Image Designer Archive

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Phenix1050 wrote:

wow. honestly...that 200 per ent mission is awful. can't say i knew that. So I guess that's a hinderance to entertainers and ID's. But considering that new players will innevitably need stat migration/ IDing, and people changing proffessions will change stats too, I'm almost positive that you can stay in business.

another thing i think I forgot to mention: i think that you should retain your skills, even without a kit. If you have a kit, you can do more. Like you can change 50pts of stats with no help, and get a certain number of colors with no dye, but to change a lot of stats or appearences, it seems to make sense that a kit or dye should be used.

Also, seriously devs....the ID's need to be able to see how many stat's they're changing...

and btw, I'm on Eclipse...and as a Ranger, 30k seemed high for 6 minutes. Honestly, I was expecting about 10k and i was a little miffed...but now that i see that you have no way to do missions i get the prices a little more. But still just going by time...5k per minute ( i was standing in a terminal) is a bit excessive (in my humble opinion).

anyway thanks for all the *constructive* feedback.

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Hun hit a tell up to Valcyn.Terrence I'll come over to eclipse and change your stats for you hun, no charge I don't play much on that server anymore since I have an ID on Valcyn now.

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Phenix1050 wrote:

Y'know, when I originally posted this comment in the Ranger threads, I was warned that perhaps I was going to get my head forcefully seperated from the non-speaking part of my body if I posted this here. Yet all I have gotten is smart, insightful commentary and a greater respect for many image designers.

You people are as polite as the majority of the Ranger community, and I'm proud to say that the Rangers on the boards are, for the most part, the most honorable community I've posted alongside.

Makes me wonder if a few of you are just Rangers who lost their way....

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I was a ranger once long ago You'll find that Scouts/Rangers/SLs are in about the same boat as IDs/Dancers/Musicians in terms of dev attention, and that the communities are pretty like minded It just so happens that they did some things for IDs first just like they are doing things for SL first on the scout side. And, I hope you get your Ranger/scout revamp some time soon too, and that it goes a little smoother than ours has O.o

First let me say, i think its good that the entertainer professions get some updates, usually i just call them the "afk professions". As most of the people i see that is an entertainer prof they afk in a cantina while they have a macro running and only keep the prof. while hologrinding and with holos becoming obsolete there wouldnt be many left.

i think every prof need a role and something they are needed for. and its great that ID finaly get something with the stat changes.

but i honestly can see anything to justify some of the prices out there on stat changes. if you dont get to see what stats are being changed you dont really do much except wait the 10min.

The entertainer missions dont pay much ok, neither does the artisan missions in it self, the construction missions are a joke too, the survey can be good but only if you get a combat prof to and get some skill in it and you still have to run about 2000m, the survey mission might pay a little bit better for time spent, but they need money.

So what do you really need the money for? you dont need or depende on anything or anyone else, except maybe each other for not underbidding or something like that. So what are you going to use all those credits on?

Every other profession out there need money to make it, combat proffs need armor, buffs and weapons. Crafter need resources, vendor, storage and harvesters. If a rifleman has no rifle he cant hunt, if a architect has no resources he cant make anything.

And if you look at skill points spent its not like you cant get yourself another profession. or does every ID out there leave their 158 other skill points free? You say tka make alot of money so pick up tka, if you want you can still pick up survey IV and Hunting IV and if you want your own vendor and not your use bazaar or a friends vendor your could get Business III (but then you have to drop to hunt III or Survey III (gives a few m less range on survey)).

A crafter that wants to sell his stuff, needs a vendor (more skillpoints) if he want to advertise his shop he need Add tree in Merchant (more skillpoints) (ok, you can stand around in a city and spam your self, you dont need spambots or add on the map) and if you dont want to pay for all your recourses you need to suvey (more skillpoints)

As for time, do you think the hunting missions are done by them self? or the armor gather its own resources and make it self. Crafters survey, gather resouces, advertise, buy resoures and make stuff. compared to an id that just sit in a tent and scroll through the different looks and click ok

and the prof based on entertainer is the easiest ones to master.

dont get me wrong i think its great you got the stat change ability, but i think that there should be an alternative like put in the old system also, then you could either wait a few days to get their stats changed or go to an ID and get it done now. Come on now, really how many out there would sit around for days waiting for their stats to get where they want? you could even make it online time. i for one would gladly pay 10-20k for a stat change if i needed it now and not have to wait for ages. "I dont feel like hunting with buffs today so i need more hp and some action, np i just stop by my local ID and get it done", at tka novice you can (easy) solo a squill mission with some good armor if the stats are right (bet every other combat prof out there could do to as long as you dont talk about brawler or marksman, maybe they too i dont know), you just have to be care full and use some tactic and not charge the lair as if you where buffed. so if i could get that done for say 10k there shouldnt be any problem, thats just one mission and maybe 2 if you pick lower ones, then if some friends want me to come hunt with them and i need buffs i just stop by another id and get my stats to buff modus.

