Jedi Archive
Thread: Remove alot of the Jedi by disabling visibility from NPC's
PhantomNIR
Wed Sep 28, 2005 5:11 am
#14
KRAKEN666 wrote:
Being on the terminals should be a result of participating in the GCW, not just participating in regular npc missions. It seems soe is punishing any jedi who would like to get a high end loot item and would like to try a challanging quest. BH have boss missions now, why cant we use the tougher npc missions as our boss missions? This would keep alot of bored jedi out of the GCW, which seems to be what everyone wants who isnt jedi.
QFE
A variable method for this to work could be:
1) A Jedi choosing "On Leave" status does not generate vis from any NPC's
2) A Jedi choosing "Combatant" status gains vis from the GCW NPC's
3) A Jedi choosing "Special Forces" status gets vis from everything and BH content to boot 
Azino
Wed Sep 28, 2005 5:39 am
#15
I like the original poster's idea. I too have to perform a lightshow where-ever I go because I am on the terminals. I can't risk getting caught without mybuffs running - I have very little defense otherwise. I really don't know how anyone manages to stay off of the terminals.... I know some people do because I know near full-template people that have never been hunted. It's a mystery to me though.
People rarely actually *see* me because I spend most of my time cloaked. Unfortunately that also creates visibility.
I could clear my name by allowing myself to be killed but.... I don't wanna die 
Tactical_Dave
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:17 am
#16
I disagree. Visibility is one of the few tools the devs have to maintain continuity and balancewith the SWG universe. Jedi are illegal. Jedi also run rampant on every planet. There would be even more Jedi running around if there were no predators hunting them. Visibility is population control, plain and simple. The more vis that's generated, the more population control you have.
If you want to make the point that continuity went out the window six months after SWG launched, fine. But removing npc vis would unbalance a big part of the "risk vs. reward" concept. That would be the 'risk' half of the equation. If youreduce the high risk factor, you then have to reduce the high reward factor to bring the game back into balance. That's when nerfs happen. Why have great rewards when it doesn't require great effort? This is why so many more Jedi exist now than before. This is also why Jedi has been nerfed down to a regular profession.
So if you want to see Jedi be something rare again, make it harder than heck to obtain. Of course, people will whine that they were 'promised' Jedi when they bought SWG. Therefore, SOE has the fun jobof strikinga balance between balance and what people want in a MMORPG.
The FRS is the answer. Sure, make Jedi attainable through some additional affort on anybody's part, but it will not have many strengths that a regular profession doesn't already have. It will also have the additional risk of vis in many situations. This alone will discourage many from getting Jedi. This accomplishes the balance part. The FRS offers the opportunity for an alpha class to the hard-core players. This must be two or even three times harder than regular Jedi, and must also have an artificial cap on the umber of players who can participate. This will again create balance without departing from continuity too much. It will also offer an endgame for the hardcore players: PVP. PVP is a game mechanic that you should not be predictable, and therefore more of a challenge. This is why the first FRS was a failure. It was so predictable in its implementation that players exploitedit to the nth degree.
You should accept visibility as a necessary evil, for the good of the game. Even though it makes a lot of people mad, especially when they have a BH death, it is a VITAL game mechanic.
MX13
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:23 am
#17
Great idea!
To simplify my thought's I'd say:
Remove NPC Vis, CRANK UP non-group player Vis!
HermanTheGerman
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:26 am
#18
Normally i agree with a lot you have to say msnil, but this time i dont...
I would like it we get a LOT MORE visibility and be made a little harder. Right now Jedi is as easy as it gets.
sas-quatch
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:29 am
#19
NO.
absolutly not.
for a month i was careful like you. only had 6 bh fights in all my time as jedi(just ofer a month now i belive) thats 1 bh a week on average, and disableing NPC vis is a bad bad idea. this gives the jedi half the vis and they will be out more. I play my jedi with the mentailty of avoiding vis at all cost. now i fell into the problem of not geting content. so i made the choice to toss vis out the window as soon as i could fight well enough to take care of my self..
so i say this, keep the npc vis. if you have to ket your macros run the wole time your walking around a city, your weaker then you probably should be. go ahead flame me, but in the end it comes down to this...
