Force Sensitive Archive
Thread: It really sucks to be a casual gamer....
ChoNaguriai
Wed Dec 29, 2004 8:44 pm
#92
JediMasterZero wrote:
You miss my point entirely, friend. I believe that if Jedi were normalized to begin with, we wouldn't have the problems we see today. Forget what you know of Jedi in SWG as you know it. If it were a selectable profession upon character creation, this game would be 'normal'.
Jedi is not an element to be given easily to the masses. This is where our opinions diverge into opposing grounds.
Make no mistake, I have the patience and the resolve to stick through it. What I do and say here is for the benefit of future players. If we don't strive to make this game better and provide good feedback to the devs, how do you expect it will grow and continue to exist?
I didn't mean to imply that you did not have patience, if that was the impression I gave, it was not my intent. Jedi is not the problem facing SWG, content is. SOE knows about content and what it takes to make it work, the have had a lot of experience creating it in Everquest. SWG is an experiment in anti-content, seeing how long it can survive without developer intervention. The worlds are small, the number of interesting quests are limited. JTL is a great success, but a momentary flash. Once it fades they will have to turn their heads back to content development.
And SOE knows this, hence the recent announcement of new developers being hired with Lucas. SWG has three classes of players :
1) Those who could care less about Jedi. What will SOE do to retain their interest?
2) Those who want Jedi, but want it easier and faster.
3) Those who want Jedi and stick it out to get it.
Of these three groups the focus should be on #1, fix the outstanding bugs facing #3 and do something with the FRS (what a mess).
Oh, I didn't one-star ya. I thought about it, but you're entitled to your opinion just as I am.
I don't worry about One star bandits, its a passive way for people to voice their dissent. People like passive and easy things, sounds familiar :=)
You miss my point entirely, friend. I believe that if Jedi were normalized to begin with, we wouldn't have the problems we see today. Forget what you know of Jedi in SWG as you know it. If it were a selectable profession upon character creation, this game would be 'normal'.
Jedi is not an element to be given easily to the masses. This is where our opinions diverge into opposing grounds.
Make no mistake, I have the patience and the resolve to stick through it. What I do and say here is for the benefit of future players. If we don't strive to make this game better and provide good feedback to the devs, how do you expect it will grow and continue to exist?
I didn't mean to imply that you did not have patience, if that was the impression I gave, it was not my intent. Jedi is not the problem facing SWG, content is. SOE knows about content and what it takes to make it work, the have had a lot of experience creating it in Everquest. SWG is an experiment in anti-content, seeing how long it can survive without developer intervention. The worlds are small, the number of interesting quests are limited. JTL is a great success, but a momentary flash. Once it fades they will have to turn their heads back to content development.
And SOE knows this, hence the recent announcement of new developers being hired with Lucas. SWG has three classes of players :
1) Those who could care less about Jedi. What will SOE do to retain their interest?
2) Those who want Jedi, but want it easier and faster.
3) Those who want Jedi and stick it out to get it.
Of these three groups the focus should be on #1, fix the outstanding bugs facing #3 and do something with the FRS (what a mess).
Oh, I didn't one-star ya. I thought about it, but you're entitled to your opinion just as I am.
I don't worry about One star bandits, its a passive way for people to voice their dissent. People like passive and easy things, sounds familiar :=)
ChoNaguriai
Wed Dec 29, 2004 8:48 pm
#93
>Q) the devs decide to reintroduce Permadeath for ALL jedi. They also improve the bounty
>hunter skills to be able to take on and defeat a jedi knight. Would you Still play?
Just thought you would like to know, knights are defeated daily by BH/Melee combos.
>hunter skills to be able to take on and defeat a jedi knight. Would you Still play?
Just thought you would like to know, knights are defeated daily by BH/Melee combos.
branny
Wed Dec 29, 2004 9:13 pm
#94
ChoNaguriai wrote:
>Q) the devs decide to reintroduce Permadeath for ALL jedi. They also improve the bounty
>hunter skills to be able to take on and defeat a jedi knight. Would you Still play?
