely asked all flames to be kept of this thread,you wouldnt like it if i called you a PvE cake eating care bear would you?,of course not,but if you come into my town and kill my NPCs under my nose without any recourse for that action and think its okthen thats exactly what you are,this is supposed to be a war,and if i walked up to an imperial and screamed in his face "im a rebel" i would fully expect to be stabbed in the throat for it,it hasnothing to do with PvP snobbery,its simply enjoying an element of realism that in my eyes didnt need changed
Iakimo wrote:
KingoftheGrind wrote:
/agree on everything except the first and last . Pearls should never be flawless again , it will definatly unbalance the game, an occasional premuim from krayte ancients would be ok though .
" DO NOT bring back the FRS untill it is fully designed to be the coolest thing ever. I am hoping for fun and content as i make my way to master jedi " .
Well, since the FRS would definitely be unbalanced with a few of the pre-Good-only-dropping krayt hunters and rich boys having flawless premiums locked safely away in their anti-decay kits, perhaps we should consider suggesting that ALL pearls and crystals above Good be retroactively converted to an untuned Good state. Come to think of it, maybe we should suggest they eliminate ADK's entirely, so that the players rich enough to afford ten or more ADK's and complete suits of health-enhanced RIS armor and the best T-21 (or Necrosis, or whatever) rifle possible aren't permanently locked into their most-favored-nation status. Or would that be too much of a good thing?
About the only thing on the list in this thread that doesn't sound like a personal pet peeve of the original poster is the one asking for removal of the combat-level-based damage multiplier. On that one, I agree wholeheartedly. I bought a game that once contained nine expansive, adventure-filled worlds, where every step was a hazard and a challenge. I now pay for the maintenance on ten worlds, nine of which are now either complete cakewalks or instant death depending on the level of my toons. The tenth is more of a super-theme park than a world, and while pockets of it are fun and challenging, those pockets are a mere sliver of what the whole game once contained.
All the rest of the original post can be summarized as the ranting of yet another PvP snob. Bring back all the TEF's?? Yeah, riiiight....
SOE knows, as do all the other publishers of MMORPGs -- including Blizzard, who went so far on this issue as to publish WoW without a PvP system at all at first -- that the #1 thing that drives people away from their games is NOT the quality of the game, or the way the game is set up or balanced, but a few sour apples in the PvP community who consider it their rare privilege to drive less-well-equipped victims (as in, not equipped with the latest exploited items?) thoroughly into the ground.
Muse on your own attitudes the next time you see someone farming the NPCs in your back yard. The shoe may well fit, though hopefully it will not.
Message Edited by Darkvenegence on 09-08-2005 05:00 AM
Iakimo wrote:
KingoftheGrind wrote:
/agree on everything except the first and last . Pearls should never be flawless again , it will definatly unbalance the game, an occasional premuim from krayte ancients would be ok though .
" DO NOT bring back the FRS untill it is fully designed to be the coolest thing ever. I am hoping for fun and content as i make my way to master jedi " .
Well, since the FRS would definitely be unbalanced with a few of the pre-Good-only-dropping krayt hunters and rich boys having flawless premiums locked safely away in their anti-decay kits, perhaps we should consider suggesting that ALL pearls and crystals above Good be retroactively converted to an untuned Good state. Come to think of it, maybe we should suggest they eliminate ADK's entirely, so that the players rich enough to afford ten or more ADK's and complete suits of health-enhanced RIS armor and the best T-21 (or Necrosis, or whatever) rifle possible aren't permanently locked into their most-favored-nation status. Or would that be too much of a good thing?
About the only thing on the list in this thread that doesn't sound like a personal pet peeve of the original poster is the one asking for removal of the combat-level-based damage multiplier. On that one, I agree wholeheartedly. I bought a game that once contained nine expansive, adventure-filled worlds, where every step was a hazard and a challenge. I now pay for the maintenance on ten worlds, nine of which are now either complete cakewalks or instant death depending on the level of my toons. The tenth is more of a super-theme park than a world, and while pockets of it are fun and challenging, those pockets are a mere sliver of what the whole game once contained.
All the rest of the original post can be summarized as the ranting of yet another PvP snob. Bring back all the TEF's?? Yeah, riiiight....