....learn to fight...or stay off the terms. and this comes from a newer paddie
**EDIT AFTER RE-READ**
its in the SW lore that during this timeperiod *regiardless of how many jedi thier are ingame i do understand its alternat time and sush* that jedi are to be hunted. everyone should know this, i can avoid vis so easy. yea it gets boring but yaknow. i have an alt i play actively if i want to go questing or pvping. Jedi is a whole different game. with different rules. learn them is al i mean. ive racked up vis recently half onpurpose because i like the ecitment of the *what if*, so if its really that hard on you, just dont do it. jedi is a game of patients(sp?)and dedication. i can avoid vis. for a while. and i still get to hang out with friends. but i also like having npc vis. it makes sence to me and adds a bit of danger that wouldnt normally be there.
absolutly not.
for a month i was careful like you. only had 6 bh fights in all my time as jedi(just ofer a month now i belive) thats 1 bh a week on average, and disableing NPC vis is a bad bad idea. this gives the jedi half the vis and they will be out more. I play my jedi with the mentailty of avoiding vis at all cost. now i fell into the problem of not geting content. so i made the choice to toss vis out the window as soon as i could fight well enough to take care of my self..
so i say this, keep the npc vis. if you have to ket your macros run the wole time your walking around a city, your weaker then you probably should be. go ahead flame me, but in the end it comes down to this...
....learn to fight...or stay off the terms. and this comes from a newer paddie
**EDIT AFTER RE-READ**
its in the SW lore that during this timeperiod *regiardless of how many jedi thier are ingame i do understand its alternat time and sush* that jedi are to be hunted. everyone should know this, i can avoid vis so easy. yea it gets boring but yaknow. i have an alt i play actively if i want to go questing or pvping. Jedi is a whole different game. with different rules. learn them is al i mean. ive racked up vis recently half onpurpose because i like the ecitment of the *what if*, so if its really that hard on you, just dont do it. jedi is a game of patients(sp?)and dedication. i can avoid vis. for a while. and i still get to hang out with friends. but i also like having npc vis. it makes sence to me and adds a bit of danger that wouldnt normally be there.
Message Edited by sas-quatch on 09-28-2005 09:41 AM
Message Edited by sas-quatch on 09-28-2005 09:42 AM
EvilMP
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:41 am
#20
Silly jedi I believe the guy in the first post was totally right they need to revamp cause of this lack luster BH hunting terms, I got hit twice in like 10 mins killing the first only to be taken out by the second cause I was drained by the first and had no time to regen/meditate my force pool back. (Mind you I used a holocron in the first fight cause the BH was impressive) There are alot of griefers out there when jedi hunt that will intently stand close enough to give you vis and hang around I mean come on SOE do something about this vis problem. Maybe if more Devs came on and seen what happens in locations like Black Watch Keep with the BH's and those same BH's alt's they use to build the vis on a jedi. Something needs to be done about this, not only that on the same note whatever happened with what the Dev's mentioned at the Fan Fest where Jedi would be able to go after a BH that just hunted them and ran away. But I really believe that jedi should have a terminal where if they wanted to hunt a galatic BH outlaw NPC or PVP they should have that option. Cause I mean look at episode 2 staying in the Star Wars Galaxy Obi-Wan and Anakin hunted that BH down and I think we should have that same option. This would balance the game more cause then the BH's would also have something to worry about.
/sign
Kev0r
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:44 am
#21
sas-quatch wrote:
....learn to fight...or stay off the terms. and this comes from a newer paddie
**EDIT AFTER RE-READ**
its in the SW lore that during this timeperiod *regiardless of how many jedi thier are ingame i do understand its alternat time and sush* that jedi are to be hunted. everyone should know this, i can avoid vis so easy. yea it gets boring but yaknow. i have an alt i play actively if i want to go questing or pvping. Jedi is a whole different game. with different rules. learn them is al i mean. ive racked up vis recently half onpurpose because i like the ecitment of the *what if*, so if its really that hard on you, just dont do it. jedi is a game of patients(sp?)and dedication. i can avoid vis. for a while. and i still get to hang out with friends. but i also like having npc vis. it makes sence to me and adds a bit of danger that wouldnt normally be there.
Message Edited by sas-quatch on 09-28-2005 09:41 AM
Message Edited by sas-quatch on 09-28-2005 09:42 AM
The focus wasn't so much on not being able to win, but on the amount of interference that BH can provide to the game.
That's why my take on it would be to spread out the level of involvement from BHs across the jedi population. Instead of some jedi being hunted multiple times a day, and otehrs not seeing a BH for weeks, revamp the terminals in order that the hunting is spread more evenly across the jedi on the terminals.
