Image Designer Archive
Thread: ID Enhancements...
Voor is mad, something must be very, very wrong.
Enough said 
AudioOrgana wrote:
Remember how decay killed PvP as a game system? This will destroy stat migration.
The Needs of the Many Outweigh the Needs of the Few.
JustG said:
The stat-changes are a big issue, and we did not announce them beforehand. We chose not to announce because we anticipated a large, initial backlash, but ultimately felt that it was the best thing for the game.
Interpretation:
Yeah we knew that this would piss a lot of people off, but it will make a few people happy so its okay! 
To that I say : SCREW YOU! Im quitting this game with both of my accounts and so is my bud if normal players can no longer migrate their stats. THIS IS THE LAST STRAW! Im sick of being jerked around while you promise better things to come. I will also be attemting to convice several of my other friends to quit also. One of them happens to be the leader of a PA and a Mayor, so this has the potential to cause quite a few other people to quit as well.
Why should IDs be able to make money off something instrumental to the game? Wheres the Pistoleers special way to make money huh? We have to use the mission terminals just like everyone else and OUR profession actually entails DANGER, as well as MONEY and much more TIME invested in the same number of skill points. Sitting on your ass clicking the same button over and over with no investment or risk doesnt entitle you to be able to gouge the public for somethingweused tobe able to do on our own.
DuuRandor wrote:
The Needs of the Many Outweigh the Needs of the Few.
JustG said:
The stat-changes are a big issue, and we did not announce them beforehand. We chose not to announce because we anticipated a large, initial backlash, but ultimately felt that it was the best thing for the game.
Interpretation:
Yeah we knew that this would piss a lot of people off, but it will make a few people happy so its okay!
To that I say : SCREW YOU! Im quitting this game with both of my accounts and so is my bud if normal players can no longer migrate their stats. THIS IS THE LAST STRAW! Im sick of being jerked around while you promise better things to come. I will also be attemting to convice several of my other friends to quit also. One of them happens to be the leader of a PA and a Mayor, so this has the potential to cause quite a few other people to quit as well.
Why should IDs be able to make money off something instrumental to the game? Wheres the Pistoleers special way to make money huh? We have to use the mission terminals just like everyone else and OUR profession actually entails DANGER, as well as MONEY and much more TIME invested in the same number of skill points. Sitting on your ass clicking the same button over and over with no investment or risk doesnt entitle you to be able to gouge the public for somethingweused tobe able to do on our own.
I have a bothan as one of my two main characters, and I've been playing him since the day after launch. I'd seen three player jedi's before I found an ID that could give him the hair style I had wanted since I created him.
Admittedly, I didn't go out of my way to look for them, and I didn't know about the ID server list on this forum (it may not have existed then, I don't know when it was started), but I still think that's a pretty damning anecdote concerning the general availability of IDs.
Some people hardly ever do stat migration, but others do it a lot, and while enhancing the current system by allowing IDs to speed up the process is a great idea, removing the current system is an incredibly bad one. This is especially true given that the upcoming combat balance will undoubtedly cause many players to want to migrate their stats.
CharmingTiva wrote:
umm.. lets see here.... so.. you admit that medics are a SOLE sorce of healing?
Finally, what good is there in empowering a single, small,group of players by disempowering all the rest?
I'm not really sure where this argument is going...
Medic is a profession. If you want the ability to heal, you pay the trainer 100c and obtain the novice tag. I can add, drop, add, drop, add, drop, etc novice medic as many times as I want, so I'm not sure what the point that's trying to be made is.
I find it interesting that the Devs would make this change. It's not new content, it's just removing the functionality for 31 professions and granting exclusivity to 1.
Maybe a less extremechange would simply be to leave the system as-is, but provide a speed bonus to the ID, be it 10 minutes, 5 minutes, 1 minute, etc.
Now, I can also certainly understand what the supportersof this change are saying...and on most servers, finding an ID isn't that hard, and the migration speed benefits are great.However, the thing I believe most people are upset about is the control being taken out of their own hands, and being told that despite what the community believes it wants, this is what we (the Dev team) think you want and is best for the profession and game. And, the fact that JustG posted what he did (you know what I'm referring to) doesn't exactly charm over the masses. Anyways, this is getting long and I'm starting to babble. If you've made it this far, congrats, and thanks for reading
Okay guys... once and for all this is getting silly.