Just thought you would like to know, knights are defeated daily by BH/Melee combos.
r u serious here?? permadeath back in???? is it active ?
HitorikiBattousai
Wed Dec 29, 2004 9:18 pm
#95
No, just a question he stated.
branny wrote:
ChoNaguriai wrote:
>Q) the devs decide to reintroduce Permadeath for ALL jedi. They also improve the bounty
>hunter skills to be able to take on and defeat a jedi knight. Would you Still play?
Just thought you would like to know, knights are defeated daily by BH/Melee combos.
r u serious here?? permadeath back in???? is it active ?
SniperRedFox
Wed Dec 29, 2004 10:21 pm
#96
I'm not doing anything wrong, I'm trying to Master a Profession to get my last badge. I don't mind working to get to Jedi Initiate, my problem though is the fact that you have to kill those last 2 Siths to become Initiate. That is the part that I believe is too hard and shouldn't have to be done. I don't have enough credits for a full comp armor suit, I don't have enough credits to constantly pay buffers...
Like I said, i have only 150k credits now... I have a set of comp armor made of a helmet, body armor, and pants.I have a Laser Rifle and my best ability is Conceal Shot. The best free buff I can get is 2k Health and Action. I can't afford a 10k credit buff...
I was incapped about 6-10 times in the Warren in a group of 5 people. Granted, I had no buffs, but still...
The Warren was very tough for me. The only thing that got me through it was helping my buddies and getting help from them in return and working together as a group. The only thing that'd get me to Jedi Initiate is working with at least 5 other people and killing those Sith's... Some1 who can do a max damage of 1k to an NPC with only 2k of HAM himself isn't going to last long against some1 with the strength of 10k HAM let alone 50k HAM...
I'd be completely happy if they'd just remove the fact that you have to fight those very very powerful Sith's.
HitorikiBattousai
Wed Dec 29, 2004 11:26 pm
#97
SniperRedFox wrote:
I'm not doing anything wrong, I'm trying to Master a Profession to get my last badge. I don't mind working to get to Jedi Initiate, my problem though is the fact that you have to kill those last 2 Siths to become Initiate. That is the part that I believe is too hard and shouldn't have to be done. I don't have enough credits for a full comp armor suit, I don't have enough credits to constantly pay buffers...
Like I said, i have only 150k credits now... I have a set of comp armor made of a helmet, body armor, and pants.I have a Laser Rifle and my best ability is Conceal Shot. The best free buff I can get is 2k Health and Action. I can't afford a 10k credit buff...
I was incapped about 6-10 times in the Warren in a group of 5 people. Granted, I had no buffs, but still...
The Warren was very tough for me. The only thing that got me through it was helping my buddies and getting help from them in return and working together as a group. The only thing that'd get me to Jedi Initiate is working with at least 5 other people and killing those Sith's... Some1 who can do a max damage of 1k to an NPC with only 2k of HAM himself isn't going to last long against some1 with the strength of 10k HAM let alone 50k HAM...
I'd be completely happy if they'd just remove the fact that you have to fight those very very powerful Sith's.
I thought the sith to be easy...
DRWolfe
Thu Dec 30, 2004 1:09 am
#98
Wow, if I had 5-10 hours a day, I'd be a Jedi already.
You've tried Doc buffs and armor, right? Maybe some Brandy?
You've tried Doc buffs and armor, right? Maybe some Brandy?
Message Edited by DRWolfe on 12-29-2004 03:10 PM
Nohoah
Thu Dec 30, 2004 1:26 am
#99
SniperRedFox wrote:
Becoming a Jedi is hard when you have to face things as hard or harder than the Warren, it took me and my group of 5 buddies about 2-3 hours to finish the Warren, now when you have to face things that are higher than 10k HAM it is hard. I don't like being killed over and over again, I don't like failing over and over again, all that kept me going in the Warren was to help my buddies and to finish and get the badges.
Whenever you have to face something as powerful as an AT-ST (which never attacked me), 3-10 stormtroopers, a 10k HAM droid (in a Nym mission), a Mountain Squill, it gets hard.