Durzel
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:48 am
#22
It wouldn't be so bad if you didn't get visibility from NPCs who you subsequently kill. I can see no logic whatsoever in an NPC giving you visibility when they are dead, unless they are getting straight on their invisible CB radio the moment they see you.
I would have no problem with NPC visibility if it wasn't an issue if you killed the NPCs that had seen you.
Then again, I don't even know why I'm proposing rational ideas when as far as I am aware your own Swoop gives you visibility.
I would have no problem with NPC visibility if it wasn't an issue if you killed the NPCs that had seen you.
Then again, I don't even know why I'm proposing rational ideas when as far as I am aware your own Swoop gives you visibility.
Saereth
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:49 am
#23
definatly agree I wish they'd rework the entire visibility system so other players have to report you with a /visreport command or something that is only useable if they've been within 32ms of you when you used your powers in say the past 30mins or so... -shrug- something other than the Janta wearing a loin cloth radioing the BH guild on naboo or my flash speeder running to the empire to report my jedi activity...
sas-quatch
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:53 am
#24
Kev0r wrote:
sas-quatch wrote:
....learn to fight...or stay off the terms. and this comes from a newer paddie
**EDIT AFTER RE-READ**
its in the SW lore that during this timeperiod *regiardless of how many jedi thier are ingame i do understand its alternat time and sush* that jedi are to be hunted. everyone should know this, i can avoid vis so easy. yea it gets boring but yaknow. i have an alt i play actively if i want to go questing or pvping. Jedi is a whole different game. with different rules. learn them is al i mean. ive racked up vis recently half onpurpose because i like the ecitment of the *what if*, so if its really that hard on you, just dont do it. jedi is a game of patients(sp?)and dedication. i can avoid vis. for a while. and i still get to hang out with friends. but i also like having npc vis. it makes sence to me and adds a bit of danger that wouldnt normally be there.Message Edited by sas-quatch on 09-28-2005 09:41 AM
Message Edited by sas-quatch on 09-28-2005 09:42 AM
The focus wasn't so much on not being able to win, but on the amount of interference that BH can provide to the game.That's why my take on it would be to spread out the level of involvement from BHs across the jedi population. Instead of some jedi being hunted multiple times a day, and otehrs not seeing a BH for weeks, revamp the terminals in order that the hunting is spread more evenly across the jedi on the terminals.
ok i see what your saying. well ive never really seen the new way the bh terms work i never really was a bh ever. not even with my alt. doesnt fit my playstyle.now i cant knock BH's because i have not had a$$hats. they have al been decent and good fights. so i will recind my statments as i see which angle your looking at it from., as i dont know/understand how exactly the terminals work.
DocSavag
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:55 am
#25
I acutally like this idea. The point of it is to get Jedi out of Coronet and into dungeons and questing where they aren't so obviously in the face of every player in the game. It seems to accomplish that.
The "Stay off the terminals" is such a copout answer when the methods for doing so involve doing nothing in the game that is worth doing. Give Jedi a way to stay hidden AND still have fun in the game and many will. Others will generate as much visibilty as they possibly can becaus they are looking for a fight.
There could be exclusions to the NPC rule. Things like GCW bases and NPCs inside cities could have visibilty turned on. This would force Jedi to not dominate base wars or engage in city activities unless they were willing to take the risk of pvp death.
The "Stay off the terminals" is such a copout answer when the methods for doing so involve doing nothing in the game that is worth doing. Give Jedi a way to stay hidden AND still have fun in the game and many will. Others will generate as much visibilty as they possibly can becaus they are looking for a fight.
There could be exclusions to the NPC rule. Things like GCW bases and NPCs inside cities could have visibilty turned on. This would force Jedi to not dominate base wars or engage in city activities unless they were willing to take the risk of pvp death.
HashiEno
Wed Sep 28, 2005 6:59 am
#26
ooh, yeah it would be nice if the moment a bh took our mission we could sense it and could then choose to seek them out as well. really turn the tables on the bh. "oh hey, look, the bh is using the bazaar terminal..." oh man, i would be willing to keep the whole system as is if only we could hunt them as well. and really, what grounds would they have to complain? they are into this sort of thing, obviously... that is, unless they are just into griefing. i guess thats a possibility too 
also, i think that as far as npc vis goes, if i kill them all, who are they reporting to anyway? but if i kill most of em and leave one alive, then i could see the authorities getting involved.