The ID forum ahs a listing of all the major ID on EACH GALAXY by GALAXY. This list grows CONSTANTLY. USE IT.
THis has been a public service message for the people who can't seem to find us.
It doesn't help that w/o customers there is very little for us to do online so we tend to wait for people to contact us.
Would you sit around all day waiting for durnis to spawn so you could shoot them? We do what we can with what we have. We cant advertise (yet) and nobody actually listens to the spammers in Starports. Besides EVERYBODY did combat professions early on (yes i know its an exageration but it sure felt that way) its taken a while for people to realize that there are other professions out there. Also WE AREN"T ALL HOLO GRINDERS!! Some of us actually enjoy this! And many do not charge set prices. IF you ask us NICELY many would probably help out for tips. I tend to help out newbie players with ID changes i will continue to help them out with stat changes. BUT only IF they ASK NICELY. This applies to everyone. And its not an idle threat to be put on an ID black list. WE do talk to each other and we CAN block people from recieving ANY ID work. Just a little something to remember.
Mind your manners, give us our due, and we will walk through hell to finish your changes.
Yell at us and you will have to walk through hell on your own with your bad haircut in tow!
GonkSevenT3 wrote:
I don't see the issue with stat migration. I mean honestly, how often do people change their stats?
Some people obviously do. You do not. Just because it's not an issue for you personally, don't assume it's not for everyone else. Some people don't care about the GCW, but that doesn't mean it's not an issue.
On top of that, why wouldn't it be an ID related function? They are personal trainers. When people look to drastically change their physical fitness in a short time they hire a personal trainer. This makes perfect sense to me and this wave of crying nerf is silly.
Well, I believe your dismissal of the problem is what is "silly". However, I agree - when looking to do so in a SHORT TIME an ID should be needed.
Since you don't seem to know much about the migration system, allow me to explain - it takes DAYS for most changes to happen now. It's not that letting ID's do it is inherently bad (though I'd rather a medical doctor do so than a beautician, but that's just me...), it's that they are eliminating the slow, gradual way at the same time. This is why people have said, heck, make it take LONGER to do by yourself now - even make it so it doesn't happen offline either. But don't take away this function which some people view as essential.
This was preferable because it wasn't a simple, one-time request - it was a dynamic system that you could experience while it happened. It was one of the most interesting, realistic things in the game. And you think it's silly that people don't want it to go away?
One argument seems to be that it's almost impossible to find and ID. Well that's because the prof is pretty useless now and only attracts a few players. With changes like they are putting in, more people may want to play ID's and it will be much easier to find them. I think this will be good for all over time after this silly backlash dies down.
This isn't going to make ID's any more useful, it's going to simple reduce the few people left who still care about HAM until someday, in the post-space future when the combat balance actually happens and buffs don't quadruple stats for people making the initial stats relatively worthless.
Until such a time as they do so, I do not see how the removal of the slow, over-time feature is necessary. Give ID's something without taking away from everyone else.
When they implemented the new harvesting droid module, imagine if they had eliminated player harvesting at the same time - the only way you could harvest is through a droid. Would people be "silly" if they disagreed with this? Same thing, different segment of players...
AO
In beta, some of the more doctory professions wanted our face and body adapting skills. We've just had the plastic surgeon title given to us at Facial IV and from a roleplay perspective I think we'll be able to pull stat migration off.
I agree with AO completely.
AudioOrgana wrote:
Personally, I don't want pink hair (though it will be nice to see some variety in others). I don't want scary holograms. I like how I look - and until we get new hairstyles, I won't likely be visiting my local ID anytime soon. What I might have paid for was an occasional "instant" stat change when I needed it (say, unexpectedly got new armor), but if you are taking the entire function out of the game needlessly - we will adapt by reducing our dependence on the system. You will not make ID's "essential" - you will make them resented.