i just think there should be supply and demand its like that for every other prof so why not ID, atm you can hold the other profs hostage and only option today is pay the ID, reroll or get stuck with the stats you are unhappy with. every other thing such as armor weapons harvesters is as option, if you dont like the price you can still play the game and have fun but you dont have to buy it. if i got my stats tuned for buff hunting i cant do any hunting if im not buffed, and i cant change my stats back (without paying an ID and there for no hunting without paying an ID)

and about that they dont get to see the stats, its not like its hard to find em out anyway, all you have to do is target you and look at you, we all get the same amount of points to spend total. and its only the "sub stats" you can hide and my guess is that those that can get an advantage from knowing them also have a good idea what they are just by looking at your outfit/armor, and ham.(if you throw in the wep the most hardcore prob know exactly what your weakness is anyway) and imo a imp shouldnt be allowed to change a rebel anyway (he should try and kill him or get someone else to do it )

We DO need resources...

and guess what..you're it..

our resources ARE the players, without them we'd have no business and no use.

Oh please not another crafting profession... It may seem unfair, but whereas a hunter can go and hunt any time (the mission terms are there all the time aren't they?) we IDers have to wait and see if a client turns up - if no one shows, we don't get paid. I charge 15k for a stat migration, that's 1.5k per minute - if I could stat migrate for an hour, I'd be 90k richer, but that's just not how it works, there are no long queues in front of ID tents - at least not on Infinity.

Thewt

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PantJedi wrote:
We DO need resources...

and guess what..you're it..

our resources ARE the players, without them we'd have no business and no use.

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so in other words you should be paying me to change my look or change my stats after all you get xp from it and get better (if not allready master )

you dont have to do anything for your "resources" they come to you and pay you to use them

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m0rfus wrote:

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PantJedi wrote:
We DO need resources...

and guess what..you're it..

our resources ARE the players, without them we'd have no business and no use.

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so in other words you should be paying me to change my look or change my stats after all you get xp from it and get better (if not allready master )

you dont have to do anything for your "resources" they come to you and pay you to use them

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I knew this would come up..

Ok...our resources come to us, in the case of stat migration we're stuck in one of 5 places in the galaxy to do them, yes you pay us to use you as "resources" but you get the benefit of that image/stat change - at master what do we get? satisfaction at a job well done? ( i get this anyway) xp is not the point - i love my profession, but there needs to be some reason for us to do this - and the most obvious thing is monetary compensation for the time we spend


we are NOT your local stat migrating slave droids

doh....cant find a edit button

dont get me wrong i bet most ID out there take reasonable and as i said in my earlier post i think its great that ID got this ability. And i think most people do but i think what buggs players are that there is no alterantive and that some ID try and take advantage of others that are stuck with a half way stat change. on infinity i got an char that i dont play much and dont play for credits (he was going to be ch that was just about trying to find new babies and tame them ) but his stats where not what they should be so i tried to get them fixed but no ID could help me (except if i payed a lot credits for him, much more than he had) so for me the only option was to delete him and start over (yes i know i know i could have waited around doing absoulutly nothing and hoping for some nice ID to come help but with the population on that server it was easier to start over) for me that wasnt much of a prob since he was just a backup char, but for newbies that might be a big problem.

after a while when this has been in for a while everyone will think on what they do with their stats, but now there is a lot of people that is in the middle of changeing their stats and they are not good for anything and they HAVE to get them changed and when they then run into a ID that charge insane prices, the few allways make the many look bad. just think what you would think if someone did same thing to you.

Everything else out there has an alternative. you can buy or harvest your own resources, you can fight buffed/unbuffed, with good armor - with poor or ok armor wep and so on.

but when you really think about it, who except those that are just starting out or just poor who would wait sevral days to get their stats the way they want it to say a few k credits? I for one prob going to spend a lot of cred on statchange now, if i can get it done for around 10-15k until now i had a overall ham, but now i have the option to have trade mode and buff mode and all the other modes i want as long as you charge resonable prices.

and as for the lack of customers in the past was that most of you where just hologrinding (same for other entertainer based profs) in like 2-3hours probobly paying someone to click ok for you or doing it when you get the chance. i often got spammed with id changes in group from hologrinder begging me to give them some xp. but then it was just to get them xp so they could free up the skillpoints faster. now i can drop by a ID tent and get the look i want and now we know where to find you.

