Game Guides Archive

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Thunderheart wrote:

The information is much appreciated

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GangaWolf wrote:

This is a basic problem with just checking the code rather than testing. It is clear from testing that armor is being reduced improperly because of an incorrectly coded mathematical equation.

It is disheartening to hear all you do is ask the Dev "does the code look right?" rather than saying "we've received hundreds of bug reports on this - I know the code looks right but let's run a quick test anyway to be 100% sure." If you had spent even 10 minutes doing this, you would have discovered what all of your playerbase - that you are choosing to ignore - already discovered.

This issue highlights how you are treating bugs TH. It just isn't right - *WE* are doing your jobs for you, testing software that obviously no one tested internally - and you still choose to ignore us. For shame, for shame.

Message Edited by GangaWolf on 05-31-2005 05:09 PM

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QFE. It's freaking software engineering 101. Users claim function x is broken. You go TEST that function in an environment approximating what the users are running in. You attempt to recreate that error, or refute their claim by PROVING it works correctly with TESTING. Instead your guy assumes that if it is broken it could only be broken cause he typed a freaking variable wrong. Sees the variable is right, and says "See No Bug". Doesn't Test. Doesn't look at the rest of the code. It boggles the mind. I wasn't even aware of this issue, but after five minutes looking at the evidence offered by PAYING CUSTOMERS it is fairly clear that the most likely culprit is an error in the formula. Why is it so easy for us to figure out, and not your paid development staff?

Want to make us happy? Give us a release that is 100% bug fixes. I mean seriously, were you really going to lose customers last week if you didn't launch multi passenger speeders? But I am pretty sure you lost customers who saw that release as another in your endless parade of releases that just did not do enough to FIX THE GAME, and decided that enough was enough.

I'd say SOE owes a nice paycheck to everyone who tested Armor Break to prove that the improved versions aren't working correctly, thereby doing the job of SOE's paid QA team.

I only skimmed (didn't read carefully) the posts in here but here is a comment on Armor Break.

When it works it is quite nice. I have an MTKA so I have only the brawler version of it. Still, I like it.

HOWEVER... I have noticed that I seem to miss an awful lot with Armor Break vs. other attacks. I tracked it the other night and I hit 5 times and missed 9 with it... that's 5/14 hits, or roughly a 35% hit rate. This was against things that were severely GREY to me.

Should a level 80 MTKA/MCH be missing 65% of the time against GREY CONS?

I know, I know, I didn't do a massive 500-hit test to see if the 65% bears out in heavy testing, but I started tracking this because I noticed, "Armor break misses a lot."

I dunno... it just seems odd that this attack would miss sooooo much more than my other attacks, which seem to hit 65% or more of the time, rather than miss that much.

C

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Thunderheart wrote:

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Boatsheets wrote:

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Thunderheart wrote:

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Shaggscoob wrote:

NOT FIRST

isn't this broken if you have the higher levels of it?

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No, this ability is working properly. It is a straight number that has been checked.

If I had an idea of what your template was, what weapon you were using, which follow up attacks you used and what your were fighting, I would be happy to look into it further.

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TH - What we are saying is if you have Armor Break you get like a 45% reduction in your target's defense.

However, once you get Improved Armor Break that percentage drops to like 25 or 30%. It should be either the other way around or the Improved Armor Break should be higher than 45%.

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I gotcha and I'm hearing you. I've spoken with the developer and looked at the code with him. The code does indeed show a higher percentage than 45%.

I'd like to work with you folks to understand how you are seeing this number so we can duplicate it internally.

(Sorry, but I haven't played a melee character since the CU yet).

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Or since you nerfed everyones ttk in PVE. Why don't you go ahead and remove the resists all together. Any particular reason a bol can resist over 1200 damage of my sniper shot?

If you would like more proof that not just armor break is broken (improved versions) go grind a jedi character with saber armor break, now respec(haha g/l with that) to improved and you do quite a bit less damage to your target than with the first tier saber armor break.

Seeing as how it's more than one debuff you added in the game, maybe it's a problem with the way the debuff is applied.

Who yo going to believe, a internal tester who doesn't want to be known for making too many mistakes (esp tues tip/friday feature), or a jedi who has killed 1000's of bols with the said ability.

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Thunderheart wrote:

The information is much appreciated

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Right... not a flame or anything, don't get me wrong... but since I've been doing my small share of /bugging issues and posting them into the appropriate feedback threads etc. I'd seriously like to know (if, of course, you are "allowed" to answer something like this in a direct manner):

What exactly happens to all those bug reports, correspondent issue threads and all the feedback?