SOE knows, as do all the other publishers of MMORPGs -- including Blizzard, who went so far on this issue as to publish WoW without a PvP system at all at first -- that the #1 thing that drives people away from their games is NOT the quality of the game, or the way the game is set up or balanced, but a few sour apples in the PvP community who consider it their rare privilege to drive less-well-equipped victims (as in, not equipped with the latest exploited items?) thoroughly into the ground.
Muse on your own attitudes the next time you see someone farming the NPCs in your back yard. The shoe may well fit, though hopefully it will not.
Just on the PvP point from WoW - your are so right. In alot of MMORPG's the developers know the focus on a good game isnt the PvP as it causes bad mouthing and well equipped whores to have the advantage. Heck even EQ2 hasnt god PvP until the next expansion was released...
Darkvenegence wrote:
I've been looking at the jedi boards,server boards alot lately,and seems like everyday theres another person who has quit the game,mainly vets and its all for the same reasons,they're unhappy with the way we have been and are being treated by the developers of SWG and the implementation of the CU which in many peoples eyes will be the death of this gamei decided to do some surveys on different server forums,my own kauri,the big 2 ahazi and bria as well as the jedi forums,the survey was asking what peoples preferences were pre-CU or post CU,the answer was almost unanimous,at least 98% of the replies were for pre-CU the occasional chef or something would post and say he/she prefers the CU but that was definetly the exception and not the rule,now,my point is people are leaving the game on a daily basis and the ones that are hanging around for the most part are miserable and dont enjoy what the game has degenerated into,so i ask you this,how much longer will the massive amounts of players who are unhappy keep on paying to play a game that they dont enjoy?,imho its only a matter of time till the massive of amounts of players left that are unhappy wake up one day and decide that this game is no longer worth the money and time it consumesbasically that means we have a major problem,SWG is on a ticking timebomb of destruction unless the devs use their common sense,and realise this,and not only realise it but act on it ASAP to save the loyal players that are left from cancelling their subscriptions,for that to happen some major changes need to be implemented which im going to outline,ill be honest,some of these suggestions are based on personal preference,others are based on what i truly beleive will help save our beloved SWGin my opinion the CU has brought some good things,mainly bad but some good things too,so my proposal is we get a game that is merged with the good elements of the CU and pre CU combined,ill also state that this list isnt set in any specific order,im just gonna type it as it comes to me1) fix premiums and flawless to drop so everyone has a fair chance at the brass hoop,franky i dont care if the developers dont want us farming them,we pay to play this game and if we want to farm krayts for high end loot then that should be our decision,not theirs,if thats what we enjoy doing then we should be allowed to2) give us back the combat queue3) get rid of the combat level and damage multiplier so we can solo again if we want to,i beleive alot of the resentment towardsSOE now comes from the fact that we've been forced to group to do anything worth doing,no-one likes being forced to do anything or being told what to do4) get rid of elemental damage or at least bring in ALL the other named crystals,seeing nothing but sunriders and banes hearts is so reduntant now5) give us back the old combat system,this root and snare system is a joke and makes no sense whatsoever,the speed of it too is mindnumbingly slow,however the one thing that should be kept from this system is the need to use other specials so we dont have to spam dervish over and over,a little variety will make the pre CU system better than its ever been imho6) bring back TEF's for everthing,this to me was the first step in the wrong direction that SOE took,if a BH jumps my friend,its so unrealistic to expect me to stand there and watch and not do anything about it,also if someone comes to my city covert and kills my NPCs for faction and loot its lame that i cant kill him for it if im overt,if someone makes their faction affilitation so readily apparent then they should be in danger from the enemy,this is supposed to be a war not a carebear fest6) bring back the FRS asap,being a full template jedi with nothing to do is the most frustrating thing everthis is all i can think of for now,im sure ill amend this and update it when i think of more things, and please by all means add suggestions and opinions,but i ask you to please keep the flames to a minumum,we have hundreds of other threads we can flame on without doing it on this onethank you for reading this,i sincerly hope that the developers heed these words before its too late
Message Edited by Darkvenegence on 09-08-2005 02:51 AM
Number 1: yes fix prem and flawless pearl drop. But make it nearly impossible to "farm". Maybe give everyone the possibility to get one in a really hard quest(one time quest only) and 1 of 50 Ancients drop one.... or maybe 1 of 100?.