As many have said, even INCREASE the time it takes to do it yourself - make having an ID do it the most attractive method by it's speed (we all know some people want everything five minutes ago, and those are the types who will enjoy this). But eliminating players doing so themselves entirely is a huge mistake - and so is springing it on us with no discussion.
AO
JustG wrote:
The stat-changes are a big issue, and we did not announce them beforehand. We chose not to announce because we anticipated a large, initial backlash, but ultimately felt that it was the best thing for the game. Runesabre's vision of your profession includes one absolutely critical interdependence with all other professions. Most people do not do frequent changes. We don't think you will be overloaded with requests. And you will provide a very valuable service far faster than it could have been done before!
That such a personal change would even be considered for complete removal from players is very disturbing. That it would be done regardless, and kept secret because a large backlash was expected as a result is even more disturbing. That alone should have been sufficient argument that it just wasn't a very good idea. (Granted, there are occasions when an unpopular change is necessary, but the one important question to ask before making that decision is whether or not this is an issue that's important enough to stake your credibility on. Each time you do it, you lose some of that credibility and it's very hard to earn back. Almost as hard as community good-will.)
Near instant stat migration for image designers would have been a very valuable service were it implemented to coexist with the current system. No doubt players would have made use of this service to do the initial, large changes and then tweaked as they pleased for a final result that met their needs. Instead, fine-tuning will be impossible on a practical level and players will resent this revocation of what is basic control over their own characters,probably do one last migration and just live with the results. People tend to get ornery like that when something they've always had is summarily removed.
As for Runesabre's vision, by all means please encourage him touse corrective lenses:
"I would like to enhance your class in a way that is is functionally useful to other professions (much like Chefs are functional useful to other professions) while maintaining your unique playstyle. I would like to not simply turn you into yet another buff or crafting class. It feels like you are a service oriented profession; your skills are done on other people and not simply crafted in solitude and sold on a vendor. My challenge is to create a demand for your profession in a way that is unique and fun for not only your profession but those seeking your services." - Runesabre, 02-08-04
[http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=image_designer&message.id=8990#M8990]
This is fun, how? Please don't punish the rest of the playerbase because you were either not creative enough to come up with something better, not attuned enough with the playerbase to figure out what it would considergood value from this profession, or were unwilling to expend the resources necessary to make image design highly desirable in its own right as opposed to simply assigning to it solely a not very interesting but generally unavoidable preexisting game mechanic.
Bumpinthedark wrote:
And its not an idle threat to be put on an ID black list. WE do talk to each other and we CAN block people from recieving ANY ID work. Just a little something to remember.
Great point. So if I understand correctly, players interested in stat migration will have to:
a) Find an Image Designer
b) Be able to afford the service (can't wait to see what prices are going to look like when half a dozen people ona server realize they have a total monopoly on changing stats)
c) Be nice, or get blacklisted
Next suggested stealth nerf: require a master merchant for player-to-player trades and/or use of the bazaar.
Great work dev team! /end sarcasm
And as someone else pointed out, where's the inter-dependance of Image Designers on other professions? Oh that's right... customers. An image designer has ZERO expenses... other than skill points & paying a trainer to learn the profession.
The real irony is with a half decent macro, I can master image designer in less time than a typical stat migration.
JustG wrote:
Tatoos and scars, as you are aware, fell outside of our tech budget for this round.
The only thing I would pay an ID for is too remove one of my ears and horribly disfigure my face. Seriously. Not just a scar, but huge chunks of my face are gone and burnt.
You want to make ID a profession that people like we want to seek out then put the kitties on the back burner and let them design me into weathered scoundrel.
Come on JustG! I want to wear ahelmet 90% of the time to hide my digusting visage only to unveil it to a series of ewws and ahhs with people shrieking and running from the moster in front of them.
Now THAT is Star Wars!
I have the deathmark on 12 systems!
I'm an old ARC Trooper from the Clone Wars. I barely live without my Master Doc "daughter" (read:alt) shooting me up with meds to keep me on my feet and fighting. I want to look the part.
Everyone I see looks like an extra from Melrose Place. Too many "Beautiful People". Bah, boring!