Until TH made his appearance by posting his Tuesday Tiphe basicallysays that he wasn't aware of this problem despite the fact that the forums are flooded with bug lists and threads raising this issue. Furthermore, every correspondent who supposedly has direct communication with the developer team has brought this to their attention.

So this tells me that the only way the Devs will listen to us with our complaints on bugs and skills that are not working is for them to have a Tuesday Tip that appears to be the only thread that they read and listen. So at this rate, we shoulld havethe problems fixed in several years for the COREgame so that it canbe played as it should be. This to me is ridiculous.

TH, this is not a rant nor a complaint just a friendly but blunt, request...please save a few bucks and buy a clue. Someone should be reading the forums and listening to your correspondents. They work hard with their arms tied behind their back because they receive so little feedback from the Developers. As a result,they receive alot of misplaced abuse and flames from the community. In their minds they feel that they fail the community because they cannot respond because they have nothing to respond with. Case in pointare your Jedi and Armorsmith correspondent. This to me is failure ofcommunication from the top.

Its funny...I work in corporate america and just like in this game, crap always rolls downhill.

TH, if you really do chime in here every Tuesday because you do care, thenbecome better than what it is now. Listen to the community and provide feedback. It doesn't have to be alot. Something like "we are looking into it to see ifthis issue is indeed a bug" or "due to resource constraints, we will be looking at this at a later date. however, this is a priority for us."

Right now, the level of communication is bordering on non-existent.

Message Edited by SeraphDauthi on 05-31-2005 04:59 PM

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Thunderheart wrote:

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Hactar wrote:

Thunderheart: have you checked the numbers when both "normal" armor break and the "jedi version" of armor break are applied to the same npc?

The npc starts taking less damage

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Yes - we did check the numbers. It should be an even higher percentage than even the advanced armor break for swordsman.

Do you know what buffs you have, what you were fighting, etc?

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Ok, my most recent example. Fighting the GDK at Kimo Town POI. I am ( as always) a Mdef/MLS Jedi. My saber is 622-718, 215 elemental damage (which doesnt get applied to the mob STILL). Before using Imp. Armor Break, I was doing approx 585 damage. After the first Armor Break, this did indeed increase my damage to 800ish. However every subsequent Armor Break actually improved my damage LESS then the first, after the 2nd, 3rd, etc etc armor breaks my damage was about 717. The two attacks used were Improved Saber Head Hit, and Improved Saber Body Hit.

Other random bugs with Armor Break. Say myself and Griss (a swordsman) are both attacking a mob. If I Armor Break..and then he armor breaks or impales, the armor break debuff disappears and will not ever reapply to that mob, no matter how often we hit it with the skill.

These numbers are from last night, and I am at school right now, so cant log in and look at my combat log for exact numbers, but I am confident in this report, as I have killed that same GDK 72 times just to get the scales needed for my ris (first stack of 6 at kill 65, 2nd stack of six at 72)

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Thunderheart wrote:

I gotcha and I'm hearing you. I've spoken with the developer and looked at the code with him. The code does indeed show a higher percentage than 45%.

I'd like to work with you folks to understand how you are seeing this number so we can duplicate it internally.

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Boy o boy - forget what I said about ditching the Tuesday Tip! It's suddenly become The most

hillairious event of the whole week for me.Hopefuly something very benefitial will come of this

tho cause at least TH didn't tuck and run. He listened, came back, responded, and a big hats off to

those who responded in a positive, thorough and constructive wayhopefully there will be a

true fix to a broken skill albeit one OF MANY!!!Is it upsetting that the paying customer has to be

the one to get the job done? NO DOUBT. But hopefully this will set an example that all of the

folks can take to heart - WE ALL WANT THIS GAME TO WORK - TO BE FUN AND A RELEASE

FROM RL

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gera wrote:

It has to be (1-number you have written), not (number you have written) there. Improved Saber Armor Break is shown as reducing 60% of armor, but it just reduces armor to 60%, not 40%. Same as Basic Saber Armor Break is shown as redcuing 40% but it REDUCES armor to 40%, not 60%.

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This post summed up the problem perfectly. I would love to see this fixed. It's distubing that this bug has been reported time and time againsince the CU went live, in every bug threadI can think of, but the Devteam though that everything was A-OK.This gives me little faith that the bugs I report every day are taken seriously.

Can we hope for a new special to be featured every week (every day would be even better) so that we can point out it's problems? This would be very productive.