Don't flame this, think about.... its hard to "farm" Ancients and then you still don't know if the tune will be good... so they're rare but they exist and everyone got a chance to get one.
i wouldnt mind that at all if the drop ratio was adjusted to drop prems and flawless less,just so long as they're back ingame,with jedi having to depend on loot to make our number 1 weapon,its unfairto forceus to have to make it with substandard components,which is exactly what a "good" pearl is.
AlexK83 wrote:
Darkvenegence wrote:
I've been looking at the jedi boards,server boards alot lately,and seems like everyday theres another person who has quit the game,mainly vets and its all for the same reasons,they're unhappy with the way we have been and are being treated by the developers of SWG and the implementation of the CU which in many peoples eyes will be the death of this game
i decided to do some surveys on different server forums,my own kauri,the big 2 ahazi and bria as well as the jedi forums,the survey was asking what peoples preferences were pre-CU or post CU,the answer was almost unanimous,at least 98% of the replies were for pre-CU the occasional chef or something would post and say he/she prefers the CU but that was definetly the exception and not the rule,now,my point is people are leaving the game on a daily basis and the ones that are hanging around for the most part are miserable and dont enjoy what the game has degenerated into,so i ask you this,how much longer will the massive amounts of players who are unhappy keep on paying to play a game that they dont enjoy?,imho its only a matter of time till the massive of amounts of players left that are unhappy wake up one day and decide that this game is no longer worth the money and time it consumes
basically that means we have a major problem,SWG is on a ticking timebomb of destruction unless the devs use their common sense,and realise this,and not only realise it but act on it ASAP to save the loyal players that are left from cancelling their subscriptions,for that to happen some major changes need to be implemented which im going to outline,ill be honest,some of these suggestions are based on personal preference,others are based on what i truly beleive will help save our beloved SWG
in my opinion the CU has brought some good things,mainly bad but some good things too,so my proposal is we get a game that is merged with the good elements of the CU and pre CU combined,ill also state that this list isnt set in any specific order,im just gonna type it as it comes to me
1) fix premiums and flawless to drop so everyone has a fair chance at the brass hoop,franky i dont care if the developers dont want us farming them,we pay to play this game and if we want to farm krayts for high end loot then that should be our decision,not theirs,if thats what we enjoy doing then we should be allowed to
2) give us back the combat queue
3) get rid of the combat level and damage multiplier so we can solo again if we want to,i beleive alot of the resentment towards
SOE now comes from the fact that we've been forced to group to do anything worth doing,no-one likes being forced to do anything or being told what to do
4) get rid of elemental damage or at least bring in ALL the other named crystals,seeing nothing but sunriders and banes hearts is so reduntant now
5) give us back the old combat system,this root and snare system is a joke and makes no sense whatsoever,the speed of it too is mindnumbingly slow,however the one thing that should be kept from this system is the need to use other specials so we dont have to spam dervish over and over,a little variety will make the pre CU system better than its ever been imho
6) bring back TEF's for everthing,this to me was the first step in the wrong direction that SOE took,if a BH jumps my friend,its so unrealistic to expect me to stand there and watch and not do anything about it,also if someone comes to my city covert and kills my NPCs for faction and loot its lame that i cant kill him for it if im overt,if someone makes their faction affilitation so readily apparent then they should be in danger from the enemy,this is supposed to be a war not a carebear fest
6) bring back the FRS asap,being a full template jedi with nothing to do is the most frustrating thing ever
this is all i can think of for now,im sure ill amend this and update it when i think of more things, and please by all means add suggestions and opinions,but i ask you to please keep the flames to a minumum,we have hundreds of other threads we can flame on without doing it on this one
thank you for reading this,i sincerly hope that the developers heed these words before its too late
Message Edited by Darkvenegence on 09-08-2005 02:51 AM
Number 1: yes fix prem and flawless pearl drop. But make it nearly impossible to "farm". Maybe give everyone the possibility to get one in a really hard quest(one time quest only) and 1 of 50 Ancients drop one.... or maybe 1 of 100?.
Don't flame this, think about.... its hard to "farm" Ancients and then you still don't know if the tune will be good... so they're rare but they exist and everyone got a chance to get one.