Hmmmm, what's your profession? I was able to get these done within 2 buffs, the hardest time I had was finding the stupid NPC to give me the key to get into the place. The hardest thing for me was the Vette, but fortuntally I did it when they first introduced it to the game when everone else was doing it.
Unless I get 10 people to do that last mission to get me Jedi Initiate, i won't become a Jedi Initiate. It's just to hard and too time consuming. Grinding isn't fun, and sometimes it can be tough.
The very facts of having to worry about visibility, grinding, etc... is just overwhelming.
True the visibility being hunted thing can be overwhelming, but I am looking forward to the challenge, just gotta make sure you keep your glow stick in your pants while your infront of people and visiblity is a non-issue
I want to become a Jedi, but I just don't want to have to work very hard or long to do it.
Unfortuntally it is alot of work, getting Glowy was easy, getting through the village stuff is easy but it is work and time consuming. Once you hit Padiwan it gets to be even more work considering that your first saber is a training saber and is equilivent of a CDEF weapon, and you won't be able to kill the stuff before.
Lastly, i'm not a casual gamer, i play every day of the week, and usually for 5-10 hours every day. Yet it still takes me several days to grind boxes on some professions, and it still took me 2 months to get to having 1 badge from being glowy. You can see why I believe it's too hard, it just takes too long.
Again whats your profession? Do you get buffs? Do you wear good armor? My wife is a newbie and started playing just before Chirstmas and she is 1 box away from being a Master Doctor and then she's going to work on TKM shouldn't take her more than a week or so to get to TKM.
Jessian
Thu Dec 30, 2004 2:42 am
#100
sniperfox, you must be doing something wrong, like previous people here stating the obvious.
i came back in October 2004. and now
Force Sensitive
Enhanced Reflexes x-0-0-x
Combat Prowess x-0-x-x
Sense x-x-x-x
Novice Bounty Hunter 1-0-0-0
Novice Pistoller 1-1-3-0
master marksman
novice medic 2-0-0-0
novice scout 4-0-0-0 <- Fastest skill to improve on, aim for maskscent and head to Yavin IV. stick it on and drive around
Can we send mail to players across the different servers? if so ill send u a mail telling you what to do to go glowy.
i came back in October 2004. and now
Force Sensitive
Enhanced Reflexes x-0-0-x
Combat Prowess x-0-x-x
Sense x-x-x-x
Novice Bounty Hunter 1-0-0-0
Novice Pistoller 1-1-3-0
master marksman
novice medic 2-0-0-0
novice scout 4-0-0-0 <- Fastest skill to improve on, aim for maskscent and head to Yavin IV. stick it on and drive around
Can we send mail to players across the different servers? if so ill send u a mail telling you what to do to go glowy.
JediMasterZero
Thu Dec 30, 2004 6:27 am
#101
HitorikiBattousai wrote:
Sorry if I upset you, i'm speaking my mind a bit, didn't mean to flame anyone but that Koev (sp?) guy/girl for what he said to Zero, zero had an opinion and koev was outta line flaming it.
Thank you for defending me, friend. No big surprise, but Kovev TOTALLY missed my point. He/she read 1 sentence of my post and went to town from there.
Kovev, I'm not gonna flame you. Just do me a favor and read all my posts in this thread. Some of the more recent ones will help you get a better grasp on what I'm asking for. That's all I'm saying. You clearly missed the points I was trying to make.
And, again (I repeat myself) I'm not necessarily asking for any changes for my own benefit. If all goes well, I should be at my Padawan trials within a week or two.I'm asking for changes for the better interests of the SWGcommunity and the longevity of the game. My point was that making Jedi the 'game-winning' goal was wrong. There are inifinite numbers of possibilities that the devs could have chosen from to make as the end-game goal, or something players work towards, yet they did not. That is what I'm saying, and I believe that to be a serious error in their decision making process, and consequently a serious flaw of the game.
What I have said has taken nothing away from Jedi and you(and in all likelihood will not take anything from Jedi). I understand that Kovev is defensive of his/her given profession, but I'm not calling for any kind of nerf. It's more akin to crying over spilled milk. What I ask for is near impossible...an almost entirely fresh start of the game as far as professions are concerned.