As most of you got other prof (if you dont got a main char on another server) so you do it while you dont wana hunt craft or whatever you do rest of the time. so its something to do while just sitting around chatting with friends or waiting for that factory to get finished or rest of the huning party to get online/arrive or something. or just to be social.

I am have to chime in on this. I was in Coronet and wondered into the ID tent to see what is new and exciting. I also wanted to see what was true and what was exaggeration from the forums. Stuff that is optional, apperance changes, were priced pretty reasonable, with my new hair cost 10k. I've tipped that much in the past for the same amount of work, so I felt that was a far price. I then asked about finishing my stat migration, a grand total of 45 points of movement, and the quoted price was 85k. I politely said no and left.

How can people justify 85k credits for a change that requires nothing more than both players time? ID is currently the highest reward vs input profession in the game. None of the following items are required to preform the skills associated with ID, it's all profit.

• No resources are required


• The tent is not even architect made, it is "given" to the players


• No crafting tools or stations are required


• No clothing is needed


• No armor is remotely needed


• No weapons are needed


• To the best of my knowledge, the tent doesn't even require the IDs to put money in it


• There are no odd prereqs. that require any of the above items.


• Travel from the city is not required, all the ID has to do is stand in the tent


• Wounds and battle fatigue are not generated while IDing


• TEFs are not generated


• No buffs/food/spice is needed


• No pets/vehicles/droids are needed


• There is no risk of dieing, therefore cloning and insurance is not needed

As you can see, all of the justifications for why people charge certian prices for their services are nonexistant in the profession. Sure, it NOW takes a long time to grind ID, but stat migration is a novice ID skill, therefore all the extra time is for the optional abilities. I am sure the bio-engineers and bounty hunters would like to have grinds that are as low risk and high profit as the current version of the ID profession. 85K credits for sitting in one spot for 10 minutes and clicking a couple of times is not what I would call a justifiable price.

The stat migration system that existed pre-patch needs to return and the IDs need to be given the ability to migrate stats in under 5 minutes. This will prevent the obvious price gouging that is going on for services that are purely profit.

Message Edited by TechBoss on 05-14-2004 07:40 AM

Eep! The Ranger suggestion thread got high-jacked!

Quickly for you two guys who are complaining about stat migrations. Please read Kwee's state of the ID profession. It is proof of my first point (below) and it has a lot of great ideas about ID craftable items and other ID stuff that would make them more dependent on other profs. I remember one thread a couple months ago that actually listed out only ideas for how IDs could become more dependent on other professions. I didn't post to it though so I can't find it again drat. Maybe someone else knows the one I am talking about?

1. Very few IDs wanted to be the only means of migrating stats. They suggested exactly what you did - that they be able to do it faster. The devs, for reasons of their own, put in the current system despite ID protests. If you read any of the pre-patch suggestion threads or the post-patch dev responses on this page you will see that. You are preaching to the choir.

2. If you found a CDEF pistol on a vendor for 85k would you run to the weaponsmith forum and tell them how they are exploiting the marksmans need for weapons by gouging? No, you would probably just go to another vendor and buy one that is more reasonably priced. Next time search for a ID who is more reasonable. Many charge 10-15k (the same as the usual musician buff). Many IDers charge a lot because it is unpleasant to sit around for 10 minutes doing nothing or trying to interact with an irritated customer who doesnt like the new system. They price like that to scare you away. And some may be just greedy.

3. Stat migration is now like hair color. You can change it in character creation or you can pay an ID to change it for you in game. It sucks because it is a nerf, but in a few months it won't seem so unreasonable. Hopefully the developers will change it so that it matches the state of the prof and your suggestion (and make the timer shorter).We can only hope.

In the meantime I add my support to the craftable items ideas. It would be my great pleasure to hunt resources for any of Radiant's Image Designers. /ponder Hmmm... I could MAKE monkey and look LESS like a monkey at the same time!

I'm just telling people what the normal prizing is and then let them decide on how much they offer. I really hate sitting around for 10 minutes doing nothing, so I st prize for only stat migration higher than stat migration WITH some other changes. I'm an Image Designer because I love the feeling of satisfaction having a customer walking away, saying something like "Woah, I look cool now!" and not because I'm in for the profit.

I don't think I would have the same fun if I had to gather supplies for my services. I'm not really into crafting and this would start to sound like it.