Message Edited by Darkvenegence on 09-08-2005 05:10 AM
Azdraik wrote:
Hate to say it but SWG was dying long before the CU came out.
Darkvenegence wrote:
I've been looking at the jedi boards,server boards alot lately,and seems like everyday theres another person who has quit the game,mainly vets and its all for the same reasons,they're unhappy with the way we have been and are being treated by the developers of SWG and the implementation of the CU which in many peoples eyes will be the death of this game
i decided to do some surveys on different server forums,my own kauri,the big 2 ahazi and bria as well as the jedi forums,the survey was asking what peoples preferences were pre-CU or post CU,the answer was almost unanimous,at least 98% of the replies were for pre-CU the occasional chef or something would post and say he/she prefers the CU but that was definetly the exception and not the rule,now,my point is people are leaving the game on a daily basis and the ones that are hanging around for the most part are miserable and dont enjoy what the game has degenerated into,so i ask you this,how much longer will the massive amounts of players who are unhappy keep on paying to play a game that they dont enjoy?,imho its only a matter of time till the massive of amounts of players left that are unhappy wake up one day and decide that this game is no longer worth the money and time it consumes
basically that means we have a major problem,SWG is on a ticking timebomb of destruction unless the devs use their common sense,and realise this,and not only realise it but act on it ASAP to save the loyal players that are left from cancelling their subscriptions,for that to happen some major changes need to be implemented which im going to outline,ill be honest,some of these suggestions are based on personal preference,others are based on what i truly beleive will help save our beloved SWG
in my opinion the CU has brought some good things,mainly bad but some good things too,so my proposal is we get a game that is merged with the good elements of the CU and pre CU combined,ill also state that this list isnt set in any specific order,im just gonna type it as it comes to me
1) fix premiums and flawless to drop so everyone has a fair chance at the brass hoop,franky i dont care if the developers dont want us farming them,we pay to play this game and if we want to farm krayts for high end loot then that should be our decision,not theirs,if thats what we enjoy doing then we should be allowed to
2) give us back the combat queue
3) get rid of the combat level and damage multiplier so we can solo again if we want to,i beleive alot of the resentment towards
SOE now comes from the fact that we've been forced to group to do anything worth doing,no-one likes being forced to do anything or being told what to do
4) get rid of elemental damage or at least bring in ALL the other named crystals,seeing nothing but sunriders and banes hearts is so reduntant now
5) give us back the old combat system,this root and snare system is a joke and makes no sense whatsoever,the speed of it too is mindnumbingly slow,however the one thing that should be kept from this system is the need to use other specials so we dont have to spam dervish over and over,a little variety will make the pre CU system better than its ever been imho
6) bring back TEF's for everthing,this to me was the first step in the wrong direction that SOE took,if a BH jumps my friend,its so unrealistic to expect me to stand there and watch and not do anything about it,also if someone comes to my city covert and kills my NPCs for faction and loot its lame that i cant kill him for it if im overt,if someone makes their faction affilitation so readily apparent then they should be in danger from the enemy,this is supposed to be a war not a carebear fest
6) bring back the FRS asap,beinga full template jedi with nothing to do is the most frustrating thing ever
this is all i can think of for now,im sure ill amend this and update it when i think of more things, and please by all means add suggestions and opinions,but i ask you to please keep the flames to a minumum,we have hundreds of other threads we can flame on without doing it on this one
thank you for reading this,i sincerly hope that the developers heed these words before its too late
Message Edited by Darkvenegence on 09-08-2005 02:51 AM
I agree with everything you said.
I would even go so far as to say, the OLD system was actually fine, and only really needed the elimination of DOT's and a few tweaks to a few professions in order to have been better than the really crtappy CU gameplay we suffer through now.
The CU suxxors.
I only feel lucky to have actually been able to play the old system. A BRAND NEW TOON that started out as THE JEDI, Crafting sabers with Pearls actually in the scematic, XP losss, Saber TEF, Group TEF, (perma-death was a little too much) ad infinitum.