And I think I know far more about the Jedi profession than you give me credit for. I know it is beyond most people's comprehension of "time consuming". And I still think it should be very difficult to attain a strong Jedi character, but there are different means to do that which would NOT require a grind. That is one of my points, which I felt I should address since you brought up the issue of experience. I do not call for giving away free credits and free experience for soon to be Jedi...I'm just stunned that you could even infer that from any of my posts, honestly.
Do I think anything will come from all of our posts here? Not really. I'm a realist - I know what's possible and what's not. But do not expect me to justlay down and die when I think something could be fixed. Perhaps some good can come out of this. If not for us, then perhaps for the future player base of SWG.
DRWolfe
Thu Dec 30, 2004 7:22 am
#102
Drygo wrote:
DRWolfe wrote:
I believe that the Devs intended people to get Jedi just by "playing the game", converting XP they gained along the way, but they were quite naive. With the goal being Jedi and, the XP requirements being so high, and gamers being the way they are, it was inevitable that this became a grind.Actually, I think the devs knew that people would react *exactly* the way they have and that's why the xp requirements are so high. I believe the Devs would absolutely *love* for people to get Jedi just by playing the game and would have loved to create a system that allowed this. But, they knew they wouldn't be able to because people still want to get it as quickly as possible and will want to grind. No matter what the devs did, the majority of Jedi chases would seek out the shortest route possible, whether it meant posting guides and following them to the letter, changing their template so they could do it afk (entertaining), or the fastest (commando). They may not have known that these would be the exact Jedi chaser templates. However, I am sure they were fully aware that people would try to find some way to do it as quickly as possible. And, I believe that's exactly why they chose a gating and a grind system that would take a long time. If MMORPG players had shown by example in this game and others that they were willing to just enjoy the game and play it for rewards, I have no doubt that the system would be a lot easier. I'm sure the devs would have liked it to be that way.
No, they really did intended it to be done along the way. Originally on Test Center, the ratios were 10:1 Weapons and 1:1 Combat. That would have allowed people to get Jedi simply by playing the Game. Then the TC people went at it like crazy and the Devs saw how quickly people were progressing because they weren't just playing, but grinding. That's when they bumped the ratios to 30:1 and 3:1.
They really didn't forsee the grinding, and then when they saw it happening, their solution was to just bump the ratios so that now it would be impossible to get Jedi just by playing and not grinding.
JediMasterZero
Thu Dec 30, 2004 7:25 am
#103
That, I did not know.
DRWolfe wrote:
No, they really did intended it to be done along the way. Originally on Test Center, the ratios were 10:1 Weapons and 1:1 Combat. That would have allowed people to get Jedi simply by playing the Game. Then the TC people went at it like crazy and the Devs saw how quickly people were progressing because they weren't just playing, but grinding. That's when they bumped the ratios to 30:1 and 3:1.
They really didn't forsee the grinding, and then when they saw it happening, their solution was to just bump the ratios so that now it would be impossible to get Jedi just by playing and not grinding.
Nohoah
Thu Dec 30, 2004 7:42 am
#104
SniperRedFox wrote:
I'd like to know what ever happened to the ability to select Easy, Medium and Hard modes for video games in recent years... It seems video games have gone to be more oriented for people who like working hard and who like a challenge than for people who want things to be easy.
Ummm Star Wars Galalixes isn't like a 'normal' game, it's a MMORPG, If your looking for something 'easy' where you don't have to do any work go load up Halo on your XBOX or your PC and choose easy, heck I think Fable had an 'easy' mode, not sure.
I'm not some1 who likes a challenge, of course that is obvious. I have fun just by playing a game, not by having to work hard to accomplish things in a game.
Hate to tell ya but I dont think Star Wars Galaxies is for you then
Also, stop complaining about the developers of SWG, for one, you have it a lot better off than other games out there. Another, if you don't like it, leave.
If you don't like the devs of SWG, go check out WWIIOL and you will begin to see the devs here as being wonderful compared to the devs @ WWIIOL...