I feel sorry for people who never got to expereince that system, becuase although it was tough, and had it's drawbacks, it was FUN! It also made you a better player, to play through 20+ (avg.)professions, and really work to improve at PvP, and become a lot more knowledgable about every aspect of the game in general. (You never heard noob Jedi say, "How do I craft a saber?" lol).
But, in the end...............
Most of the people you are addressing in your post, have either left the game, or only hang out here once in a while becuase of the friends they have here. (And I think as soon as a few more MMO's are released, they'll be leaving too).
People don't "play" the game like the used to.
People can't "Play" the game like the used to.
And as so many people here like to remind me, it's not the same game, and I should get over it.
I'm over it, but I still miss the old game, and feel sorry for people who never got a chance to play one of the most innovative, and detailed MMO's on the market.
Now it's just another clone, and don't think even the great suggestions you've made, could restore this game to it's former glory.
R.I.P. Pre-CU SWG.
Welcome to console gaming at it's finest.
Darkvenegence wrote:
i politely asked all flames to be kept of this thread,you wouldnt like it if i called you a PvE cake eating care bear would you?,of course not,but if you come into my town and kill my NPCs under my nose without any recourse for that action then thats exactly what you are,this is supposed to be a war,and if i walked up to an imperial and screamed in his face "im a rebel" i would fully expect to be stabbed in the throat for it,it hasnothing to do with PvP snobbery,its simply enjoying an element of realism that in my eyes didnt need changed
Well, actually it did need to be changed, because the stuff wasn't just in "your town." It was in any city where (as was the case on my server) any noobcovert rebel risked exposure by a stormtrooper, followed by instant death at the hands of Imperial-player gank squads who lived for such moments, especially in cities like Kaadara. Of course, the gankers justified their aggressiveness by saying, "Well, if you're a Rebel, you need to be in hiding..." which rings about as sincerely as the contrition of Mr. Toad after his wild ride.
And then, of course, there were the noobs coming into their faction's respective theme parks (both the Emperor's Retreat and the Rebel bases on Corellia and Dantooine) TEF'd and wounded, with the occasional overt opposite-faction player lying in ambush near the entrance waiting to pick off an easy target and blow their bikes.
All to say, TEFs hardly need to be restored "to save the game." For crying out loud, TEFs were eliminated to save the game.
Iakimo wrote:
Darkvenegence wrote:
i politely asked all flames to be kept of this thread,you wouldnt like it if i called you a PvE cake eating care bear would you?,of course not,but if you come into my town and kill my NPCs under my nose without any recourse for that action then thats exactly what you are,this is supposed to be a war,and if i walked up to an imperial and screamed in his face "im a rebel" i would fully expect to be stabbed in the throat for it,it hasnothing to do with PvP snobbery,its simply enjoying an element of realism that in my eyes didnt need changed
Well, actually it did need to be changed, because the stuff wasn't just in "your town." It was in any city where (as was the case on my server) any noobcovert rebel risked exposure by a stormtrooper, followed by instant death at the hands of Imperial-player gank squads who lived for such moments, especially in cities like Kaadara. Of course, the gankers justified their aggressiveness by saying, "Well, if you're a Rebel, you need to be in hiding..." which rings about as sincerely as the contrition of Mr. Toad after his wild ride.
And then, of course, there were the noobs coming into their faction's respective theme parks (both the Emperor's Retreat and the Rebel bases on Corellia and Dantooine) TEF'd and wounded, with the occasional overt opposite-faction player lying in ambush near the entrance waiting to pick off an easy target and blow their bikes.
All to say, TEFs hardly need to be restored "to save the game." For crying out loud, TEFs were eliminated to save the game.
lol.. come on!!!,TEFs were fun didnt you ever enjoy running out of theed cloner unbuffed and wounded and charging someones swoop just for a laugh?knowing full well someone was gonna one shot you,thats the aspect i miss of the TEF system more than anything,because it was harmless fun,sadly though alll the other stuff you said was correct,people did do stuff like that but the way i look at it people will find a way to ruin anything in this game no matter what it is,before the TEF system was removed i never once questioned it,even when i was being killed every 10 minutes by a group of dark jedi out at the imp reb spawn when i was grinding my melee stacker template,during that time my PvP rating fell from around 1400 to around 700,and as frustrating as it was i accepted it as a consequence of me being caught with my pants down and making it obvious that i was a rebel